Music nibs - Pilot or Sailor?

[Medieval]

Hello dear FPG
I'm deciding between one of these two. I've read about the Platinum but it's dearer than I'd like and many reviews say that it's lacking line variation and doesn't have the character of the other two.

So far I've read that the Pilot is soft, has 3 tines as opposed to Sailor's 2, and is crisper than the Sailor.
The Sailor is said to be more forgiving.

Oh I don't know. What do you think is the best?
I will be using it to write normal cursive writing rather than musical notation.

[KrazyIvan]

I only know Pilot's music nib so I can't compare to Sailor. I'm happy with the variation it offers but I would not mind more from it.

[Vespagirl]

If you get the sailor, go for the 18k. It is much softer and a more enjoyable nib by far. Downside, it’s also a lot more.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Medieval]

Thanks both of you. I'm probably leaning a bit more towards the Pilot so I'm glad to hear that you're happy with the line variation.
I've not heard of an 18k Sailor. I've only seen 14k and 21k.

[Jon Szanto]

I can't speak to your economic needs, but the Platinum music nib I use takes a backseat to no nib in terms of line variation or character imparted. I won't go so far as to say that you should try one out, because you seem set on only choosing between the two other brands, but... yeah - maybe you'll be missing out and not even know it.

[Ahriman4891]

You may find this useful:
Figboot (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDwjbyYtRVw) and Inkdependence (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34SdVer1ykc) both compared Pilot, Platinum, Sailor, and Franklin-Christoph music nibs.

EDIT:
Another video, Pilot vs Sailor: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ayZW36v6SCU

[SIR]

I can't speak to your economic needs, but the Platinum music nib I use takes a backseat to no nib in terms of line variation or character imparted. I won't go so far as to say that you should try one out, because you seem set on only choosing between the two other brands, but... yeah - maybe you'll be missing out and not even know it.

+1

People say very good things about the Platinum music nib in the #3776 Century, and I can't see how it is really going to cost any more than one of the others.
£155 from cultpens.com (or £175 if you black w/ rhodium trim) - https://www.cultpens.com/s?q=platinum+music

[Medieval]

Thanks for the links. I'll go through those very soon, but I recall seeing the Inkdependence one before.
For the Platinum it's just what I've seen from reviews that's all. There was an awful lot of reviewers saying that they experienced little line variation with the Platinum and that it was their least favourite of the three. Although there were also many saying that it was great, the Platinum being twice the price relative to the Sailor and Pilot was enough for me to not consider it any more.

With the Pilot I hadn't read of any experience of there being very little line variation, but there there was a similar incidence of it with the Sailor as there was with the Platinum.

Trying the nibs out is not a possibility for me, regrettably.

[jar]

Thanks for the links. I'll go through those very soon, but I recall seeing the Inkdependence one before.
For the Platinum it's just what I've seen from reviews that's all. There was an awful lot of reviewers saying that they experienced little line variation with the Platinum and that it was their least favourite of the three. Although there were also many saying that it was great, the Platinum being twice the price relative to the Sailor and Pilot was enough for me to not consider it any more.

With the Pilot I hadn't read of any experience of there being very little line variation, but there there was a similar incidence of it with the Sailor as there was with the Platinum.

Trying the nibs out is not a possibility for me, regrettably.

My experience has been that none of the Japanese pen makers really know how to make a music nib. They are all fair but none of them great. Of the Japanese makes I own the closest to a real music nib is one from Nakaya tuned by one of the two folk at Nakaya that tune nibs. It is significantly better than the stock music nibs from Platinum and my stock music nibs from Platinum are nicer than the stock music nibs I have from Pilot or Sailor.

[Medieval]

Thanks jar. There is the 1.1 from Jowo but I found the ink flow to be terrible, so that is why I'm considering the Japanese makers.
I don't suppose you can expand on your reasons why you find the Platinum nicer than both Pilot and Sailor?

