Underrated inks

[reprieve]

Yesterday I found a bottle of Lamy Blue in the bottom drawer of my desk, sadly neglected and gathering dust. I thought, "I don't really like Lamy Blue. It's boring." But I hadn't used it in so long that I couldn't remember exactly what it looked like or how it behaved.

I had a pen in need of inking, a red Pelikan M600 with an extra-fine nib, and so I filled it with Lamy Blue and started writing. Wow! This is a bright, rich royal blue. There's a subtle hint of purple. There's shading. It doesn't feather on cheap paper. This particular Pelikan nib writes extremely wet and wide, more like a thick fine or borderline medium nib, and so I didn't expect to be able to write on anything other than my usual Rhodia, Clairefontaine, and Tomoe River. I was pleasantly surprised when I started making annotations on low-quality copy paper without any feathering or bleed-through issues.

I rarely come across praise for Lamy Blue. Most comments I've read reflect my initial reaction: it's boring, it's a standard blue, it's nothing special. There's no hype surrounding Lamy Blue. Despite its mediocrity, after giving this ink a second chance, I've fallen in love with it. It's so well-behaved. It's actually really pretty. It's underrated.

What are your favorite underrated inks? Did you have to rediscover them before coming to appreciate them?

[Laura N]

^^ I totally agree with you reprieve.

I can't say too much, for fear of wrecking future installments of Mystery Ink, but I would nominate Parker Quink Blue. Just like Lamy Blue, people online dislike the color, but I really like both the color and the behavior. Definitely underrated, in my opinion.

The old-line blues all are, to me, attractive. In addition they are easy to clean, rarely bleed or feather and rarely have flow problems. But they are so well-known and conventional, I guess that makes them "boring." And I get it, because I love to try new inks, too. But if you used Lamy Blue and said it was the newest XYZ brand only available in Japan, I wonder if people would line up to buy it for three times the price. :)

[Cob]

Lamy's blue-black is very good too. Do NOT buy Parker blue-black, unless you happen to be looking for sea-green. I made a fuss about mine and Parker sent me another bottle; it was the same...

Cob

[migo984]

The trouble with Lamy Blue & Parker Quink Blue, is that their vibrancy is short-lived. After 2 - 4 days both are flat-toned & faded, on every paper I've used.

[Laura N]

The trouble with Lamy Blue & Parker Quink Blue, is that their vibrancy is short-lived. After 2 - 4 days both are flat-toned & faded, on every paper I've used.

Yeah, lots of people say that. I hear that about Quink BB and Waterman Blue and Blue Black, too. And there is definitely something to it, since so many people say it, but it doesn't bother me. Truthfully, I don't mind a flatter ink or a lighter color -- or, Cob, even a greenish blue black. :) I find colors like that easy on the eye, especially when I'm writing page after page. Obviously I'm in the minority in liking the less vivid colors, but there's something calming about them, to me, and over time I find I go back to them again and again.

I think maybe reprieve was also talking about how well-behaved these inks are, and how that's an under-appreciated virtue. And I agree there, too. I've been testing out a lot of new inks lately, many of which were very saturated, which does require a lot more cleaning. I actually enjoyed inking up a basic boring standard blue after that. :)

Anyway, whenever these discussions come up, I always think how lucky we are to have so very many different inks out there. Because I like them all, the saturated and the bland, the boutique and the old-line. It's nice to see someone draw attention to the ones we rarely discuss.

[Cob]

The trouble with Lamy Blue & Parker Quink Blue, is that their vibrancy is short-lived. After 2 - 4 days both are flat-toned & faded, on every paper I've used.

Yeah, lots of people say that. I hear that about Quink BB and Waterman Blue and Blue Black, too. And there is definitely something to it, since so many people say it, but it doesn't bother me. Truthfully, I don't mind a flatter ink or a lighter color -- or, Cob, even a greenish blue black. :) I find colors like that easy on the eye, especially when I'm writing page after page. Obviously I'm in the minority in liking the less vivid colors, but there's something calming about them, to me, and over time I find I go back to them again and again.

I think maybe reprieve was also talking about how well-behaved these inks are, and how that's an under-appreciated virtue. And I agree there, too. I've been testing out a lot of new inks lately, many of which were very saturated, which does require a lot more cleaning. I actually enjoyed inking up a basic boring standard blue after that. :)

Anyway, whenever these discussions come up, I always think how lucky we are to have so very many different inks out there. Because I like them all, the saturated and the bland, the boutique and the old-line. It's nice to see someone draw attention to the ones we rarely discuss.

Yes fair points Laura, but I insist that an ink should "do what it says on the tin" and Parker's blue-black faills in this regard. I don't like blue ink generally though I was given some Bleu Azur (same bottle shape as Diamine Anniversary) that comes form France, and this one is really rather good.

