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HughC
April 28th, 2013, 09:12 PM
Sheaffer started in Aust in 1951 and first pens either '51 or early '52. As best as I can ascertain only the TD Craftsman and Admiral where produced with production moving to Snorkels in 1954. Here are the early models, both carry nibs with no country of origin so most likely imported from the US and the barrels clearly maked Made in Australia.

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/hLdlNePjcK96Z_xRVEk0PBL2mAEiNPsGwkT7bkx7hkI?feat=d irectlink


The blue set is mint as a bonus.

Regards
Hugh

Is there an easy way to put a picture straight from picasa?

cedargirl
April 28th, 2013, 10:52 PM
Hi Hugh
Thanks for that. Nice pens.
I'm eager to learn about Aussie Sheaffers.
I'm trying to identify a small black lever-fill with a gold plated? cap and I keep making my head spin!
Can you tell me when they started making lever fill pens here?
My pen has a Sheaffer'S 343 nib and "Sheaffer'S - Made in Australia" around the barrel.
The shape of the pen is just like the Craftsman/Cadet, but it's a lever-filler.
(Sorry I can't help with uploading the photos - I'm still struggling with all that too.)
Claire

HughC
April 29th, 2013, 04:47 AM
Hi Claire,

Can't answer your question with any degree of confidence, I've seen Fineline lever fillers made in Aust. but not a straight Sheaffer. I'd consider what you have as uncommon ( rare?) but more a curiosity than a valuable item, I suspect most of those low cost pens just got tossed out. Little doubt in my mind it's a '50's pen and I'd lean to somewhere in the region of '52-'57 with a few ? .

I've done a fair bit of research into Sheaffer Australia and posted it one the FPB ( see http://fountainpenboard.com/forum/index.php?/topic/2235-sheaffer-in-australia/page__gopid__24210#entry24210 ) .

I have a small but interesting collection of Aussies that I hope to grow.

Regards
Hugh

cedargirl
April 29th, 2013, 06:20 AM
Thanks Hugh

I went in search of Fineline pictures and found one with a gold cap. It looks to be the same pen, only mine doesn't have Fineline written on the clip or the nib or anywhere else. Thanks for your help - and for the link.

I wasn't expecting it to be a valuable pen, but as you mention in the linked post, it's very nice for an Aussie to have some of these early made in Australia pens. It's actually a nice looking pen - the gold cap (although quite warn) gives it a bit of cachet and it has a nice patina of age - and a couple of tooth marks! It's very much a 'user' pen and writes nicely. And I have a soft spot for pens from the 50s - they make me feel right at home!

I'd love to see more of your pens, do keep posting them.

jar
April 29th, 2013, 08:28 AM
Sheaffer Australia made one of my favorite PFMs as well.

http://www.fototime.com/E53C6F2D0482746/medium800.jpg

Even the nib is marked "Aust".

whych
April 29th, 2013, 01:37 PM
When I get the chance, I'll do some digging. They basically made most of the same models as in US, but were marked as being Australian and never had the price on the barrel (300, 850, etc).
Overall, the Aus build quality is the same as in the US, unlike the Brazillian ones.

I think during the switch to Touchdown/Vac Fill Sheaffer made a choice of lever fill or Vac Fill/Touchdown before dropping the lever fill altogether, but I am sure one of the American collectors can tell us (@jar ?)

HughC
April 29th, 2013, 03:45 PM
When I get the chance, I'll do some digging. They basically made most of the same models as in US, but were marked as being Australian and never had the price on the barrel (300, 850, etc).
Overall, the Aus build quality is the same as in the US, unlike the Brazillian ones.

I think during the switch to Touchdown/Vac Fill Sheaffer made a choice of lever fill or Vac Fill/Touchdown before dropping the lever fill altogether, but I am sure one of the American collectors can tell us (@jar ?)

Basically correct, Aust. production began after the vac fill/lever/barrel price era. The info is scarce to say the least, even the historical society in the suburb of Melbourne where the factory was has nothing !! So most info has a ? attached to it and gathered from experience/here say rather than hard evidence , I've yet to turn up an Aust. catalog or even ads. Probably the differences I note are a limited model range compared to the US, I've not seen a Snorkel in one of the "new" colours yet ( I've seen coloured sections in standard colours) nor in a model higher than Crest despite being made till ~'62 , the Snorkel nibs don't carry a nib code either. I'll post a few more unusual ones soon.