[Jon Szanto]

Here's my Plat music nib this morning, hosted in a Calico celluloid model. I really don't know what anyone would expect from line variation, unless they simply wanted a wider nib to start with. You can't do better on the horizontal hairlines and the nib writes smooth and wet (as the ink shading indicates). To overlook this nib as a contender is a mistake, but people make mistakes all the time.

https://i.imgur.com/diLxM0R.jpg

[Medieval]

Thanks Jon. That looks very nice

[wingwiper]

My Platinum Music Nibs offer far more line variation than the Pilot- I cannot comment on the Sailor Music Nib as I do not own one. The Pilot is more stubbish for sure.

The vintage Platinum Music Nibs are the best offer an italic cursive-crisp with great flex flex!

Price wise not sure which is cheaper in price, however John Mottishaw can definitely fix you up on the kind of line variation you are aiming for?

[Medieval]

Hi wingwiper
Are you referring to vintage Platinum nibs being offering more line variation?
John Mottishaw is not an option for me as sending it there and back is not worth the cost, the effort, or the result. I consider the better option to be to choose the right pen.
I also don't think I will be considering vintage because I wish to keep things simple.

In case I have mistakenly led people up the garden path, I'm sorry, but I must clarify that line variation is not the most important feature otherwise I would buy a 1.5 or 1.9 Twsbi nib. Line variation is important, but only enough so that it can be distinguished from a standard round broad nib and enough to add some distinct panache to my writing.

I really don't want too much line variation and this is also why I've specifically chosen music nibs because they provide a maximum line width of approximately 1.1mm. Any more and it's just too much for me.

I'm liking the sound of the Pilot more than either the Sailor or Platinum because it has some softness, and that is the feature which will add more flair to my writing more than brute line variation.
Despite glowing reports from some people for the Platinum, it's not enough to counteract the high price and lack of softness as well as the large number of reports of being just ordinary.

The Sailor's 2 tines has practical advantages over the Pilot and Platinum in ease of use, so I'm surprised this hasn't been mentioned yet. It's also a consideration for why it's up against the Pilot while the Platinum is not being considered.

[Jon Szanto]

What do you mean 2 tines has an advantage over 3? If you have never used any of these nibs, that is an unusual thing to say. While initial setup of a 3-tine nib may require more expertiese, once it works well it... works well. I have nibs wider than the Plat music nib that are only 2 tine and they offer no benefits - they're just wider. The purpose of 2 slits is to aid in good ink flow.

The bottom line is that you'll never know for certain unless you can try all three, which you probably won't. Everything else is words, but if I were you I'd go back and re-read from scratch people's thoughts and judge not by numbers of reviewers but the perceived knowledge and experience of the reviewers themselves. Anyone can type into an input box.

Best of luck.

[Medieval]

Hi Jon
Two tines has an advantage because occasionally not all 3 tines play ball, and this creates inconsistencies in the flow and line width especially in the softer Pilot. I've seen it mentioned in enough reviews to be worth repeating here.

I don't know what the expertise or the knowledge is of every reviewer and such things are too vague to be concerned about, so this is why I would prefer to go by numbers because it's a much better metric. In the same way that if I was an MP and sent out voting cards to my constituency for them to vote, I wouldn't say that some people's votes are worth more than others just because of this or that. If the majority vote for something then it's for a reason, and if I know the reasons then I can then make the best judgment. It's the same with pen reviews.

Thanks for your wishes.

[SIR]

You know, i must +1 Franklin Christoph; i own both a Masuyama stub and a music nib (and F-C do all sorts of other nibs besides e.g. cursive italic, cursive calligraphy, and their SIG)... obviously the 1.9 music nib has tremendous line variation but it isn't so great for everyday writing, and the stub is other end of the spectrum.

[Gobblecup]

In my experience, which is only with Sailor’s music nib, the 21k has a lot of softness and provides extra line variation from mild flexing and the 14k is stiff as a nail. The 21k music nib is a great writer and value in my opinion, but a 14k music nib from sailor isn’t nearly as impressive.

