Ink Review: Diamine Salamander

[Chrissy]

I'm currently reviewing some of my favourite Diamine inks. This one is Diamine Salamander.

I decided to review this particular ink because I know that people are looking for an alternative to Montblanc Racing Green, and I thought this might be a contender.


Bearing in mind the paper I use is very smooth, and I'm writing with a stub nib, this ink takes 15-16secs to dry.

It flows very well and lubricates the nib fairly well. No start-up problems noticed. *Edited*

Water test on the review form shows this isn't a waterproof ink, but it shows some water resistance.

Easy clean up.

It's reasonably priced.

It is currently available in 30ml plastic bottles and 80ml glass bottles.

Diamine (http://www.diamineinks.co.uk/) sell it directly to end-users on their web-site.


Edited:
44505

[migo984]

Thank you for another review. I don't think that it is 5/5 for lubrication. "Lubrication" in ink terms, to me, refers to inks that actually affect the performance of a pen's mechanism e.g. Noodler's Eel inks. Salamander is reasonably free-flowing, but in comparison to Midnight, I'd only give this a 3/5.

I didn't like the colour, so after about 1/2 dozen fills, in various pens, I gave away my bottle.

[Chrissy]

Thank you for another review. I don't think that it is 5/5 for lubrication. "Lubrication" in ink terms, to me, refers to inks that actually affect the performance of a pen's mechanism e.g. Noodler's Eel inks. Salamander is reasonably free-flowing, but in comparison to Midnight, I'd only give this a 3/5.

I didn't like the colour, so after about 1/2 dozen fills, in various pens, I gave away my bottle.

I read the "suggestions for what to include in an ink review" over on FPN. For lubrication it suggested: How does it lubricate the nib? (sufficiently, or like "skating on the paper")

Since only Noodler's make 'Eel' inks, I didn't believe the review form would have included "lubrication" solely for how an ink actually affects the performance of a pen's mechanism. Especially since that would depend as much, if not more, on which pen's mechanism it was being used in, as it would on the ink that was being used.

My reviews rate the lubrication of the ink on the pen nib. If I can put the pen down for a few seconds, then write with it again, straight away, without it having dried out, I think it's lubricating the nib. That's how I do my ratings.

[da vinci]

Thanks for the review.

How would you say this compares to Diamine Green Black (which I seem to find is pretty green rather than black with a hint of green)?

[mhosea]

Context is key. On an ink review form, it always means how the nib feels on the paper. Specific to Noodler's inks, the word "lubricated" (not "lubrication") refers to whether the ink has an additive for lubricating pistons.

If you ask me, the Noodler's Eel inks I've tried don't deserve better than 1 or 2 out of 5 at lubricating pistons. They work...some...but they certainly don't work well. Instead, try circulating some glycerin water (several drops of glycerin in a few ml of water) in the pen from time to time. I have one MB pen that I can't get the piston out of to lubricate with silicone grease. Gruene Cactus Eel barely helped. The glycerin water helped a lot.

[Chrissy]

Thanks for the review.

How would you say this compares to Diamine Green Black (which I seem to find is pretty green rather than black with a hint of green)?

I have Diamine Green/Black and I will add a comparison scan of this tomorrow. Bearing in mind that green inks are made from mixing blue and yellow dyes, (or blue and yellow pigments), you get some greens that lean towards more yellow and some that lean towards more blue. Although Diamine Salamander and Green Black both contain black to make them dark, Salamander would be on the yellowish side of the colour wheel while Green Black would be on the blueish side.

I prefer Green/Black because it is a nice emerald green black. I also agree with you that it's noticeably green, and for me it is none the worse for that. It's a nice forest green. Salamander could be called a slightly 'muddy' green, and MbRG always looked like a 'muddy' green for me. In some pens they both look dark grey. In my scan they both look grey, and on my review form they also look grey. This was always my one disappointment against MbRG, and will be my one disappointment against Diamine Salamander.

My colour preferences lean towards Diamine Safari and Mb Daniel Defoe for yellowish greens and towards Diamine Green Black or Mb White Forest for a blueish green. However, there are many similar inks that I don't have

44506

[rdcalhoon]

I like this ink on ivory paper. While in a strict color description sense they may well apply, I reject the connotations carried by the terms muddy and murky when applied to this ink. Rather than a cheerful or happy green, it is a color of life struggling to survive, the color of small creatures hiding under rotted logs and of moss growing deep in rocky crevasses.

