First pen. First potential repair.

[Paul.o5]

I got a joblot of pens/pencils yesterday with the intention of selling for a tidy profit. But decided to to look a little too deeply into the history of a particular one and now I'm hooked. I've managed to open the barrel with the help of a a quick blast of a hairdryer, dismantled it all and got the dry crumbled sac out. I've got a couple of questions before the sac replacement kit arrives which are, can I ultrasonic all the parts and there is a noise when I tip the barrel up. Is this the lever box inside and is it normal??.. Thank you in advance.. oh and the pen is a watermans ripple 52 with a gold band hallmark for 1929.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170616/147ad80c10fd92413bc394b8ad0b2f86.jpg

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[KrazyIvan]

I can't tell you about the noise but I would not soak the barrel as the metal parts inside could corrode. In general, you don't want to soak ebonite too long as it can absorb the water and swell up.

Great looking pen!

[PaulS]

when lever fill pens have empty barrels, there is often a slight sound from the pressure bar since it is loose on the end of the lever. I agree, very attractive pen and would benefit possibly from some appropriate pen polishing compound such as Micro-Mesh cream or similar. I can't really see the point in using the usc, now that you have all components separated and they appear clean.
Sorry to seem dim - is ebonite the same as hard rubber??

[KrazyIvan]

when lever fill pens have empty barrels, there is often a slight sound from the pressure bar since it is loose on the end of the lever. I agree, very attractive pen and would benefit possibly from some appropriate pen polishing compound such as Micro-Mesh cream or similar. I can't really see the point in using the usc, now that you have all components separated and they appear clean.
Sorry to seem dim - is ebonite the same as hard rubber??

Yes, ebonite = hard rubber.

[Paul.o5]

Thank you both. I will leave the usc alone and I imagined it was probably the lever inside knocking. The inside of the barrel and lid is the areas I really want to clean. If I used cotton buds, what cleaning solution is advised if any...

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[PaulS]

thanks ........... hard rubber then is the generic term. I think vulcanite was a much earlier name from the C19 possibly, and presumably came from the process of vulcanization, but in essence hard rubber, ebonite and vulcanite are the same then.

How clean do you want this pen:) you need a substance that is non-aqueous, non-acidic, solvent free, and environmentally friendly :confused: ............. be careful and don't dislodge the pressure bar.

[Deb]

Thank you both. I will leave the usc alone and I imagined it was probably the lever inside knocking. The inside of the barrel and lid is the areas I really want to clean. If I used cotton buds, what cleaning solution is advised if any...

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Naptha will do no harm.

[Paul.o5]

thanks ........... hard rubber then is the generic term. I think vulcanite was a much earlier name from the C19 possibly, and presumably came from the process of vulcanization, but in essence hard rubber, ebonite and vulcanite are the same then.

How clean do you want this pen:) you need a substance that is non-aqueous, non-acidic, solvent free, and environmentally friendly :confused: ............. be careful and don't dislodge the pressure bar.
Thank you for the head up on the lever.. I've heard they can be a nightmare to fix..

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[Paul.o5]

Thank you both. I will leave the usc alone and I imagined it was probably the lever inside knocking. The inside of the barrel and lid is the areas I really want to clean. If I used cotton buds, what cleaning solution is advised if any...

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Naptha will do no harm.
Thank you.. I think I've got some in the shed I can use..

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[Jon Szanto]

You really owe it to yourself to do a lot of study, especially when you are starting out with (somewhat) fragile HR pens. Of course there are plenty of resources online, and I would highly recommend the Marshall and Oldfield "Pen Repair" book.

In most places around the world, the cap is called a cap, not a lid.

I have to admit, I chuckled at the selling for a "tidy profit". Good luck with that!

[Paul.o5]

Cheers for the advice.. I brought the Marshall and oldfield repair book 4th edition a couple of days ago and which im going to read over before continuing.

I don't need too much luck in finding undervalued pens at small local auctions.. not in this neck of the woods anyway..


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[Farmboy]

thanks ........... hard rubber then is the generic term. I think vulcanite was a much earlier name from the C19 possibly, and presumably came from the process of vulcanization, but in essence hard rubber, ebonite and vulcanite are the same then.

How clean do you want this pen:) you need a substance that is non-aqueous, non-acidic, solvent free, and environmentally friendly :confused: ............. be careful and don't dislodge the pressure bar.
Thank you for the head up on the lever.. I've heard they can be a nightmare to fix..



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Replacing the lever box is not so difficult, finding good replacements can be.

Rubber doesn't so much swell when soaked, it discolors.

Also noteworthy, typically one leaves the feed and nib in the section unless absolutely necessary to remove.

[Paul.o5]

thanks ........... hard rubber then is the generic term. I think vulcanite was a much earlier name from the C19 possibly, and presumably came from the process of vulcanization, but in essence hard rubber, ebonite and vulcanite are the same then.

How clean do you want this pen:) you need a substance that is non-aqueous, non-acidic, solvent free, and environmentally friendly :confused: ............. be careful and don't dislodge the pressure bar.
Thank you for the head up on the lever.. I've heard they can be a nightmare to fix..



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Replacing the lever box is not so difficult, finding good replacements can be.

Rubber doesn't so much swell when soaked, it discolors.

Also noteworthy, typically one leaves the feed and nib in the section unless absolutely necessary to remove.
Out of interest why is the nib and feeder left in.. easy to damage???...

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[Farmboy]

thanks ........... hard rubber then is the generic term. I think vulcanite was a much earlier name from the C19 possibly, and presumably came from the process of vulcanization, but in essence hard rubber, ebonite and vulcanite are the same then.