My sailor music nib is an incredibly expressive nib and quite wet. It was smooth out of the box, and the line variation without flex isn’t extreme it’s visible but not too much so, I think it’s much like you described what you’re looking for in terms of a stub.

[ethernautrix]

For the past few years, I've been interested in a music nib (either Pilot or Platinum, cos it seems like Sailor is cheating with only two tines. I know! It's a silly perception thing.), so I appreciate threads like this.

I like Pilot nibs, actually, the best. Basing this on my love for the #10 PO and the Falcon SEF (and the SF before that, which I'd bought used and then, in a moment of enthusiasm, gave to a very good friend, who loves it). I also love my Nakaya (read: Platinum) nibs -- and other brands. But that PO is my favorite and it's Pilot and so.... ya know.

But what I think I really want is a subtle stub. I get the merest hint of line variation with the PO nib. I don't know if it's perceptible to anyone else.

Adding to my confusion is the stub option. Or, even the standard B nibs (does it offer a hint of line variation). As Medieval mentions, I, too, desire a more subtle rather than dramatic line variation. I've whittled my options down to Platinum or Pilot, but then... MS, ST (or SU), or B? Don't know. Need to try them.

I know what the answer is. A trip to a Tokyo pen or stationery shop. Hahaha. (Not a practical option, alas.) (Luckily, no urgency.)

[Medieval]

Thanks all.
I've had a look at the F-C but it looks just a little bit too wide for me I'm afraid as I'm wishing to use it for daily writing cursive.

The Sailor 21k sounds temping as the expressiveness without being too obviously wide is what I'm looking for, but perhaps not so wet as to guzzle ink too quickly. There haven't been many experiences with Sailor in this thread so it's very welcome.

I know what you mean ethernautrix about the cheating, but I suppose it was for the reason mentioned in post 16 as that's what I keep on reading. You may prefer the SU nib because it's not as wide as the music nibs but it's sharper.

[jar]

Thanks all.
I've had a look at the F-C but it looks just a little bit too wide for me I'm afraid as I'm wishing to use it for daily writing cursive.

The Sailor 21k sounds temping as the expressiveness without being too obviously wide is what I'm looking for, but perhaps not so wet as to guzzle ink too quickly. There haven't been many experiences with Sailor in this thread so it's very welcome.

I know what you mean ethernautrix about the cheating, but I suppose it was for the reason mentioned in post 16 as that's what I keep on reading. You may prefer the SU nib because it's not as wide as the music nibs but it's sharper.

I would have to rate the Pilot SU nib as without a doubt the least interesting, least expressive, least enjoyable of all of my stub nibs. To label it as boring would be overselling it I fear.


http://www.fototime.com/D4582F0D7262335/large.jpg

[Medieval]

Is it because it's said to be sharp?

[jar]

Is it because it's said to be sharp?

If that was addressed to me, it is because I have so many stub nib pens that are truly superb and so the Pilot stub is mediocre at best. If I had not used so many really great stubs I might have found it really nice but compared to a Sheaffer Fort Madison stub or Aurora stub or Montegrappa stub or even just a Montblanc "B" or wider nib the Pilot stub is simply boring.

[Jon Szanto]

If that was addressed to me, it is because I have so many stub nib pens that are truly superb and so the Pilot stub is mediocre at best. If I had not used so many really great stubs I might have found it really nice but compared to a Sheaffer Fort Madison stub or Aurora stub or Montegrappa stub or even just a Montblanc "B" or wider nib the Pilot stub is simply boring.

This is why individual responses, with regard to their content, are so much more meaningful than a tally of the number of people who say "yeah, I like that". Trying to come to a decision on a piece of technical gear - which this is - cannot be done as a popularity contest but only by weighing the relative merits of the opinions given. Whether or not you agree with a person like jar, you can see that he has broad experience (and broad nibs) and is able to compare the items under discussion with a good degree of expertise. This is the kind of response that is helpful.