[Chrissy]

I like this ink on ivory paper. While in a strict color description sense they may well apply, I reject the connotations carried by the terms muddy and murky when applied to this ink. Rather than a cheerful or happy green, it is a color of life struggling to survive, the color of small creatures hiding under rotted logs and of moss growing deep in rocky crevasses.
I'm happy to go with your description :)

[Potter]

I'm not so keen on this type of colour, dark muddy greens don't appeal, neither do military khaki or olive shades, give me a bright green, I suppose thats why my Chiku-Rin and Shin-Ryoku bottles are half empty and my Cult Deep Dark Green and MB Jonathon Swift are still almost full...

[Chrissy]

I'm not so keen on this type of colour, dark muddy greens don't appeal, neither do military khaki or olive shades, give me a bright green, I suppose thats why my Chiku-Rin and Shin-Ryoku bottles are half empty and my Cult Deep Dark Green and MB Jonathon Swift are still almost full...

Yes I understand exactly what you mean. I really quite like Mb Jonathan Swift ink though, and I used Diamine Green Black for correspondence through the winter. Although I like to switch to something brighter in the spring & summer, I have an unused bottle of Pelikan Emerald Green that I don't like at all.

[Chrissy]

Thank you for another review. I don't think that it is 5/5 for lubrication. "Lubrication" in ink terms, to me, refers to inks that actually affect the performance of a pen's mechanism e.g. Noodler's Eel inks. Salamander is reasonably free-flowing, but in comparison to Midnight, I'd only give this a 3/5.

I didn't like the colour, so after about 1/2 dozen fills, in various pens, I gave away my bottle.
Actually, although I had no start-up problem after having left Salamander in the pen overnight, I did see a little skipping. So I will change my Lubrication rating to 4/5 as I haven't had this with this pen before.

[mhosea]

I'm not so keen on this type of colour, dark muddy greens don't appeal, neither do military khaki or olive shades, give me a bright green, I suppose thats why my Chiku-Rin and Shin-Ryoku bottles are half empty and my Cult Deep Dark Green and MB Jonathon Swift are still almost full...

Yeah, I just gave my bottle of Diamine Salamander to my son because I didn't figure to use it anymore. It's the sort of color I like momentarily but want to move on from in a matter of minutes. I guess one reason to have it, though, is as an alternative (sort of) to black ink.

[migo984]

Thank you for another review. I don't think that it is 5/5 for lubrication. "Lubrication" in ink terms, to me, refers to inks that actually affect the performance of a pen's mechanism e.g. Noodler's Eel inks. Salamander is reasonably free-flowing, but in comparison to Midnight, I'd only give this a 3/5.

I didn't like the colour, so after about 1/2 dozen fills, in various pens, I gave away my bottle.

I read the "suggestions for what to include in an ink review" over on FPN. For lubrication it suggested: How does it lubricate the nib? (sufficiently, or like "skating on the paper")

Since only Noodler's make 'Eel' inks, I didn't believe the review form would have included "lubrication" solely for how an ink actually affects the performance of a pen's mechanism. Especially since that would depend as much, if not more, on which pen's mechanism it was being used in, as it would on the ink that was being used.

My reviews rate the lubrication of the ink on the pen nib. If I can put the pen down for a few seconds, then write with it again, straight away, without it having dried out, I think it's lubricating the nib. That's how I do my ratings.

Thanks Chrissy. I think the FPN form & "guidance notes" are rather unhelpful in that they confer a kind of quasi-scientific analysis to ink evaluation & review, when all that we can do is to give a totally subjective assessment. It is purely a personal view of an ink in a particular pen, with a particular nib, on a particular day, with a particular paper. All these, and at least half a dozen other factors, come into play but aren't accommodated by this type of review. That's why I prefer something that is at least honest about not being objective, such as a pen and ink sketch made with the ink under review.

I also have real problems when an ink is given very high/top marks - how would we then rate an ink that was an outlier - for example, if this ink is 4/5 for saturation, what would a pigment ink be? 7/5? If it's 5/5 for feathering, what would you give X-Feather?