Regards
Hugh

HughC
April 29th, 2013, 03:48 PM
Sheaffer Australia made one of my favorite PFMs as well.

http://www.fototime.com/E53C6F2D0482746/medium800.jpg

Even the nib is marked "Aust".

Nice Jar, I've yet to add an Aussie PFM. I only have one that my wife gave me (US made).

Regards
Hugh

whych
April 29th, 2013, 05:29 PM
Basically correct, Aust. production began after the vac fill/lever/barrel price era. The info is scarce to say the least, even the historical society in the suburb of Melbourne where the factory was has nothing !! So most info has a ? attached to it and gathered from experience/here say rather than hard evidence , I've yet to turn up an Aust. catalog or even ads. Probably the differences I note are a limited model range compared to the US, I've not seen a Snorkel in one of the "new" colours yet ( I've seen coloured sections in standard colours) nor in a model higher than Crest despite being made till ~'62 , the Snorkel nibs don't carry a nib code either. I'll post a few more unusual ones soon.

It's amazing how many of the later Triumph nib TD's from Australia come up on ebay.co.uk compared to US ones.
They must have made the UK a target market.
The earlier TD's I have all have the 33 style open nib.
They must have made some lever fills for the thread that started all this to have one though.

whych
April 30th, 2013, 01:51 AM
Here is are pics of an Australian TouchDown.
The nib is marked '52' and not the usual '33', etc.

whych
April 30th, 2013, 01:58 AM
Sorry about the image - never realised there was no re-scaling.
For guys unfamiliar with the board s/ware, scroll to the end of the post and drag the slider to get the rest of the image.

Will post pics of a Aus Cadet 23 later.

whych
April 30th, 2013, 02:18 AM
Here is the Cadet 23:

HughC
April 30th, 2013, 04:43 AM
Both date from the early '60s , the top goes by the name of a "Craftsman 52" . These are really hard to understand, solid gold nibs ( these are screw out as well, or they where when made) on low end pens would have meant they can't have been much cheaper than a bottom end Imperial ( I post some pics of the first Imperials ), I sort of think of them as up market school pens but the number that turn up in good condition must mean they had a wider appeal. Beautiful examples, the 52 seems harder to find and I guess I see eight or ten 23 to every to every 52.

Regards
Hugh

HughC
April 30th, 2013, 05:13 AM
2256

These are the first Imperials ( made in Aust, US and Canada) , basically a TM TD with a different nib and section ( smooth section, small triumph nib). Not often encountered especially as US made, the 4 at the front Australian, the mint chalk marked one a US pen. Well made pens that clearly didn't sell well in the US, to date no one has turned up any company info on these. The range also included two slip cap models, one with a gold cap ( Golden Imperial) and one with a SS cap ( called a ?) ie same as skripsert cartridge pens just TDs . I haven't seen these as Aust. models though. A non WD model which I assume was quickly fazed out for the better known and common Imperials.

Regards
Hugh

whych
April 30th, 2013, 09:54 AM
The 52 is the 'tip dip' with a large hole in the bottom of the feed.
According to penhero, the nib should unscrew with the Cadet pens, but the 23 is a push fit.
The 52 and 23 pens are not that common in UK, so I guess they sold more in Australia than the Aust. Snorkels and Imperials that are reasonably common here.
Never knocke the nib out of one, but I imagine they are similar size to the 33.

OakIris
May 1st, 2013, 05:53 AM
I had no idea that Sheaffer manufactured pens in Australia; thank you for this information. Makes me realize how little I know about fountain pens and what a fun journey I have before me!

(Hugh - do you still need info about how to post photos via Picasa Web Albums? I can give you a quick tutorial if you do - that is what I use to post photos on forums.)

Holly

HughC
May 1st, 2013, 06:47 PM
The 52 is the 'tip dip' with a large hole in the bottom of the feed.
According to penhero, the nib should unscrew with the Cadet pens, but the 23 is a push fit.
The 52 and 23 pens are not that common in UK, so I guess they sold more in Australia than the Aust. Snorkels and Imperials that are reasonably common here.
Never knocke the nib out of one, but I imagine they are similar size to the 33.

My 23 has a screw in nib.You can tell if it's a screw in by looking end on at the nib, the nib and feed are in a black collar that's easily seen if the section isn't black. I'll take a pic when my camera battery recharges.

2305

Regards
Hugh

HughC
May 1st, 2013, 06:49 PM
I had no idea that Sheaffer manufactured pens in Australia; thank you for this information. Makes me realize how little I know about fountain pens and what a fun journey I have before me!

