Old Waltham Button-filler problems

[Sailor Kenshin]

DH and I recently began fiddling with old beater fountain pens. We are not after full restorations at this point, just writers with character, and have managed to re-sac seven lever-fillers, three of which are excellent writers (and the rest need further work).

Now we've moved to button-fillers, and we ran into a problem. I'm quoting him here:


'Notes & Questions:

When reassembling this pen, if there is no sac fitted on the section, the section fits in the body properly (a pressure fit) and the button and pressure bar seem to work normally. However, once a sac is attached to the section’s nipple, the section won’t slide all the way into the body and slowly creeps out. There is a spongy feel when pressing the section in. I’ve tried smaller and shorter sacs with no difference. It’s the same problem even if the pressure bar is not installed in the body.

I’ve noticed a “ring” or “ridge” of gunk just inside the barrel at about the same depth of the sac nipple step on the section. Could this just be old sack and adhesive that should be scraped away? It’s also where the end of the pressure bar wants to rest.

Should I just give the barrel a good cleaning and scrape that ridge out or do I need a special, thin-walled sac for this pen?'

Here is the pen, fully disassembled:

http://extras.ourpatioparty.com/files/2014/8863/8804/Waltham_BF-fully_apart-640p.jpg


This is looking into the barrel with the pressure bar in place:

http://extras.ourpatioparty.com/files/2914/8863/8802/Waltham_BF-barrel_w_bar.JPG


This is a tilted view of the barrel showing some of the “ridge”:

http://extras.ourpatioparty.com/files/8214/8863/8800/Waltham_BF-barrel_tilted-640p.jpg

Can anyone help? Thanks.

[Wade]

In short, yes please clean out the old gunk... quite likely as you suppose, is the remains of the old sac and must be cleaned out first. Same goes for your old lever fillers if you haven't fully cleaned them out prior to installing new filling bits. Enjoy! I've recently gotten into the same thing and find my purchases leaning towards the needs repair rather than the fully restored.

[Jon Szanto]

Yep, needs to be scraped. Old dental picks work very well for this, though most anything could be used. Also note that while friction-fit sections are nice, you do want a good, tight fit, so sometimes a little dab of shellac is helpful so it doesn't gradually become loose during use.

[Farmboy]

Also noteworthy is knowing that one typically inserts the pressure bar from the button end after installation of the section/sac whenever possible.

[PaulS]

an old craft knife blade, used parallel to the wall of the section for scraping crud away, is useful......... and plenty of talc on the sac will help to make its entry into the barrel less of a headache if the sac is a tad larger than it should be. If the sac seems to be fouling the pressure bar, it can sometimes be helpful to reverse their order of assembly when rebuilding the pen - fitting the bar through the rear end of the barrel, after the section is already in place, and it's likely that the 'spongy feeling' is the result of the sac twisting and not seating fully into the barrel.

Jon may well be right about a dab of shellac to stabilize any movement if the fit of the section to barrel worn, but using shellac I might be worried about the section not coming out (easily), or damaging the barrel, should you want to take the pen apart again. Winding on some dental floss or a few turns of white plumbers tape, are both non-invasive means of firming up this particular join, and you don't get to see them anyway when the pen is assembled.:)

It's a shame but appears you're missing the top jewel and clip.

[Jon Szanto]

Jon may well be right about a dab of shellac to stabilize any movement if the fit of the section to barrel worn, but using shellac I might be worried about the section not coming out (easily), or damaging the barrel, should you want to take the pen apart again. Winding on some dental floss or a few turns of white plumbers tape, are both non-invasive means of firming up this particular join, and you don't get to see them anyway when the pen is assembled.:)

Oh, Paul, I hate to see you suggest that. The very thin amount of shellac should only be enough to adhere, and since so little is being used, gentle heat will release it. On the other hand, your suggestions of other physical materials being placed on the section, even the Teflon tape, can certainly be thick enough to crack the barrel when inserting. My understanding is that you should never use anything that thick to make a tighter fit, and if one is putting a section back in that is loose, gradually adding thin layers of shellac would be far safer. You can even let the shellac dry outside of the barrel, and then insert it dry, so that it is still a friction fit and doesn't 'glue' itself to the inside of the barrel.

Just my $0.02.

[Sailor Kenshin]

an old craft knife blade, used parallel to the wall of the section for scraping crud away, is useful......... and plenty of talc on the sac will help to make its entry into the barrel less of a headache if the sac is a tad larger than it should be. If the sac seems to be fouling the pressure bar, it can sometimes be helpful to reverse their order of assembly when rebuilding the pen - fitting the bar through the rear end of the barrel, after the section is already in place, and it's likely that the 'spongy feeling' is the result of the sac twisting and not seating fully into the barrel.

Jon may well be right about a dab of shellac to stabilize any movement if the fit of the section to barrel worn, but using shellac I might be worried about the section not coming out (easily), or damaging the barrel, should you want to take the pen apart again. Winding on some dental floss or a few turns of white plumbers tape, are both non-invasive means of firming up this particular join, and you don't get to see them anyway when the pen is assembled.:)

It's a shame but appears you're missing the top jewel and clip.

We knowwwww....(and it's such a pretty little pen).

Thanks to you and everyone here for your help! :)

[PaulS]

Jon - your two cents worth is probably in truth very valuable, and shellac is of course invaluable for most repairers since we'd be stuck (forgive the pun) without it when replacing sacs. But, I've spent so many hours with a hair dryer trying to release section to barrel joins that have virtually welded themselves together with shellac, that perhaps I'm now over cautious about using the stuff other than when replacing sacs.
Depending of course on how loose the barrel/section join is, there is the potential to increase looseness caused by leverage when we use the pen ..... not suggesting that we write so heavily that we rock the section in the barrel, but you get the idea that some initial looseness is aggravated by the pressure of leverage when we write. Probably true to say that threaded joins are more reliable and strong than push fits.
Assuming, like a lot of us, that we don't actually write with the pen, then no problem, but if used then the matter must be addressed in some way, and I would never have thought plumbers Teflon tape that thick to cause a problem, but as we say, it does depend on the degree of looseness. Leaving the shellac to dry outside the barrel before assembling does sound a very useful suggestion - thanks.

I know zero about this particular pen or its maker, but agree the colourway of light and dark burgundy/pearl/black combination is attractive - used a lot by Parker I believe.

[PaulS]

apologies to Farmboy by the way who had already commented about inserting the bar from the button end - must read more carefully:)

[Sailor Kenshin]

At least we have it together now...will test it soon!

http://extras.ourpatioparty.com/files/4514/8874/1923/Waltham_BF_Restored-640p.jpg

Ink is Quink Black.

[Lefty John]

Very excellent timing on this post: I am just in process of trying to "repair" a green Waltham button filler; a $4 "antique" store find. The button doesn't move, so I need to disassemble. I was not sure if the feed/section were threaded or friction fit: now I know! It seems the section is shellaced to the barrel, since I have not been able to budge it after light water soak and light warm hair drier attempts. Once I get it apart, it seems a #18 sac should be the ticket. Great tips for putting it back together, BTW!

[Sailor Kenshin]

Am repeating this post from Lefty John's thread, as it's still germane to The Great Waltham Button Dilemma:

I asked DH, who did the button/sac/bar work on our Waltham. He says:

"After trying way too hard to remove the button on my Waltham, I discovered it's not removable. It's like the metal buttons on some later Parkers that don't come out. The top end of the pressure bar sits against a ridge in the body, so it is safe to remove and reinstall the section with the pressure bar in place. You can just remove the section and re-sac like you would do for a lever filler."