Cob

[Laura N]

The trouble with Lamy Blue & Parker Quink Blue, is that their vibrancy is short-lived. After 2 - 4 days both are flat-toned & faded, on every paper I've used.

Yeah, lots of people say that. I hear that about Quink BB and Waterman Blue and Blue Black, too. And there is definitely something to it, since so many people say it, but it doesn't bother me. Truthfully, I don't mind a flatter ink or a lighter color -- or, Cob, even a greenish blue black. :) I find colors like that easy on the eye, especially when I'm writing page after page. Obviously I'm in the minority in liking the less vivid colors, but there's something calming about them, to me, and over time I find I go back to them again and again.

I think maybe reprieve was also talking about how well-behaved these inks are, and how that's an under-appreciated virtue. And I agree there, too. I've been testing out a lot of new inks lately, many of which were very saturated, which does require a lot more cleaning. I actually enjoyed inking up a basic boring standard blue after that. :)

Anyway, whenever these discussions come up, I always think how lucky we are to have so very many different inks out there. Because I like them all, the saturated and the bland, the boutique and the old-line. It's nice to see someone draw attention to the ones we rarely discuss.

Yes fair points Laura, but I insist that an ink should "do what it says on the tin" and Parker's blue-black faills in this regard. I don't like blue ink generally though I was given some Bleu Azur (same bottle shape as Diamine Anniversary) that comes form France, and this one is really rather good.

Cob

Yes, that makes perfect sense. Kind of a truth in advertising thing. Plus, I cheerfully admit that I'm the outlier on this, as well as in not minding lighter colored blues. Part of it may be that I love blue inks, so the more variety the better for me. But I see how the color change would bother others.

BTW, when the fade-to-green of Quink Blue Black starts to bother me, I add a drop or two of Skrip Red to the fill. That keeps it blue black, and makes it a tiny bit darker, too. If you still have your Quink.

[Lady Onogaro]

Lamy's blue-black is very good too. Do NOT buy Parker blue-black, unless you happen to be looking for sea-green. I made a fuss about mine and Parker sent me another bottle; it was the same...

Cob

I like Lamy Blue-Black, but I had a very weird thing happen (perhaps it is my own fault or inexperience), but I found that if you leave it too long, it sort of separates and just becomes a black sludge on the bottom of the bottle.

[Cob]

The trouble with Lamy Blue & Parker Quink Blue, is that their vibrancy is short-lived. After 2 - 4 days both are flat-toned & faded, on every paper I've used.

Yeah, lots of people say that. I hear that about Quink BB and Waterman Blue and Blue Black, too. And there is definitely something to it, since so many people say it, but it doesn't bother me. Truthfully, I don't mind a flatter ink or a lighter color -- or, Cob, even a greenish blue black. :) I find colors like that easy on the eye, especially when I'm writing page after page. Obviously I'm in the minority in liking the less vivid colors, but there's something calming about them, to me, and over time I find I go back to them again and again.

I think maybe reprieve was also talking about how well-behaved these inks are, and how that's an under-appreciated virtue. And I agree there, too. I've been testing out a lot of new inks lately, many of which were very saturated, which does require a lot more cleaning. I actually enjoyed inking up a basic boring standard blue after that. :)

Anyway, whenever these discussions come up, I always think how lucky we are to have so very many different inks out there. Because I like them all, the saturated and the bland, the boutique and the old-line. It's nice to see someone draw attention to the ones we rarely discuss.

Yes fair points Laura, but I insist that an ink should "do what it says on the tin" and Parker's blue-black faills in this regard. I don't like blue ink generally though I was given some Bleu Azur (same bottle shape as Diamine Anniversary) that comes form France, and this one is really rather good.

Cob

Yes, that makes perfect sense. Kind of a truth in advertising thing. Plus, I cheerfully admit that I'm the outlier on this, as well as in not minding lighter colored blues. Part of it may be that I love blue inks, so the more variety the better for me. But I see how the color change would bother others.

BTW, when the fade-to-green of Quink Blue Black starts to bother me, I add a drop or two of Skrip Red to the fill. That keeps it blue black, and makes it a tiny bit darker, too. If you still have your Quink.

Well I would have no objection of they called it Teal or Sea-Green but they don't! I just use it for testing pens I have repaired and then it gets chucked away - I hate it.

And I have a lot to learn about colours - you add RED? AMazing I would exxpect to get a greeny purple with that mix!

Thanks

Cob

[Chrissy]

Adding red doesn't always behave as you think it might.

I have mixed some interesting colours by adding red to my pigments when I need to paint ceramics

[reprieve]

I can't say too much, for fear of wrecking future installments of Mystery Ink, but I would nominate Parker Quink Blue.

