Cleaning an Esterbrook J

[sharmon202]

Can I put Esterbrook J parts in a ultrasonic cleaner. I do not now how I will get this purple out of an I got at a flea market. Is pen flush OK to use?

[Jon Szanto]

Pen flush is perfectly fine. I don't think many people would recommend immersing an entire pen in the USC, if that is what you are suggesting, and it wouldn't make sense anyway. If you do a repeated soak and flush and still have purple coming out of the nib, one thing I do is suspend just the nib and feed into the water tank of the USC. There are any number of ways to do this, I simply cut a square "rod" of foam rubber, 1" square and about 4-5" long, I cut a slit in the middle of it, and I push the pen through that. When I lay the foam down across the middle of the USC tank, the pen can be pushed through enough until the tip of the nib almost touches the bottom of the tank. Then I run it as normal. Basically, just submerge barely past the rim of the section so the nib and feed are in the water, and let it do it's thing.

[ac12]

As Jon said, do NOT submerge the barrel or cap into an USC.
The problem is the USC will drive water into places that you will not be able to remove it from. And in some places, that will cause rust, which you do NOT want.

Patience. In my experience, red and purple ink are the worst/hardest inks to clean out of old pens. There is something about those ink colors that make them hard to clean out. I have spend up to 3 weeks repeatedly soaking and flushing the pen to get those inks out. So use a pen flush and be patient.

You can use the USC to clean the nib/section as Jon described. This will dissolve the hardened ink around the nib assembly so that you will be able to unscrew the nib.
Once you get the nib out, you can use a plastic tip or DULL syringe to rinse out the ink sac.

BUT first. Do you KNOW that the ink sac is in good condition?
You do NOT want to put water into an ink sac that leaks, as that will cause rust on the lever and J-bar.

I normally resac ALL sac pens that I get, unless I know that they have been resaced by the seller.
A 50 year old sac that works, could fail tomorrow or next week. Rubber ages with time.
Once resaced, the pen is good for 10-15 years.

[Chrissy]

Just as a matter of interest what size sacs do you use for Easterbrook J pens? I saw somewhere online that it suggested 15's but they seemed a little tight to me. Also, can you use the clear sacs?

[Laura N]

Just as a matter of interest what size sacs do you use for Easterbrook J pens? I saw somewhere online that it suggested 15's but they seemed a little tight to me. Also, can you use the clear sacs?

I've used #16. The nice folks at Pendemonium have a good reference guide online here (http://pendemonium.com/SacReference.html). They also sell them, of course, but I'm sure there's a closer source in the UK.

[Chrissy]

Thanks. That's the guide I found. I bought 3 sacs, and 2 of them were size 16 for 2 Esterbrook J pens. They seemed a bit tight though. Maybe it's just me. The size 15 one went on a Swan. These were all my friend's pens that I cleaned up and resacced.

[pajaro]

I used a PVC sac meant for a Parker 51 on an LJ. Still working now, a few years later.

[ac12]

Chrissy
Interesting as I normally select my sacs by seeing which sac drops into the pen with the least binding/friction. But for the Esterbrooks, I just grab a #16.
You could be getting friction from the J-bar and the pen body as you slide the sac into the pen. Check to make sure there are no remnants of the old ink sac stuck to the J-bar or the inside of the barrel. Maybe a little more talc on the sac might help.

[Chrissy]

Chrissy
Interesting as I normally select my sacs by seeing which sac drops into the pen with the least binding/friction. But for the Esterbrooks, I just grab a #16.
You could be getting friction from the J-bar and the pen body as you slide the sac into the pen. Check to make sure there are no remnants of the old ink sac stuck to the J-bar or the inside of the barrel. Maybe a little more talc on the sac might help.

Sorry, I might have caused confusion. When I read about replacing sacs in my repair manual, the size 16 sacs on the Esterbrook J's that I resacced, seemed to be stretched a little tighter onto the nipple than I thought they should be.

That meant the sac looked slightly more waisted than I expected it should look when it was in it's final position.

I put talc on it and it went into the barrel OK on both of the pens. I had measured the nipple diameter first, and I thought they should both be size 16. The chart confirmed that, so I'm sure they always look like mine did.

[ac12]

I usually size by dropping the sac into the pen.
I never bothered to compare it to the nipple, I just cement it onto the nipple. Sometimes I do have to pull the sac a bit more to get it onto the nipple.

The chart on the Pen Sac Company say hard rubber Esterbrooks used a #20 sac, and plastic Esterbrooks used a #16 sac.
I don't remember the size, but I did use a larger sac for one of the Esterbrooks I resaced. Maybe it was a transitional or a dollar pen.

[Farmboy]

Esterbrook used 16 size sacs cut 1-15/16 long on the J series.

[penwash]

Somewhat a related question.
I know that these Esterbrooks were made before ink cartridges are invented. But with today's 3D printing technology, is it possible to create a "bridge" that would allow modern ink cartridges (or converters) to be used on these lovely vintage pens?

It is easier to maintain the pen with cartridges than having to replace the sacs, correct?
My simple reasoning of course, I could be wrong about this.

[pajaro]

Somewhat a related question.
I know that these Esterbrooks were made before ink cartridges are invented. But with today's 3D printing technology, is it possible to create a "bridge" that would allow modern ink cartridges (or converters) to be used on these lovely vintage pens?

It is easier to maintain the pen with cartridges than having to replace the sacs, correct?
My simple reasoning of course, I could be wrong about this.

You would be replacing cartridges all the time, but you would only need to replace a sac every ten to fifteen years.

