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petersalazar
February 12th, 2015, 02:37 PM
Question from a non fountain pen user for all you notebook aficionados.

I'm new to paper notebooks—I'm switching from journaling and notetaking on my laptop and trying to write as much as possible longhand.

I'm trying out different notebooks. I tried the Leuchtturm Whitelines, and while it's a beautiful book, I found the paper to be a bit... slippery? Fast? The Leuchtturm's smoother, harder paper made my pen glide too quickly over the paper, making my handwriting too messy.

So far I love Moleskine because of the paper, which I'd describe as... soft? Maybe even a little absorbent?

The pen I'm trying out is the Uniball Jetstream RT Retractable Bold Point in blue, and it works so beautifully with the Moleskine paper, partly because the softness of the Moleskine seems to slow down my pen's glide, allowing me to write more neatly, do nice little handwriting flourishes, and make my scribbled notes look like little works of art.

I've seen people complain that Moleskines are bad for fountain pens, and I suspect that's the exact thing I love about the Moleskin paper... its softness and the way it slows my pen and accepts the ink. I only write on one side of the page anyway.

1. Does anyone know what I'm talking about? What do you call this quality? The softness of the paper? The roughness?

2. What other notebooks should I check out given that that's the kind of paper I like? My ideal notebook is light, large (maybe even as big as 8.5x11), and has a dot grid instead of ruled lines.

Thanks!

tandaina
February 12th, 2015, 03:15 PM
If you like Moleskine (I cannot stand the feathering of my ink, hate it) then maybe try Field Notes? I found them just as unusable as Moleskine. But it sounds like you are using a rollerball anyway, not a fountain pen so they should work as well as the Moleskine.

erpe
February 12th, 2015, 10:13 PM
Let me the first (and I assume many will follow): have a look at Rhodia. The paper is just as soft, less absorbent than Moleskine (that's why Moly's feather so much with FP) and takes any ink /pen that you throw at it. I find Rhodia not so good for pencil though. You would have to check with your retailer whether the dotpad webby's are available.

tandaina
February 12th, 2015, 10:44 PM
I also prefer dot grids and they are far more rare than lined or grid unfortunately.

Love
February 13th, 2015, 04:06 AM
Yes try Rhodia. They do a dot grid notebook, but as far as I know they only go up to a5 size.

sgtstretch
February 13th, 2015, 07:08 AM
Have you looked at the Baron Fig Confidant notebook? Available in dotgrid, it's about A5 sized (a bit shorter and a bit wider).

elaineb
February 13th, 2015, 07:18 AM
1. Does anyone know what I'm talking about? What do you call this quality? The softness of the paper? The roughness?

2. What other notebooks should I check out given that that's the kind of paper I like? My ideal notebook is light, large (maybe even as big as 8.5x11), and has a dot grid instead of ruled lines.


1. Yes, I know what quality you're talking about, and there's no specific word for it. Closest might be "toothy", a term used when talking about drawing papers intended for dry media, that means the surface is left a little rough so the surface can accomodate more graphite, charcoal, etc. But I wouldn't call Moleskinne paper toothy -- it's actually kind of thin and smooth when compared to drawing papers.

I don't think Whitelines is a very good paper, because nearly the whole surface is printed to create the grey color. (Instead of printing the lines, they print on everything BUT the lines.) Writing on top of a layer of printer's ink is really unpleasant, and I don't think your experience was indicative of what a premium writing paper feels like under your pen.

(2) But I know what you're talking about when you say you don't want a slick finish paper because it makes your rollerball move too quickly to control well. A very valid preference. In that case, I might take a look at some of the Japanese notebook brands at JetPens. In particular, you might look at the Tsubami notebooks in B5 size (about 7x10), which come in a beautiful laid paper. It's lovely stuff, smooth but not slick, friendly to fountain pens as well as rollerballs, ballpoints, etc. No dot grids, but there's a graph version and a plain blank one that you could use by sticking a printed template behind the paper you're writing on.

Other options are from Midori, Life, and Maruman.
Hope this helps.

sharmon202
February 14th, 2015, 07:19 AM
Not sure how stuck you are on the pen. I like the Jetstream pens for some uses but on good paper this pen just goes off on me. It is so smooth it goes too fast for me. Try some other pen types that are not this ultra-smooth maybe? Maybe look at more pen/paper combos for what you might like you don't even now exist yet.

petersalazar
February 14th, 2015, 12:38 PM
Thank you for all the answers so far! elaine: "toothiness," I like that, that's exactly what I'm talking about. And thanks for validating my experience with the Whitelines---"a slick finish paper because it makes your rollerball move too quickly to control well"---perfect way to describe what I'm talking about.

erpe, Love: Rhodia seems like it could be great. I ordered the Rhodia Black Dot Pad 8.25x12.5, will see how it works for me.

elaineb: Thanks for the suggestions. Of those, Tsubame and Life look like they are the most beautiful. I am also going to order these two and see how they compare:

Tsubame Fools Cream Notebook - B5 - Section - 5 mm Graph
http://static1.jetpens.com/images/a/000/062/62120.jpg
http://static.jetpens.com/images/a/000/062/62124.jpg

Life Noble Notebook - A5 - Graph
http://static1.jetpens.com/images/a/000/050/50392.jpg
http://static.jetpens.com/images/a/000/050/50372.jpg

Thanks for all the help!