(Hugh - do you still need info about how to post photos via Picasa Web Albums? I can give you a quick tutorial if you do - that is what I use to post photos on forums.)

Holly

Hi Holly

Yes!! At present I'm just downloading pics back to my PC. Thank you.

Regards
Hugh

HughC
May 1st, 2013, 07:08 PM
Here's another not often seen Aussie set , a rather mundane Imperial II Deluxe ( the deluxe bit means "brushed" steel cap rather than "bright")

2302

Of greater interest here is the BP, earlier Aust. BPs in decent condition are far from common. On the other hand Parker BPs are easier to find than their FP mates.

Regards
Hugh

OakIris
May 2nd, 2013, 10:08 AM
I had no idea that Sheaffer manufactured pens in Australia; thank you for this information. Makes me realize how little I know about fountain pens and what a fun journey I have before me!

(Hugh - do you still need info about how to post photos via Picasa Web Albums? I can give you a quick tutorial if you do - that is what I use to post photos on forums.)

Holly

Hi Holly

Yes!! At present I'm just downloading pics back to my PC. Thank you.

Regards
Hugh

Here is how I use Picasa to share photos on forums:

1. Go to your Picasa Web album and click on the photo you want. On the right hand side of the new page showing your photo under "Tags" you will see "Link to this photo;" click on it.

2. You will now see a couple of boxes, one for "Link" and one for "Embed Image" - you want the "Embed Image information. I usually put a check mark in the "Image Only" box because I don't want to link to the whole album in which the photo is contained, and then in the "Select Size" drop down list I normally choose "Medium 640 640 px." You, of course, can choose what you prefer. :)

3. Once you have selected the above options, double click to select all of the resulting information showing in the "Embed Image" box; it will look something like this: (https....://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-CK2HccJYEUc/UX-9GZcmZ5I/AAAAAAAAAtM/lLc8c0TMyBk/s640/IMG_0910.JPG. (I added the 4 dots after https so the forum software would not automatically make it a link, just wanted you to get an idea of the format you should see.) Right click (or ctl-C if you prefer keyboard short cuts) and then select "copy."

4. Here at FP Geeks, choose the "Insert Image" icon on the message box header, select the "From URL" choice and paste in the line you copied from the Picasa "Embed Image" box and click on OK. That's it; and here is a sample photo:

2317

That may sound complicated, but it really isn't and once you have done it a couple of times you will see it is quite easy. (If you are unclear on anything, please let me know!)

Hope that helps!

Holly

cedargirl
May 2nd, 2013, 04:31 PM
Sheaffer Australia made one of my favorite PFMs as well.

http://www.fototime.com/E53C6F2D0482746/medium800.jpg

Even the nib is marked "Aust".

They are lovely jar, thanks for posting.


Here's another not often seen Aussie set , a rather mundane Imperial II Deluxe ( the deluxe bit means "brushed" steel cap rather than "bright")

snip

Regards
Hugh

That's interesting Hugh. I had thought that the Deluxe referred to the white dot. I have an Imperial II with a Sheaffer's Australia Triumph nib (no barrel markings). It has a brushed steel cap with no white dot and a longer clip than the one you show (and Made in Australia around the band). That would make it a non-deluxe Imperial II, yes?

HughC
May 2nd, 2013, 09:00 PM
That's interesting Hugh. I had thought that the Deluxe referred to the white dot. I have an Imperial II with a Sheaffer's Australia Triumph nib (no barrel markings). It has a brushed steel cap with no white dot and a longer clip than the one you show (and Made in Australia around the band). That would make it a non-deluxe Imperial II, yes?

My mistake ( should check the details better) , the Deluxe has a full brushed cap and as you point out a WD , the standard has a brushed cap with a plain collar and no WD. The longer clip is earlier iirc, the one posted is a later pen I think, but I'm not sure of the timeline for these though.

Regards
Hugh

cedargirl
May 2nd, 2013, 09:43 PM
Thanks for clarifying Hugh. I just wish I had a tenth of the info you do on vintage pens. It's all new to me. And often confusing - as I rapidly discovered that much of what I find online is not 100% correct for Aussie pens.

Claire

HughC
May 2nd, 2013, 11:32 PM
Thanks for clarifying Hugh. I just wish I had a tenth of the info you do on vintage pens. It's all new to me. And often confusing - as I rapidly discovered that much of what I find online is not 100% correct for Aussie pens.

Claire

Thank you Claire, although I really don't know all that much, there are vastly more knowledgeable people around. I know a bit about Aussie Sheaffers ( with a lot still to learn) and a lot about Sheaffer TM TDs and that's about it. Most I learnt the same way your learning !! The internet and forums such as this.

