What is up with FPN?

[KrazyIvan]

About this time last year, I had a handwritten post simply titled, "Good Words" on FPN.
It had received, I would say, mostly favorable comments, but because the post had a "religious" element, a few members took exception to it, and cited the "prohibited topics" clause in the Chatter Forum.
Now, I was never really contacted by anyone from FPN Admin regarding the post, but a couple of members who I guess considered themselves "the thought police" gave their opinion, and in MY opinion needlessly started arguing with those who defended me.
Anyway, I just got so annoyed by the whole thing, I took down ALL my handwritten posts from photobucket just for spite - which I sort of regretted. But after I got to cool down a bit, I started handwritten posts again - in earnest. Right now, I have over 1,400 images in photobucket I could just delete...blip...and all gone from FPN. But I won't, because others just might find them helpful - if FPN ever gets running again (and it would just just take too much of my time). I will not be doing any significant posting there anymore either, I feel like my work there is done..off to greener pastures.
Thanks for having me here.

http://www.fountainpennetwork.com/fo.../#entry2268081

Truly a sad day.

[Manny]

Truly a sad day.

[kaisnowbird]

A handwritten post conveys so much more ...

[Pendragon]

Well, at least I won't have to deal with FPN's inane nonsense anymore. I permanently deactivated my account.

1. Change email address to an invalid one or a real one that cannot be accessed.

2. Type in a string of random garbage characters in a text editor.

3. Cut-and-paste into the new password and new password confirmation boxes.

4. Close the text editor.

Voila, account deactivated!

It might seem trivial, but I don't want to be associated with a place where others are mistreated. Some great people and informative content remain, but the undercurrent of tension and discord caused by the ongoing shenanigans made being there pointless.

Oh well, that's the way the cookie crumbles. The fountain pen world is much bigger than one forum, as recent events have demonstrated. Dozens, perhaps hundreds, of blogs drive the fountain pen hobby, along with Fountain Pen Geeks, Fountain Pen Board, and even Fountain Pen Community. May all involved write and collect happily ever after!

[Pendragon]

A handwritten post conveys so much more ...

Especially when someone stands up and is counted, and in the process sets themselves free. And in such beautiful handwriting!

Manny, I could only give you one thank for each of those posts. You deserve a thousand.

[Tony Rex]

Sad indeed.

I saw a Waterman Le Man 100 bicentennial of French Revolution that's currently advertised there. Googled into the matter from our perspectives, and found this article why-on-earth-did-french-revolutionaries-persecute-and-murder-enclosed-nuns/

Then I read Manny's sad story. Same old same old.

Don't get me wrong, I like Man 100... I have two and one is a Patrician.... But I hate that pen...

[Pterodactylus]

(Pelikan 400NN Brown Tortoise - F ..... Sailor Jentle Sky High)

[aschup]

I'm confused, was GClef moderated or silenced somehow? It seems like another member pointed out the (obviously) religious connotation of "achiev[ing] His grace," then said as much. What exactly is "sad" about what happened in that thread?

[Sailor Kenshin]

(Why not post the sentiment) 'Without the need for religious connotation?' (From That Other Forum)

Whoa....

Where do they think that sentiment comes from anyway? Even apart from the mass bannings, this debacle might be the most disturbing of all.

[Tony Rex]

There's a whole thread full of Freemasonry there in Chatter. I'm practicing Catholic labeled 'extreme right' persuasions by outsiders from outside and inside. In short.. We don't exactly see eye to eye with freemasonry. That said...

Would I want that thread to be locked? No. I just look away and be nice to ppl I don't agree with on some things, but share a LOT of common good in other things. Currently, ppl are dying on the streets of Bangladesh from clashes with riot police because extremists want to reenact blasphemy law, like in Pakistan and other country... to be exploited to persecute minority by the whatever-militant-of-whatever-agenda. I refuse to be that militant, but apparently not so those who dobbed Manny. Not nice.

The true anarchist loves his brother according to the new law, ready to die rather than compel his brother to go his totalitarian way, no matter how convinced his way is the only way. -- Dorothy Day

[ethernautrix]

I'm confused, was GClef moderated or silenced somehow? It seems like another member pointed out the (obviously) religious connotation of "achiev[ing] His grace," then said as much. What exactly is "sad" about what happened in that thread?

Me, I prefer reading, maybe participating in, discussions about religious and other beliefs (when pressed, I say I'm Buddhist, cos people seem calmer about that than when I say atheist), so I found it sad that those topics were banned after The Great Chatter Debacle of 2009 (or 2010, can't remember).

But those were the rules. I still played in the FPN sandbox, but I was sorry to see the spirited (ha!) discussions put out.

[drgoretex]

There's a whole thread full of Freemasonry there in Chatter. I'm practicing Catholic labeled 'extreme right' persuasions by outsiders from outside and inside. In short.. We don't exactly see eye to eye with freemasonry. That said...

Would I want that thread to be locked? No. I just look away and be nice to ppl I don't agree with on some things, but share a LOT of common good in other things. Currently, ppl are dying on the streets of Bangladesh from clashes with riot police because extremists want to reenact blasphemy law, like in Pakistan and other country... to be exploited to persecute minority by the whatever-militant-of-whatever-agenda. I refuse to be that militant, but apparently not so those who dobbed Manny. Not nice.