1. Yes, I know what quality you're talking about, and there's no specific word for it. Closest might be "toothy", a term used when talking about drawing papers intended for dry media, that means the surface is left a little rough so the surface can accomodate more graphite, charcoal, etc. But I wouldn't call Moleskinne paper toothy -- it's actually kind of thin and smooth when compared to drawing papers.

I don't think Whitelines is a very good paper, because nearly the whole surface is printed to create the grey color. (Instead of printing the lines, they print on everything BUT the lines.) Writing on top of a layer of printer's ink is really unpleasant, and I don't think your experience was indicative of what a premium writing paper feels like under your pen.

(2) But I know what you're talking about when you say you don't want a slick finish paper because it makes your rollerball move too quickly to control well. A very valid preference. In that case, I might take a look at some of the Japanese notebook brands at JetPens. In particular, you might look at the Tsubami notebooks in B5 size (about 7x10), which come in a beautiful laid paper. It's lovely stuff, smooth but not slick, friendly to fountain pens as well as rollerballs, ballpoints, etc. No dot grids, but there's a graph version and a plain blank one that you could use by sticking a printed template behind the paper you're writing on.

Other options are from Midori, Life, and Maruman.
Hope this helps.

Bart Willems
February 14th, 2015, 10:15 PM
Folks, seriously, do we read the posts? "I tried Leuchtturm but it's too smooth for my liking"

"try Rhodia"

Really? I mean, REALLY?

velo
February 14th, 2015, 10:26 PM
Yes Rhodia is definitely a smooth paper. If Moleskine works for the OP than just stick with it.

erpe
February 14th, 2015, 11:24 PM
Folks, seriously, do we read the posts? "I tried Leuchtturm but it's too smooth for my liking"
"try Rhodia"
Really? I mean, REALLY?

Yes really, that's why I suggested Rhodia and not Clairefontaine (for example) from the same house.

sharmon202
February 15th, 2015, 02:06 AM
Folks, seriously, do we read the posts? "I tried Leuchtturm but it's too smooth for my liking"

"try Rhodia"

Really? I mean, REALLY?

Really?? This contribution sounds like one I would find on FPN not FPG. Most know what I mean.

Mags
February 15th, 2015, 05:44 AM
The Midori notebooks not the insert for the travellers or passport covers but the A5 is likely what will work for you. It has a a semi gloss texture so you will get some of that moleskine porous texture you liked but the paper is better, perhaps slightly heavier and dense thus it will not feather as much as a moleskine notebook. The tomoe river notebooks and backpocket journals will likely impress you also.

I believe Rhodia is too glossy based on your likes expressed earlier in this thread.

petersalazar
February 15th, 2015, 05:21 PM
OK so here's a funny thing. After hearing all this, especially the part about "toothiness" and how the smooth/slick Leuchtturm paper made my Jetstream move too fast to control it well... today, going back to my Moleskine, I found myself thinking, "This paper is OK, but I wish it were even slower/easier to control." So my new goal is to find the toothiest papers I can find.

I will order the Midori as well and see how it compares.

Love
February 15th, 2015, 10:17 PM
Have you tried different pens on the moleskine? All pens behave differently on different papers. I use an extra fine fountain pen daily on Rhodia for example with no issues, but if I was to use a broad gel pen I'd likely find it too fast and slippery. If you want to really slow yourself down you could try experimenting with different nib sizes. A narrower nib will dig into the paper that little bit more and will help to slow things down. I also find that liquid ink rollerballs are slower than gel pens because the ink isn't as lubricated/thick. While still smooth, you'll get a bit more feedback from the paper this way. There's some fantastic pens available that only cost a few £/$. I know you're looking primarily at the paper but just wanted to throw this out there as the pen also plays a huge part in the writing experience.

Special K
June 13th, 2015, 05:57 PM
OK so here's a funny thing. After hearing all this, especially the part about "toothiness" and how the smooth/slick Leuchtturm paper made my Jetstream move too fast to control it well... today, going back to my Moleskine, I found myself thinking, "This paper is OK, but I wish it were even slower/easier to control." So my new goal is to find the toothiest papers I can find.

I will order the Midori as well and see how it compares.
Sounds like you need to try out a nice parchment paper

Lady Onogaro
June 13th, 2015, 08:52 PM
Peter might like Kraft paper notebooks as well. Those are certainly toothy.