Regards
Hugh

whych
May 3rd, 2013, 12:04 AM
Claire
Most of the Australian models are similar to the US ones. Look at http://penhero.com/PenGallery/Sheaffer/Sheaffer.htm for most of the US models.

Hugh, did Sheaffer make the nibs in Australia, or were they imports with the local markings?

HughC
May 3rd, 2013, 05:06 AM
Claire
Most of the Australian models are similar to the US ones. Look at http://penhero.com/PenGallery/Sheaffer/Sheaffer.htm for most of the US models.

Hugh, did Sheaffer make the nibs in Australia, or were they imports with the local markings?

Nearly all nibs where made in Australia, the early ones in the OP are not marked as to "country of origin" so I'd assume they where imported ( US?) until the skills in place, again I don't know for sure. Late Snorkel nibs ( Aust. production ran to ~'62 ) are not marked either as a general observation ( marked 14ct-585 ), what that means I'm not sure but I'm always suspicious when not "country" marked. Some times the nibs are marked but not the pen....I'll post an example given time.

Regards
Hugh

HughC
May 3rd, 2013, 09:08 PM
Here's an example of pen with Aust. nib but no country marked on the body, a Sterling silver Imperial TD. Top of the Aust. range as I've not seen a solid gold Aussie.

2356
2357

Regards
Hugh

whych
May 4th, 2013, 12:14 AM
Here's an example of pen with Aust. nib but no country marked on the body, a Sterling silver Imperial TD. Top of the Aust. range as I've not seen a solid gold Aussie.

The body should have some sort of hallmark identifying it, I think.
It could be like Yard 'o Led - the mechanism is YOL, but the bits all have the silversmith's hallmark which identifies the country of origin, among other things.


I've not seen a solid gold Aussie.

Neither have I but then I'm biased. ;)

HughC
May 4th, 2013, 03:59 AM
The body should have some sort of hallmark identifying it, I think.
It could be like Yard 'o Led - the mechanism is YOL, but the bits all have the silversmith's hallmark which identifies the country of origin, among other things.


I've not seen a solid gold Aussie.

Neither have I but then I'm biased. ;)

No hallmark, just Sheaffer Sterling Silver. Yer, gold Aussies are rare, quite a few bronzed ones though....down at Bondi :)

jor412
May 6th, 2013, 06:04 AM
My Imperial VIII touchdown is Australian made. It's an F nib, writes really well, consistent flow, the works.

HughC
May 8th, 2013, 09:05 PM
I've only got a couple

2531

jor412
May 8th, 2013, 09:36 PM
Very nice. The one in the middle, that's the one I have, except mine is black.

whych
May 14th, 2013, 08:02 AM
This is an Australian Snorkel with a stub nib.

cedargirl
May 14th, 2013, 08:31 PM
This is an Australian Snorkel with a stub nib.

Wow. My one and only Aussie snorkel has a medium nib. Snorkel + Aussie + stub = jealousy!

Claire

whych
May 15th, 2013, 01:17 AM
Wow. My one and only Aussie snorkel has a medium nib. Snorkel + Aussie + stub = jealousy!

The strangest part of it is that the guy I got it from never even knew it was a stub ;)
When I mentioned it to him, he was pretty surprised, but never asked for it back.

It isn't as smooth as the German obliques, but it's OK.
The broadest Sheaffers I have are the stub and the ealier one with the 52 nib, all the rest are mediums.
The 52 is more like a Parker medium, whereas Sheaffer medium is closer to Parker fine.

Jon Szanto
May 15th, 2013, 01:33 AM
Wow. My one and only Aussie snorkel has a medium nib. Snorkel + Aussie + stub = jealousy!

The strangest part of it is that the guy I got it from never even knew it was a stub ;)
Well, to be fair, his wife always told him "No, honey, that looks perfectly normal."

whych
May 15th, 2013, 01:51 AM
Well, to be fair, his wife always told him "No, honey, that looks perfectly normal."

He said he could live with that, but the thing that did it for him was when she asked: "Is it in?"
Totally ruined his ego that did.

Jon Szanto
May 15th, 2013, 01:56 AM
When he replied 'All the way past the section!", she knew for sure she had married a fountain pen geek.

cedargirl
May 15th, 2013, 03:03 AM
Hahaha - thread is turning blue!

Guys, Get a grip!

whych
May 15th, 2013, 03:28 AM
Hahaha - thread is turning blue!

No, the pen shows its style better with a blue black ink.