I'm still not sure I understand from the FPN guidance what they mean by "Flow" as opposed to "Lubrication ". Your explanation of how you interpret Lubrication, is what I would define as Flow. And as that is significantly dependent and affected by the nib and feed set-up, how can that be attributed to, or be an attribution of, the ink?

Suffice to say, your review has generated much discussions, in this household at least, about how to assess an ink and whether there are better ways of doing it. Although I don't agree with your assessment Chrissy (and I think it's good to form our own opinions) thank you for getting us thinking about the fallibility of the ink review forms, and consideration of a possible alternative approach :)

[Chrissy]

Ink reviews are always going to be based on opinions. They aren't an exact science and I don't think they are intended to be. They are just guidance

[migo984]

Ink reviews are always going to be based on opinions. They aren't an exact science and I don't think they are intended to be. They are just guidance

Well, exactly! That's what's wrong with those ink review forms and their inappropriate scoring system.

[Chrissy]

As a personal preference, I just prefer to complete a review form that I can use for all ink reviews, rather than to just write something 'freehand' that may be more difficult for some to understand. Plus I'm no good at drawing, so that's something I would always try to avoid. :)

[Morgaine]

I had a pen filling session. The salamander doesn't come through much as green on paper, but you can see it on a tissue!

[Chrissy]

I had a pen filling session. The salamander doesn't come through much as green on paper, but you can see it on a tissue!

Yes it looks green on my piece of kitchen roll too.

[The Good Captain]

I like the way it seems to change colour - I know it's probably the different papers...!

[penwash]

I like this ink on ivory paper. While in a strict color description sense they may well apply, I reject the connotations carried by the terms muddy and murky when applied to this ink. Rather than a cheerful or happy green, it is a color of life struggling to survive, the color of small creatures hiding under rotted logs and of moss growing deep in rocky crevasses.

That is one of the most thoughtful description of a color. I am in amazement!

I have this ink in my shopping cart on Gouletpens.com, I think I will like it.

[Lady Onogaro]

I like this ink on ivory paper. While in a strict color description sense they may well apply, I reject the connotations carried by the terms muddy and murky when applied to this ink. Rather than a cheerful or happy green, it is a color of life struggling to survive, the color of small creatures hiding under rotted logs and of moss growing deep in rocky crevasses.

That's quite poetical, rdcalhoon. Thank you. :)

[Chrissy]

Since I reviewed it, I have tried it on ivory paper myself, and I prefer how it looks on ivory rather than on white paper as it tends to look less grey and more green

[stub]

Flow and lubrications are different things. Inks are all different due to the inherent properties of the dyes and how much the manufacturer changes those with the addition of humectants and surfactants.

It is possible, though rarer, to have inks that are very slick and lubricated but are not all that free flowing. Some Montblanc inks and Aurora Blue are highly lubricated but they don't pour out of the pen as they are low on surfactants and have somewhat higher surface tension.

The problem is that there are also inks that claim to help smooth piston turning and are "lubricated" in a totally different sense but these are unusual specialty sort of inks like the Noodler's Eel inks. I don't think these inks are common enough that we have to rework how we, rather intuitively, use the word "lubrication" which is, how slick the ink makes the pen feel on the page. I agree with the OP.

As for the original ink at hand, I don't always have a use for a muddy or dusty green-esque ink. Like some here, if i am going that way I prefer a richer more high chroma ink like Sailor Tokiwa Matsu, which is more saturated green and has a nice brown-yellow glow to it as well.

[migo984]

As for the original ink at hand, I don't always have a use for a muddy or dusty green-esque ink. Like some here, if i am going that way I prefer a richer more high chroma ink like Sailor Tokiwa Matsu, which is more saturated green and has a nice brown-yellow glow to it as well.

I dislike Salamander ink so I gave away my 80ml bottle. I tried to use it for mixing, as most inks can be used that way, but the results were really muddy, whatever I tried.

I do agree about Tokiwa Matsu. It always seems to be loaded in one or another of my pens these days; it's almost the perfect ink for my tastes. And it's a standard Four Seasons ink too, so is easily obtainable.

[Mags]

I do agree I like the Tokia Matsu....Migo984 if you see Murph tell him my over due letter is being posted today.