You might find a section of a cartridge pen that will friction fit into the Esterbrook barrel and still allow the Esterbrook cap to screw on. I rummaged through my parts box and found that a Waterman Expert II section would friction fit, but the gold trim ring kept the cap from fitting on. If the gold trim ring could be removed from the Expert II section, you might be able to use a cartridge or converter.

[ac12]

Somewhat a related question.
I know that these Esterbrooks were made before ink cartridges are invented. But with today's 3D printing technology, is it possible to create a "bridge" that would allow modern ink cartridges (or converters) to be used on these lovely vintage pens?

It is easier to maintain the pen with cartridges than having to replace the sacs, correct?
My simple reasoning of course, I could be wrong about this.

The problem is how to open the pen to change cartridges.
The old Esterbrooks are lever filled ink sacs, so it was not meant for the section to come out of the barrel on a regular basis.
Making the section a somewhat loose fit so that you could pull it out somewhat easily is risky, because doing that often could result in cracking the barrel on a slightly off angle pull.
So in this case, pajaro is correct, the sac would need to be replaced in 10-15 years, but the ink cartridge would be changed maybe every other week.

BTW, from what I've read, 3D printing is not at the stage where it can reliably hold a liquid. From what I read, the 3D printed object is porous.

[pajaro]

You could find an Esterbrook where the section is a loose fit. I have a few like that. Ac12 is right about the danger of doing damage by frequent pulls of the section to change cartridges. Not only could you crack the barrel as ac12 pointed out, but you could wear away enough material from friction to make the section a very loose fit. Every time you disassemble anything, there is opportunity for damage to be caused. That's a good reason not to be continually messing with the pens and taking them apart for the joy of it.

If you want a cartridge Esterbrook, buy one of the Esty cartridge pens and secure a couple of cartridges that you can refill. The Phaetons are nice and the converters are hard to find, making a cartridge Phaeton a grand pen to use.

[penwash]

The problem is how to open the pen to change cartridges.
The old Esterbrooks are lever filled ink sacs, so it was not meant for the section to come out of the barrel on a regular basis.


BTW, from what I've read, 3D printing is not at the stage where it can reliably hold a liquid. From what I read, the 3D printed object is porous.

I was just made aware of the fact that Esterbrooks section is not meant to be detached from the barrel.
I thought it would just unscrew just like any other pens *facepalm*

The 3D printing "object" that I was thinking is an adapter of some sort which would take an ink cartridge on one side and plugs into the feed on the other.
But if we can't open the original barrel easily, then we may be able to 3D print a new barrel that could connect to the section in some ways.

[pajaro]

Somewhat a related question.
I know that these Esterbrooks were made before ink cartridges are invented. But with today's 3D printing technology, is it possible to create a "bridge" that would allow modern ink cartridges (or converters) to be used on these lovely vintage pens?

It is easier to maintain the pen with cartridges than having to replace the sacs, correct?
My simple reasoning of course, I could be wrong about this.

The problem is how to open the pen to change cartridges.
The old Esterbrooks are lever filled ink sacs, so it was not meant for the section to come out of the barrel on a regular basis.
Making the section a somewhat loose fit so that you could pull it out somewhat easily is risky, because doing that often could result in cracking the barrel on a slightly off angle pull.
So in this case, pajaro is correct, the sac would need to be replaced in 10-15 years, but the ink cartridge would be changed maybe every other week.

BTW, from what I've read, 3D printing is not at the stage where it can reliably hold a liquid. From what I read, the 3D printed object is porous.




The problem is how to open the pen to change cartridges.
The old Esterbrooks are lever filled ink sacs, so it was not meant for the section to come out of the barrel on a regular basis.


BTW, from what I've read, 3D printing is not at the stage where it can reliably hold a liquid. From what I read, the 3D printed object is porous.

I was just made aware of the fact that Esterbrooks section is not meant to be detached from the barrel.
I thought it would just unscrew just like any other pens *facepalm*

The 3D printing "object" that I was thinking is an adapter of some sort which would take an ink cartridge on one side and plugs into the feed on the other.
But if we can't open the original barrel easily, then we may be able to 3D print a new barrel that could connect to the section in some ways.

If you build another barrel with a new screw-in section, you have an entirely different pen. It won't be an Esterbrook. Why not just buy a cartridge pen at whatever price level suits you? Making a new barrel and section gets away from the vintage quality of the Esterbrook.

Rather than rebuilding the Esterbrook as a cartridge pen, why not just get an Esterbrook cartridge pen? Be advised that the cartridges are not made any more, with all the hassles attendant on that. Good luck!

[penwash]

If you build another barrel with a new screw-in section, you have an entirely different pen. It won't be an Esterbrook. Why not just buy a cartridge pen at whatever price level suits you? Making a new barrel and section gets away from the vintage quality of the Esterbrook.

Rather than rebuilding the Esterbrook as a cartridge pen, why not just get an Esterbrook cartridge pen? Be advised that the cartridges are not made any more, with all the hassles attendant on that. Good luck!
[/COLOR]

Yes it won't be a vintage Esterbrook anymore.
But it would be a fun project (for me anyway), and it will be another option for those who simply wants to use Esterbrook nibs (charming-nails that they are :) )

Which Esterbrook would you recommend that uses their cartridge system?

[pajaro]

Safari would probably be cheapest, but I think there are some Esterbrook school cartridge pens around on cards with cartridges. These are like the Sheaffer translucent cartridge pens for students. Probably search ebay. I think a seller sandy101rock might have something. A trustworthy seller.

Edit to change name of ebay seller. It's sandy101rock.