It was your brilliant Mystery Ink idea that spurred me to think about all of the inks I had previously dismissed for whatever reason(s). :)

I tried to approach Lamy Blue with the same open mind with which I approached Mystery Ink #1 (aka Diamine Tropical Green), and I discovered--and surprised myself in the process--that I do in fact like Lamy Blue! Migo is right: it does fade somewhat after a couple of days, but that doesn't bother me so much because it's still readable and it's still so well-behaved.

Parker Quink Blue and Blue-black are two inks that I tried several years ago when I first got into fountain pens. I dismissed them pretty quickly. Montblanc Royal Blue, Lamy Green, Diamine Imperial Purple, Waterman Florida Blue, and Pelikan Brilliant Brown all pop into my mind as well. I think I still have a bottle of Montblanc Royal Blue around here somewhere, which I plan to revisit next.

[Sailor Kenshin]

I love Lamy blue! it's cheerful and happy. I also really like the blue-black Hero ink carts that came with my Hero 359s; I keep using them.

[klpeabody]

I recently tried one of the LAMY blue cartridges that I've had kicking around here, and it surprised me. It went down a very vibrant, and cheery blue with the requisite darkness that I like in prefer in a blue ink. I had the same reaction as Reprieve, and thought LAMY blue was worth another look.

[carlos.q]

Another underrated ink is Sheaffer Skrip. I have used black, blue-black and purple and find them to be nice inks with good flow and are very well behaved. :thumb:

[reprieve]

Another underrated ink is Sheaffer Skrip. I have used black, blue-black and purple and find them to be nice inks with good flow and are very well behaved. :thumb:

I've used Skrip Red quite a bit and it's a very nice true red. Turquoise is pretty, though I've only tried a sample. I've not paid much attention to the other current Sheaffer colors but will have to consider them.

[Laura N]

The thing that opened my eyes to Lamy Blue was getting a letter from a penpal this fall. He had written with a Lamy Blue cartridge to use it up. But when I got the letter, probably 10 days later, it was such an attractive color to me that I immediately put it in a pen of my own. His looked better, but I put that down mostly to his beautiful handwriting. :)

[The Good Captain]

And how about Pelikan 4001 Royal Blue/Konigsblau? Or the R&K Konigsblau? Great inks and probably passed over by many of us.

[reprieve]

And how about Pelikan 4001 Royal Blue/Konigsblau? Or the R&K Konigsblau? Great inks and probably passed over by many of us.

Yes! I had a bottle of Pelikan 4001 Blue years ago and gave it away; I'd like to revisit it now. I once tried a sample of R&K Königsblau and liked the color well enough but never committed to a bottle.


What about Omas inks? I have bottles of Omas Sepia, Grey, Blue, and Red, but I haven't used them much (they came with pens).

[Neo]

Reprieve, It's not a bright red, leaning more to pink. If you have the OMAS bottles already, why not try them out?

[reprieve]

Reprieve, It's not a bright red, leaning more to pink. If you have the OMAS bottles already, why not try them out?

I suppose my point was that the ink arrived boxed with pens, I stuck the Omas bottles in a drawer, and I never really used any of the inks because they weren't "exciting." They weren't the latest Sailor Kobe ink or the limited-edition-something-or-other-that-sheens-and-sparkles-like-crazy. I wonder if Omas ink isn't dismissed quite unfairly, like Lamy or Pelikan 4001 or Sheaffer Skrip.

But yes, I plan to try them out soon. I'm slowly reevaluating my ink collection. I'm trying to approach the inks I already have with an open mind, to reassess what *I* personally like in an ink--rather than being unduly influenced by marketing hype or online reviews, rather than constantly searching for the newest best thing. :)

[Laura N]

I'm slowly reevaluating my ink collection. I'm trying to approach the inks I already have with an open mind, to reassess what *I* personally like in an ink--rather than being unduly influenced by marketing hype or online reviews, rather than constantly searching for the newest best thing. :)

+1

I can't name names, darn Mystery Ink, but I had this experience a year or so ago when I bought a very nice, very hyped, very expensive ink -- that I still enjoy -- and realized it wasn't that much different from a very nice, very unhyped (to the point of dismissal), very inexpensive ink. Further, boring old underrated ink cleaned up more easily. There was a slight difference between them, but it wasn't so much that anyone else would probably notice.

I actually wrote about this recently in a letter to someone -- no matter what the hobby or interest, there can be a downside in too much focus on the best, or the newest, or any kind of connoisseurship. I mentioned a relative of mine who got into tea so deeply that she couldn't enjoy a cup at a restaurant because it was served in a teabag rather than brewed loose leaf. I know people who like the quality of their medium format cameras so much they don't like taking snaps with a 35mm (or digital).

I take a lot of photos with my phone; I've just transferred that to inks. :) Good enough sometimes equals darn good.

[jde]

And how about Pelikan 4001 Royal Blue/Konigsblau? Or the R&K Konigsblau? Great inks and probably passed over by many of us.