The true anarchist loves his brother according to the new law, ready to die rather than compel his brother to go his totalitarian way, no matter how convinced his way is the only way. -- Dorothy Day

Herein lies the ridiculous hypocrisy of 'extreme political correctness' - It seems that in the this current clime, all bigotry is bad, and must be loudly and publicly shamed. However, bigotry against certain groups/creeds/genders/nationalities/foot size/hairiness/whatever is till OK, as long as that particular group is in the general population's (media's?) 'bad book'.

Ken

[JustinJ]

I'm confused, was GClef moderated or silenced somehow? It seems like another member pointed out the (obviously) religious connotation of "achiev[ing] His grace," then said as much. What exactly is "sad" about what happened in that thread?

Me, I prefer reading, maybe participating in, discussions about religious and other beliefs (when pressed, I say I'm Buddhist, cos people seem calmer about that than when I say atheist), so I found it sad that those topics were banned after The Great Chatter Debacle of 2009 (or 2010, can't remember).

But those were the rules. I still played in the FPN sandbox, but I was sorry to see the spirited (ha!) discussions put out.

I am also an atheist but do not tell people. Usually, someone will judge you much harsher if you tell them you're an atheist. I just started incorporating meditation in my life and find it very helpful. I would not call myself a Buddhist but do like some of the aspects of their philosophy, especially the idea of holding on to things which causes suffering. The idea of being present is very powerful at least in my life.

I have no problems with people being religious. Different people have different ways of viewing life. Who am I to tell them what to believe?

[Pterodactylus]

In general for me excluding any kind of religious or political discussion out of a pen board makes sense for me, is important and I support this.

There are much too many extremists religious and political out there.
The potential of disastrous troubles such discussions can cause, especially when people from all over the world participate are not worth it. They also can't add any value to our hobby.
It only has the potential to split people and destroy a community.

Most people in history (and also these days) were killed out of religious motivations.
Personally I think the world would be a better place without any religion (Just as a personal statement, I don't want to discuss this)

[david i]

In general for me excluding any kind of religious or political discussion out of a pen board makes sense for me, is important and I support this.

FPN's Political Correctness would appear to be a quite evil bigotry...

Just sayin'...

regards

david

[david i]

Too, let's not forget the hypocrisy shown at FPN regarding religion.

regards

david

[Jon Szanto]

In general for me excluding any kind of religious or political discussion out of a pen board makes sense for me, is important and I support this.

I don't, and here is why:

I have found, in the community of people that come together over the topic of "Fountain Pens", an incredible variety of personalities. From all walks of life, from many economic strata, widely variant life-stories, and the entire rest of the panorama of human experience. As I come to know these people, when the occasional sentence or two that *isn't* restricted to a nib tweak or sac change pops up, I start seeing other aspects of that person.

To restrict a community experience to the (comparatively) dry, dull, and mundane aspect of a single subject is to reduce the vibrancy of the experience. I consider myself adult enough to avoid topics I'd rather not be involved with, am not above using an Ignore function on a person or thread to bolster my behavior, and as relationships flourish, and I begin to know the breadth of the person who holds that pen, the colorful life behind the person with the rainbow of ink swabs, I grow. I feel fulfilled. My life is enriched.

I don't appreciate, nor understand, those who would restrict the widest possible experience of lives around us.

[Deb]

In general for me excluding any kind of religious or political discussion out of a pen board makes sense for me, is important and I support this.

There are much too many extremists religious and political out there.
The potential of disastrous troubles such discussions can cause, especially when people from all over the world participate are not worth it. They also can't add any value to our hobby.
It only has the potential to split people and destroy a community.

I agree with that. There are, after all, plenty of places on the internet designed for religious or political discussion. There are rather fewer places for fountain pen discussion. Also, it's worth trying to learn a little from history. It was politics that destroyed Lion & Pen. Any other pen group that gets too far into these contentious issues is likely to go the same way.

[Pendragon]

In general for me excluding any kind of religious or political discussion out of a pen board makes sense for me, is important and I support this.

Many, perhaps most, forums have this rule in place. The same is true for certain offline discussion groups. It is one thing if such a policy is in place from the beginning. It is quite another if religious and political discussion is allowed for years and then forbidden. The former seems to attract scant controversy, while the latter can cause an uproar.

Most people in history (and also these days) were killed out of religious motivations.

To what statistics are you referring when making that claim?

Personally I think the world would be a better place without any religion (Just as a personal statement, I don't want to discuss this)

You can come back to this thread some time from now and your post will still be here. Could the same be said if you made that statement on a certain other forum?

[david i]

Many, perhaps most, forums have this rule in place. The same is true for certain offline discussion groups. It is one thing if such a policy is in place from the beginning. It is quite another if religious and political discussion is allowed for years and then forbidden. The former seems to attract scant controversy, while the latter can cause an uproar.

Most people in history (and also these days) were killed out of religious motivations.

To what statistics are you referring when making that claim?

Personally I think the world would be a better place without any religion (Just as a personal statement, I don't want to discuss this)

You can come back to this thread some time from now and your post will still be here. Could the same be said if you made that statement on a certain other forum?

Good post

Interestingly, more Genocide Deaths were done last century by the non-religious or anti-religion factions than by religious.

Too, there is a straw man element of "people fight over religion". People who covet property and people who fear difference use excuses to do what they will do anyway. This hardly proves that the religion was the motivation.

One always must be cautious not to confuse "excuse" for "motivation".

Too, regarding FPN, perhaps worse than at first not having a religion-hatred policy and then later implementing it, is having a capricious and selective policy. It is ok for the moderators to ask for your prayers and also ok for the moderators to remove your post on basis of religion.

regards

david