How clean do you want this pen:) you need a substance that is non-aqueous, non-acidic, solvent free, and environmentally friendly :confused: ............. be careful and don't dislodge the pressure bar.
Thank you for the head up on the lever.. I've heard they can be a nightmare to fix..



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Replacing the lever box is not so difficult, finding good replacements can be.

Rubber doesn't so much swell when soaked, it discolors.

Also noteworthy, typically one leaves the feed and nib in the section unless absolutely necessary to remove.
Out of interest why is the nib and feeder left in.. easy to damage???...

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It is surprisingly easy to crush a section.
The section will have shrunk and it may be very difficult to get the feed/nib back in.
Sitting around unsupported, old polymers (including hard rubber) under static stress for a long time can relax in unexpected ways when the static stress is removed.
And it usually isn't necessary.

[Deb]

I'll add my agreement to what Farmboy is saying. Only remove a nib and feed if there's a very good reason to do so. Better to use a bulb to flush any old ink out.

[kirchh]

- The exterior of an old hard rubber pen should not be exposed to water due to the high probability of instant fading; it will not swell.

- Plain water is fine for cleaning the interior with cotton swabs.

- A dislodged Waterman pressure bar is easy to fix.

- A hard rubber section will have formed to the nib/feed to some extent, and that's a good thing, so it's best left alone if there is no compelling reason to disassemble this part. The assembly can be satisfactorily flushed as-is, and the section can be exposed to water, as it is rarely compromised due to exposure to light and thus will usually not fade on contact with water. If you have disassembled the section/feed/nib, try to reassemble it in the same orientation so as to restore the original relationship among the parts.

--Daniel

[KrazyIvan]

I forgot about discoloration but HR can swell. I'll have to find it but there is a thread somewhere here where a section or feed swelled up after soaking.

[kirchh]

I forgot about discoloration but HR can swell. I'll have to find it but there is a thread somewhere here where a section or feed swelled up after soaking.
You're confusing correlation with causation here. Hard rubber can compress/distort, and after disassembly, parts can partially return to their original shape, making them hard to reassemble. Soaking has nothing to do with it.

If hard rubber swelled because of contact with water, how could pens made of hard rubber hold ink in their barrels?

--Daniel

[Paul.o5]

Thankyou everyone for help and tips. The pen repair book came today and will be a great help for future indulgences, but with the help of this forum I already knew what I needed to do to replace the sac and in the end was very straight forward with the only issue of runnig dry now and then, so when I find a razor I will widen the nib gap slightly to see if that helps..

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[Paul.o5]

Update.. I filled it up properly with ink and now no issues..

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[Jon Szanto]

... so when I find a razor I will widen the nib gap slightly to see if that helps.

<facepalm>

Please!!!

Not only on a valued old Waterman nib, but ANY nib, only use brass flossing sheets. You need finer widths to start with, but mostly you want a material softer than gold so you don't scratch up the nib. Not to mention that flossing with something like a razor blade can remove material from between the tines and chip off tipping material.

You don't think you will ever slip with a blade? Just wait - it's inevitable. Put a set of flossing sheets in your cart the next time you buy supplies. Your nibs will thank you.

[Farmboy]

... so when I find a razor I will widen the nib gap slightly to see if that helps.

<facepalm>

Please!!!

Not only on a valued old Waterman nib, but ANY nib, only use brass flossing sheets. You need finer widths to start with, but mostly you want a material softer than gold so you don't scratch up the nib. Not to mention that flossing with something like a razor blade can remove material from between the tines and chip off tipping material.

You don't think you will ever slip with a blade? Just wait - it's inevitable. Put a set of flossing sheets in your cart the next time you buy supplies. Your nibs will thank you.
Is this when someone comes along with a public service announcement about flossing?

[Jon Szanto]

Is this when someone comes along with a public service announcement about flossing?

No.


https://www.bagnallfamilydentistry.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/floss-like-a-boss.jpg

[Farmboy]

Is this when someone comes along with a public service announcement about flossing?

No.


https://www.bagnallfamilydentistry.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/floss-like-a-boss.jpg

I feel tempted...

[Farmboy]

32875

[Jon Szanto]

http://i.imgur.com/E1mFCiI.gif?1

[Paul.o5]

... so when I find a razor I will widen the nib gap slightly to see if that helps.

<facepalm>

Please!!!

Not only on a valued old Waterman nib, but ANY nib, only use brass flossing sheets. You need finer widths to start with, but mostly you want a material softer than gold so you don't scratch up the nib. Not to mention that flossing with something like a razor blade can remove material from between the tines and chip off tipping material.

You don't think you will ever slip with a blade? Just wait - it's inevitable. Put a set of flossing sheets in your cart the next time you buy supplies. Your nibs will thank you.
Thanks for the tip. I will order some...

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[ac12]

I gather that this is your first or close to first restoration.

I HIGHLY recommend working on CHEAP JUNK in the beginning, as you are learning.
Because as FB told me several times, the tuition for learning how to repair pens, is to destroy them.
And I've paid the tuition, several times.
Better to destroy CHEAP JUNK than expensive/valuable pens.

[Deb]

I gather that this is your first or close to first restoration.

I HIGHLY recommend working on CHEAP JUNK in the beginning, as you are learning.
Because as FB told me several times, the tuition for learning how to repair pens, is to destroy them.
And I've paid the tuition, several times.
Better to destroy CHEAP JUNK than expensive/valuable pens.

Hear, Hear! That's excellent advice. You *will* break pens as you learn and it's better to break cheap ones.

[lsmith42]

The hardest thing we ever do is watch someone else learn.

[Paul.o5]

Thank you everyone.. your advice is appreciated and noted... I have my eye on a few pens to practice..

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