+1 here for the Pelikan ink. The Royal Blue is the ink I may return to if Pilot Blue-Black ceases to be available.

There really are only two inks in the blue family I've found kinda boring even for me. I say that because unlike so many of you, I'm more utilitarian (and economical) user than not. I do have some color in the ink drawer for special cards or notes, and for pen pals who tire of my pedestrian Pilot B-B.

I stopped following the ink herd some time ago. :)

Edited to add: What I love about what reprieve has raised in this thread is the idea that we might change our minds about given inks, or that our tastes may have changed to include inks we earlier dismissed. That's similar to the idea of the mystery ink: how open minded can we be?

I've spent a lot of time figuring out what inks, pens, papers work best for me. I personally draw a line at a certain price point, but the Sailor inks I choose for color are not inexpensive, nor low maintenance. At the same time, they do not cost as much as some others.

What I do know is that if at some time in the future, these inks become unavailable to me for whatever reasons (a sudden embargo, some disaster, or I can't afford them), I'll find other inks to return to. They may not have all the qualities I've come to like or want in a ink, but that future is unknown to me now.

[migo984]

I have a lot of inks, ranging from the most inexpensive to very pricey inks. I've used them all & IMO cheap inks are cheap for a reason. You get what you pay for (but excluding L.E. inks by the big brands, which are often disappointing). It's nothing to do with fashion, fads or hype. My favourite ink(s) are not the most expensive, but are far from the economy end. I can use a rollerball if I just want utilitarian, generic & easily maintained.

[Avalona]

And how about Pelikan 4001 Royal Blue/Konigsblau? Or the R&K Konigsblau? Great inks and probably passed over by many of us.

I love both shades of Konigsblau! I've currently got a bottle of R&K's, though when I finish that one, I may get the Pelikan kind (I've used the cartridges quite a bit). They're both very nice blues, and they mix quite well together (I once topped off a cartridge of Pelikan with R&K and couldn't tell where one ended and the other began).

[VertOlive]

Two inks that surprised and delighted me:

DeAtramentis' "Maron", a rich mahogany brown.

DeAtramentis' "Sherlock Holmes", a dark,slightly ashen blue.

[Jon Szanto]

Haven't seen it mentioned: Namiki Blue. Benign in the looks department, not expensive, and water resistant to boot. You could do worse - I have.

[Lady Onogaro]

Two inks that surprised and delighted me:

DeAtramentis' "Maron", a rich mahogany brown.

DeAtramentis' "Sherlock Holmes", a dark,slightly ashen blue.

I haven't tried "Maron," but I use "Sherlock Holmes" all the time. I really like it.

I'm usually not one for reds, but I tried De Atramentis' "Arthur Conan Doyle," and I really like that, too (enough to buy a bottle).

I also like Waterman's "Mysterious Blue" quite a lot, and Private Reserve "Daphne Blue."

[mhosea]

Responding to nobody in particular...I'm not sure I would concede that an ink is "underrated" simply because it happens to be a good ink and isn't celebrated. Lamy Blue is "underrated", I think, because people actively think it is a pale purple-blue, which it often seems to be when one pops in the cartridge that comes with a Lamy Safari. A sample or a bottle combined with a wet-writing pen and good paper tells a different tale...at least for awhile until it kind of fades in. But a lot of inks are just good inks that nobody complains about and nobody celebrates. They aren't therefore "underrated". Sheaffer Skrip Red (Slovenia) is a good ink, a bright red that doesn't lean towards the orange or the pink noticeably. There's nothing wrong with it. It's a little less lubricious than most of its competitors in my cabinet, and one or two of my reds have better water resistance, but it's a worthy ink. And yet, I'm not moved to celebrate it, particularly since I actually choose to use it very seldom. This is important because I'm not trying make any points or to do anything. It's just a situation where I have a pen and a dozen "red" inks to choose from, and I just choose. I'm pretty sure it's the step down in lubrication that makes me bounce off to something else when I consider it. But the performance otherwise, the color, and the appearance on the page, both immediately and days later, is nice. There's nothing wrong with it.

I use a couple of inks that I suspect I like better than the average person out there. One is Diamine Royal Blue. OK, so it's not Baystate Blue vibrant, but it's a bright blue that doesn't lean too much towards either green or purple. Another is J. Herbin 1670 Bleu Ocean. Sure, the color is a bit dull, and there is no sheen, no sparkly bits, but once you get over your disappointment that it doesn't have silver glitter in it, you might happen to notice that its performance is top tier, and it's not that dull if you think of it as being in the dark blue rather than royal blue category, not quite blue-black but also not suffering from the teal-leaning nature of some "blue-black" inks.

[Jon Szanto]

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb204/EnvoyC/FP/sheenink.jpg

Plenty of sheen.

[mhosea]

Yeah, Jon, but that ink is not well-behaved.