Back to topic:
We need HughC to give us some history on the pen.
The only other Sheaffer italics I have are US made fine points.

HughC
May 15th, 2013, 05:08 AM
http://fpgeeks.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=2442&d=1367810016

Couple of my snorkel stubs with one from the early Imperials mentioned earlier, none where advertised as stubs and both Snorks arrived as pleasant surprises. History wise it seems Snorkels started in 1954 in Aust. and ran through to ~'62. If there's a bit of interest I might start another topic on Aussie snorks, the info I have is fairly limited and it might bring to light a bit more to light and answer a few unknowns. Or if you prefer I can just add to this topic.

Regards
Hugh

cedargirl
May 15th, 2013, 05:42 AM
That would be useful Hugh. Perhaps a new thread to make future searches easier?
Claire

whych
May 15th, 2013, 08:17 AM
Hahaha - thread is turning blue!

Guys, Get a grip!
I thought 'grip' was a one-handed game.

Before we lose our grip on things, here is a sample of it's writing.

HughC
May 26th, 2013, 11:17 PM
Here's another attractive mint pen/pencil ( missing the bp which is common0

3030

Exactly what it's called I'm not sure, while chalkmarked it only says medium. I lean away from a Stylist based on the clip, this is more the L.Sheaffer style. If it was carrying a sticker I'd think it may simply say "Sheaffer 440XG' with 440 being the style ( plastic barrel, metal cap) and X indicating gold trim and the G indicating gold nib.

Regards
Hugh

cedargirl
May 27th, 2013, 12:08 AM
They are nice Hugh. What type of nib does the FP have?

Re the naming of Sheaffer pens in general - I think it must have been done by committee - or maybe random draw. Every time I think I'm picking it up I see an apparent aberration. It's got me beat.

HughC
May 27th, 2013, 05:14 AM
Hi Claire,

It has the small triumph nib in 14ct which places it before 1972 when they phased it out. Sheaffer likes to challenge collectors!! With the 3 digit numbers they refer to the finish not the model ( which makes the 440XG correct, it's just what comes before that..), so you'll see several completely different pens with the same number and the lack of catalogs from that period seems to make identification difficult. If you ever find late '60's/early '70's Sheaffer catalogs....but them !! If you also stumble across any Aust. Sheaffer catalogs from pre '1970 buy them as well.

Regards
Hugh

cedargirl
May 27th, 2013, 05:55 AM
Hi Claire,

It has the small triumph nib in 14ct which places it before 1972 when they phased it out. Sheaffer likes to challenge collectors!! With the 3 digit numbers they refer to the finish not the model ( which makes the 440XG correct, it's just what comes before that..), so you'll see several completely different pens with the same number and the lack of catalogs from that period seems to make identification difficult. If you ever find late '60's/early '70's Sheaffer catalogs....but them !! If you also stumble across any Aust. Sheaffer catalogs from pre '1970 buy them as well.

Regards
Hugh


Thanks for explaining that, Hugh. I wondered where those numbers came from.

Catalogs - added to my hunt list!

Claire

HughC
September 4th, 2013, 08:57 PM
A few more

5212

The first Targa, the SS Imperial TD and the early L.Sheaffer don't have a "country of origin" on their barrels so most likely these where imported.

Regards
Hugh

cedargirl
September 5th, 2013, 02:51 AM
Hugh - the link is not working - or it might just be me.

OakIris
September 5th, 2013, 05:45 AM
It doesn't work for me, either - getting an "invalid attachment specified" error message from the board when attempting to access the link. :(

Holly

HughC
September 6th, 2013, 05:23 AM
Hopefully should work now.

Regards
Hugh

cedargirl
September 9th, 2013, 11:08 PM
Real beauties. I like the second from the left - the SS Imperial TD.
Thanks

HughC
January 21st, 2014, 07:26 PM
Some more..

9025

An Imperial 827 set in near mint condition, this and the 797 seem to be the most common Aussie gold plated models and as is nearly always the case the BPs are harder to find than the FP ( the opposite of Parker). Not that easy to find as a set.

9026

An early Finelline BP , note the barrel imprint is a standard Aust. Sheaffer one, with an Aussie made refill. Never seen one of these before, a bit of a "wow" factor here, a rare find...if of little value though.

Regards
Hugh

HughC
May 28th, 2014, 09:32 PM
More Imperials

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-VYhyHvyWil0/U4alH7hpbDI/AAAAAAAAA_Y/GGURjrfRskc/s480/IMG_1445.JPG