[reprieve]

Haven't seen it mentioned: Namiki Blue. Benign in the looks department, not expensive, and water resistant to boot. You could do worse - I have.

Namiki (or Pilot) Blue! That's my go-to everyday workhorse ink, along with Pilot Blue-black. I am always recommending those inks to people who want a water-resistant, affordable, well-behaved ink. They're wonderful.

[reprieve]

Responding to nobody in particular...I'm not sure I would concede that an ink is "underrated" simply because it happens to be a good ink and isn't celebrated. Lamy Blue is "underrated", I think, because people actively think it is a pale purple-blue, which it often seems to be when one pops in the cartridge that comes with a Lamy Safari. A sample or a bottle combined with a wet-writing pen and good paper tells a different tale...at least for awhile until it kind of fades in. But a lot of inks are just good inks that nobody complains about and nobody celebrates. They aren't therefore "underrated".

This raises an interesting point. Is an "underrated" ink an ink that is actually quite good but receives little fanfare (i.e., it's undervalued or under-appreciated)? Or is an "underrated" ink an ink about which people actively harbor misconceptions (i.e., it's misunderstood)?

[Jon Szanto]

Yeah, Jon, but that ink is not well-behaved.

Depends on how badly you want Sheen. I threw mine out.

[klpeabody]

Responding to nobody in particular...I'm not sure I would concede that an ink is "underrated" simply because it happens to be a good ink and isn't celebrated. Lamy Blue is "underrated", I think, because people actively think it is a pale purple-blue, which it often seems to be when one pops in the cartridge that comes with a Lamy Safari. A sample or a bottle combined with a wet-writing pen and good paper tells a different tale...at least for awhile until it kind of fades in. But a lot of inks are just good inks that nobody complains about and nobody celebrates. They aren't therefore "underrated".

This raises an interesting point. Is an "underrated" ink an ink that is actually quite good but receives little fanfare (i.e., it's undervalued or under-appreciated)? Or is an "underrated" ink an ink about which people actively harbor misconceptions (i.e., it's misunderstood)?

At the prompting of this question, I can't help but wonder: are the two mutually exclusive? Just thinking out loud.

[Laura N]

How about we look at sales statistics? It's not the same thing, but it's important for ink manufacturers.

When I go to Jetpens and open "Bottled Inks," and arrange them by popularity (sales), I find that the three J. Herbin 1670 inks, including the 1670 Blue, are all in the Top Ten fountain pen inks. Rounding out that list are one Platinum ink, two Sailor, one Lamy and three Pilot Iroshizuku. I am excluding the inks that are not useable for fountain pens, but only for drawing, but I will note that Jetpens does market to artists so the Platinum and one of the Sailors might appeal more to their customer base than to fountain pen users in general.

Expanding to the Top 25, and again including only inks that work in fountain pens, I add five more Pilot Iroshizuku but also three Waterman, Pilot Blue Black, three Herbin including a package of scented, Pelikan Black and even Parker Quink Blue Black. Plus one Diamine -- but only one.

If it weren't so late, I'd try the same at Goulet and Anderson's, where I would expect to find a lot of Noodler's inks in the Top Ten and Top 25. Jetpens doesn't sell Noodler's. I know from discussions with a few US retailers that Noodler's is a very strong seller in the US.

I consider Pilot Iroshizuku and Noodler's both to be popular on fountain pen forums. (And justly so.) And they are good sellers. It's interesting that a lot of the inks that were mentioned as underrated do appear to sell well, at least on Jetpens. I don't think I hear much on forums about Lamy Black (#3), Waterman Black (#24) or J. Herbin scented inks (#16). And not so much about Pelikan Black (#19). So maybe those inks could be considered underrated, or at least under-discussed, based on their sales popularity.

I do hear about Herbin 1670 inks. I do hear about the carbon and nano inks. I'm not surprised that they sell well. But I hear a lot about Diamine, and I find them well-priced, so I'm surprised to see that their sales on Jetpens don't seem to track their popularity. Diamine sales might be higher relatively on Goulet and Anderson's, but again it's late. :) Anyway, it seems to me, based on this cursory and incomplete research, that some inks are discussed and recommended on forums less than I'd expect given sales figures at Jetpens, while others, like Pilot Iroshizuku, seem frequently discussed and recommended and also seem to sell strongly at Jetpens.

[mhosea]

But I hear a lot about Diamine, and I find them well-priced, so I'm surprised to see that their sales on Jetpens don't seem to track their popularity.

I think it's just because Jetpens charges more for Diamine inks than the going rate. If you factor in shipping, it's still a good deal if you're looking to buy exactly two bottles, but there are better deals out there if you're buying more.

[The Good Captain]

There's an interesting mix or Quinks to get a reasonable blue-black. Certainly looks OK and does use up the colours. to make 10ml use:
Blue:Blue-Black:Black - 4ml:4ml:1ml. Works fine. The various colours can be changed to suit and I found this some time ago on FPN.
Also, add a small amount of red to the original Quink Blue-Black. In theory, it gets rid of the 'teal' effect but I haven't experimented with the quantities. the original post on FPN just said 'small'!

[Lady Onogaro]

I'm slowly reevaluating my ink collection. I'm trying to approach the inks I already have with an open mind, to reassess what *I* personally like in an ink--rather than being unduly influenced by marketing hype or online reviews, rather than constantly searching for the newest best thing. :)

+1

I can't name names, darn Mystery Ink, but I had this experience a year or so ago when I bought a very nice, very hyped, very expensive ink -- that I still enjoy -- and realized it wasn't that much different from a very nice, very unhyped (to the point of dismissal), very inexpensive ink. Further, boring old underrated ink cleaned up more easily. There was a slight difference between them, but it wasn't so much that anyone else would probably notice.

I actually wrote about this recently in a letter to someone -- no matter what the hobby or interest, there can be a downside in too much focus on the best, or the newest, or any kind of connoisseurship. I mentioned a relative of mine who got into tea so deeply that she couldn't enjoy a cup at a restaurant because it was served in a teabag rather than brewed loose leaf. I know people who like the quality of their medium format cameras so much they don't like taking snaps with a 35mm (or digital).

I take a lot of photos with my phone; I've just transferred that to inks. :) Good enough sometimes equals darn good.

One of the reasons I asked Migo about the Monet Violet was because while I love the color, I wondered if it was worth it to buy a bottle for $30.00. Her comparison shows me that there are violets that are close enough that are more reasonable in price. I would like to try the Monet Violet, but I don't want to spend $30.00 on a bottle of it unless it's quite different from others in the line.

[Lady Onogaro]

But I hear a lot about Diamine, and I find them well-priced, so I'm surprised to see that their sales on Jetpens don't seem to track their popularity.

I think it's just because Jetpens charges more for Diamine inks than the going rate. If you factor in shipping, it's still a good deal if you're looking to buy exactly two bottles, but there are better deals out there if you're buying more.

Where do you find them less expensive?

[Neo]

But I hear a lot about Diamine, and I find them well-priced, so I'm surprised to see that their sales on Jetpens don't seem to track their popularity.

I think it's just because Jetpens charges more for Diamine inks than the going rate. If you factor in shipping, it's still a good deal if you're looking to buy exactly two bottles, but there are better deals out there if you're buying more.

Where do you find them less expensive?


Jetpens $14.50

Goulet pens, Anderson pens, Goldspot $12.95

the mailman finally arriving....priceless :bounce:

[mhosea]

Jetpens $14.50

Goulet pens, Anderson pens, Goldspot $12.95


Yup, and Todd at isellpens.com also has them for $12.95. Like I said, if you buy two bottles, the Jetpens free shipping compensates. It even compensates if you buy three bottles, because 3 bottles at 12.95 doesn't cross the Goldspot $49 threshold for free shipping. But at 4 bottles, Goldspot's free shipping kicks in. Of course this doesn't even consider the case where you have a variety of things to purchase. The isellpens.com free shipping threshold is $75. Anytime you can get into free shipping range only buying what you wanted to buy, it's worth doing the math at least. I have to say that the free shipping thing kind of works on me. A lot of times I might only want one bottle of ink, and then I'll rummage around the site looking for stuff that will get me into free shipping territory.

[Cob]

There's an interesting mix or Quinks to get a reasonable blue-black. Certainly looks OK and does use up the colours. to make 10ml use:
Blue:Blue-Black:Black - 4ml:4ml:1ml. Works fine. The various colours can be changed to suit and I found this some time ago on FPN.
Also, add a small amount of red to the original Quink Blue-Black. In theory, it gets rid of the 'teal' effect but I haven't experimented with the quantities. the original post on FPN just said 'small'!


Ingenious, but why bother with Parker's inks? If you want blue-black, try Diamine or Lamy, both excellent or an iron-gall type like R&K's Salix or even ESSRI.

Cob

[Silverbreeze]

Some places like the US parker is the only ink you can find in a office store

[klpeabody]

How about we look at sales statistics? It's not the same thing, but it's important for ink manufacturers.

When I go to Jetpens and open "Bottled Inks," and arrange them by popularity (sales), I find that the three J. Herbin 1670 inks, including the 1670 Blue, are all in the Top Ten fountain pen inks. Rounding out that list are one Platinum ink, two Sailor, one Lamy and three Pilot Iroshizuku. I am excluding the inks that are not useable for fountain pens, but only for drawing, but I will note that Jetpens does market to artists so the Platinum and one of the Sailors might appeal more to their customer base than to fountain pen users in general.

Expanding to the Top 25, and again including only inks that work in fountain pens, I add five more Pilot Iroshizuku but also three Waterman, Pilot Blue Black, three Herbin including a package of scented, Pelikan Black and even Parker Quink Blue Black. Plus one Diamine -- but only one.

If it weren't so late, I'd try the same at Goulet and Anderson's, where I would expect to find a lot of Noodler's inks in the Top Ten and Top 25. Jetpens doesn't sell Noodler's. I know from discussions with a few US retailers that Noodler's is a very strong seller in the US.

I consider Pilot Iroshizuku and Noodler's both to be popular on fountain pen forums. (And justly so.) And they are good sellers. It's interesting that a lot of the inks that were mentioned as underrated do appear to sell well, at least on Jetpens. I don't think I hear much on forums about Lamy Black (#3), Waterman Black (#24) or J. Herbin scented inks (#16). And not so much about Pelikan Black (#19). So maybe those inks could be considered underrated, or at least under-discussed, based on their sales popularity.

I do hear about Herbin 1670 inks. I do hear about the carbon and nano inks. I'm not surprised that they sell well. But I hear a lot about Diamine, and I find them well-priced, so I'm surprised to see that their sales on Jetpens don't seem to track their popularity. Diamine sales might be higher relatively on Goulet and Anderson's, but again it's late. :) Anyway, it seems to me, based on this cursory and incomplete research, that some inks are discussed and recommended on forums less than I'd expect given sales figures at Jetpens, while others, like Pilot Iroshizuku, seem frequently discussed and recommended and also seem to sell strongly at Jetpens.


Thanks, Laura

[Lady Onogaro]

Jetpens $14.50

Goulet pens, Anderson pens, Goldspot $12.95


Yup, and Todd at isellpens.com also has them for $12.95. Like I said, if you buy two bottles, the Jetpens free shipping compensates. It even compensates if you buy three bottles, because 3 bottles at 12.95 doesn't cross the Goldspot $49 threshold for free shipping. But at 4 bottles, Goldspot's free shipping kicks in. Of course this doesn't even consider the case where you have a variety of things to purchase. The isellpens.com free shipping threshold is $75. Anytime you can get into free shipping range only buying what you wanted to buy, it's worth doing the math at least. I have to say that the free shipping thing kind of works on me. A lot of times I might only want one bottle of ink, and then I'll rummage around the site looking for stuff that will get me into free shipping territory.

I was on the sale page at Goulet, and I see they are selling a few colors for $10.95 now. But Mike's right in that shipping may compensate in the case of Jetpens.

[The Good Captain]

There's an interesting mix or Quinks to get a reasonable blue-black. Certainly looks OK and does use up the colours. to make 10ml use:
Blue:Blue-Black:Black - 4ml:4ml:1ml. Works fine. The various colours can be changed to suit and I found this some time ago on FPN.
Also, add a small amount of red to the original Quink Blue-Black. In theory, it gets rid of the 'teal' effect but I haven't experimented with the quantities. the original post on FPN just said 'small'!

I checked and the ratio of B-B:Red was 9:1. It's not too bad but the other 4:4:1 is a better bet. Just for the record, as I know it's not really part of this post.

[The Good Captain]

There's an interesting mix or Quinks to get a reasonable blue-black. Certainly looks OK and does use up the colours. to make 10ml use:
Blue:Blue-Black:Black - 4ml:4ml:1ml. Works fine. The various colours can be changed to suit and I found this some time ago on FPN.
Also, add a small amount of red to the original Quink Blue-Black. In theory, it gets rid of the 'teal' effect but I haven't experimented with the quantities. the original post on FPN just said 'small'!


Ingenious, but why bother with Parker's inks? If you want blue-black, try Diamine or Lamy, both excellent or an iron-gall type like R&K's Salix or even ESSRI.

Cob

I quite understand and I have, and use them all over the course of time. I only mentioned the mixes in the contents of the 'underrated inks' as a means of using up ones which individually, could well be overlooked, ignored or binned.

[welch]

Quink Washable Blue is turns dull as it dries, but Quink Blue -- permanent blue -- is a bright purplish blue. Unfortunately, it is hard to get Quink Blue in North America. Parker will not sell it to retailers. You can make an individual order for a bottle, at about $15, and Parker will ship a bottle from somewhere. Maybe France?

Lamy Blue is a curious case. About 2009, everyone praised Lamy Blue: smooth, well-behaved, smart bottle design...an ink well-matched to the Safari and Lamy 2000. All at once, Lamy Blue was dismissed in the "everyone knows" way.

[RayCornett]

Diamine Rustic Brown. Actually more of a reddish color to me. In my year and a half of using fountain pens I have only heard one other fountain penner say they use it and that was just yesterday. But it must be selling plenty or it would be discontinued.

[Sailor Kenshin]

Diamine Rustic Brown. Actually more of a reddish color to me. In my year and a half of using fountain pens I have only heard one other fountain penner say they use it and that was just yesterday. But it must be selling plenty or it would be discontinued.

I looked at scans.

Sold!

[Chrissy]

Diamine Rustic Brown. Actually more of a reddish color to me. In my year and a half of using fountain pens I have only heard one other fountain penner say they use it and that was just yesterday. But it must be selling plenty or it would be discontinued.
I bet many more people would want one if it was called Caran d'ache Grand Canyon

[reprieve]

I was reminded of this thread after seeing Cob's review of Sheaffer Blue (http://fpgeeks.com/forum/showthread.php/11638-Ink-Review-Sheaffer-Blue). It's such a lovely color and it looks really well-behaved but I've not read much about it on the forums.

[Cob]

I was reminded of this thread after seeing Cob's review of Sheaffer Blue (http://fpgeeks.com/forum/showthread.php/11638-Ink-Review-Sheaffer-Blue). It's such a lovely color and it looks really well-behaved but I've not read much about it on the forums.

I promise you that it is even better on the paper than in my rotten photo and even more rotten scan!

Cob

[Uncle Bud]

I was reminded of this thread after seeing Cob's review of Sheaffer Blue (http://fpgeeks.com/forum/showthread.php/11638-Ink-Review-Sheaffer-Blue). It's such a lovely color and it looks really well-behaved but I've not read much about it on the forums.

I promise you that it is even better on the paper than in my rotten photo and even more rotten scan!

Cob

I'll have to try this, but Cob your handwriting is so nice I don't think I'd do it justice. Mine is sooooo bad.

[ethernautrix]

Interesting discussion.

Reprieve's post got me thinking about the inks I used to use about 30 years ago when I first started using fountain pens. Parker, Sheaffers, Waterman. Blue, Black, Green, Red - oo, and a few times I bought Waterman Sea-something Blue cartridges. Purple. I tried Sheaffers Gold, but it was too impractical. These were the inks that were available as far as I knew, and I was happy with them. -- Oh yeah, Montblanc with the cool bottle, but I didn't like the ink itself. And Pelikan. (Memory's kicking in.)

I pretty much used those inks (and, later, tried Japanese inks - Sailor, Pilot, Namiki.) until I joined an Internet forum of crazy people who loved to talk about fountain pens and inks about seven years ago. I thought I had tried many, many inks (Lamy, Visconti, Private Reserve), but I had no idea how many inks I hadn't tried! I had been on a mission to find the darkest, least-prone to feathering or bleeding-through, water-resistant black ink. With that and all the other inks coming out -- all those colors! -- I kindv forgot about or simply dismissed the old stand-bys in my days of yore.

I know I like Noodler's Black the best. But I'm still poking around the blues and browns. And maybe a green here and there. Reds. You know how it goes. Out of curiosity. Samples rather than bottles suffice. (But samples swapped with friends, so the 5ml vial is almost full rather than almost empty.)

I've been looking at blue inks since several months ago when I used an old cartridge of Parker Penman Sapphire. The cartridge was half-full, so I added water to fill it, and I liked the color. Then I didn't want to keep that Parker pen in rotation and didn't want to waste the ink, so I transferred the remaining ink to another cartridge and added water to fill it, and lo! I liked the color even more! Even when I added more water as the cartridge emptied (from use), the color was bright and so pretty.

I remember trying the Lamy Blue a couple of years ago. I don't remember why I was dissatisfied with it. Maybe it was too dry (for my EF and F nibs?). I took a look at the Sheaffer Blue review, and that's piqued my interest. I'm also remembering that I have a quarter-full bottle of Visconti Blue that I haven't opened in years. Should give that a go.

BTW: SF Pen Show organizers plan to have an incredible array of ink samples to show at a table. That will be a great opportunity to take a look at the old standards (pretty sure they're on the list), as well as a bunch of the newer inks and limited edition inks.

[Jon Szanto]

BTW: SF Pen Show organizers plan to have an incredible array of ink samples to show at a table. That will be a great opportunity to take a look at the old standards (pretty sure they're on the list), as well as a bunch of the newer inks and limited edition inks.

Last count I saw, the numbers were approaching 250. These inks will be in tester pens, and I would not be surprised to see that number go much higher. The spreadsheet tallying the inks they are trying to round up is over 1200 inks!

This. Will. Be. Fun.

[reprieve]

BTW: SF Pen Show organizers plan to have an incredible array of ink samples to show at a table. That will be a great opportunity to take a look at the old standards (pretty sure they're on the list), as well as a bunch of the newer inks and limited edition inks.

Last count I saw, the numbers were approaching 250. These inks will be in tester pens, and I would not be surprised to see that number go much higher. The spreadsheet tallying the inks they are trying to round up is over 1200 inks!

This. Will. Be. Fun.

Oh my goodness! I do not need to check out flights to San Francisco... I do not need to...