[Medieval]

If that was addressed to me, it is because I have so many stub nib pens that are truly superb and so the Pilot stub is mediocre at best. If I had not used so many really great stubs I might have found it really nice but compared to a Sheaffer Fort Madison stub or Aurora stub or Montegrappa stub or even just a Montblanc "B" or wider nib the Pilot stub is simply boring.

This is why individual responses, with regard to their content, are so much more meaningful than a tally of the number of people who say "yeah, I like that". Trying to come to a decision on a piece of technical gear - which this is - cannot be done as a popularity contest but only by weighing the relative merits of the opinions given. Whether or not you agree with a person like jar, you can see that he has broad experience (and broad nibs) and is able to compare the items under discussion with a good degree of expertise. This is the kind of response that is helpful.
One person's opinion on it's own, no matter how much experience they have, is meaningless. Simply because their opinion reflects their tastes, not mine nor the majority nor even an accurate one.
Also, I asked jar earlier in post in post 10 to expand on his reasons for his opinions, but I've not heard anything more from him on the matter.





Is it because it's said to be sharp?

If that was addressed to me, it is because I have so many stub nib pens that are truly superb and so the Pilot stub is mediocre at best. If I had not used so many really great stubs I might have found it really nice but compared to a Sheaffer Fort Madison stub or Aurora stub or Montegrappa stub or even just a Montblanc "B" or wider nib the Pilot stub is simply boring.
Yes, sorry, I didn't bother to quote because you were the last person to reply.

[dfo]

What majority? I have never experienced any noticeable favoritism towards Sailor or Pilot music nibs. In fact, I have only heard the lauding of Platinum music nibs over the other mentioned brands.

I know that you are new to the forum, but Jar and Jon are legit. If you are not interested or desire to receive opinions or experience, why start this thread.

[Gobblecup]

I think that it’s somewhat condescending to make a post saying one person’s expertise is more helpful than everyone else’s, regardless of how prolifically they post or how specific their expertise may be. While yes a range of experiences with different nibs in the same style might be more helpful, that doesn’t mean the person reviewing those nibs shares the particularities of those they are talking to. I think the OP is entitled to their option to look for a variety of opinions and experiences. Maybe I’m taking things the wrong way, but it seemed like a tag team declaration that one opinion/experience trumped all others and that doesn’t come off in a very helpful way. Especially when Jar didn’t say exactly what about the Pilot nib was mediocre except saying it was.

[Medieval]

What majority? I have never experienced any noticeable favoritism towards Sailor or Pilot music nibs. In fact, I have only heard the lauding of Platinum music nibs over the other mentioned brands.

I know that you are new to the forum, but Jar and Jon are legit. If you are not interested or desire to receive opinions or experience, why start this thread.
Listen, do you see "Platinum" mentioned anywhere in the title of this thread? If not, please stop trying to make me consider a pen which I'm neither interested in nor have I asked for any opinions on. If you're not interested in being helpful, then go elsewhere if you don't mind.

[dfo]

I did not want to highjack this thread, but really? I never weighed the expertise of any members in this forum against the OP. Please reread my post.

The op was asking for opinions, received some opinions he/she/they did not like, and then judged it as meaningless.



I think that it’s somewhat condescending to make a post saying one person’s expertise is more helpful than everyone else’s, regardless of how prolifically they post or how specific their expertise may be. While yes a range of experiences with different nibs in the same style might be more helpful, that doesn’t mean the person reviewing those nibs shares the particularities of those they are talking to. I think the OP is entitled to their option to look for a variety of opinions and experiences. Maybe I’m taking things the wrong way, but it seemed like a tag team declaration that one opinion/experience trumped all others and that doesn’t come off in a very helpful way. Especially when Jar didn’t say exactly what about the Pilot nib was mediocre except saying it was.

[Jon Szanto]

While yes a range of experiences with different nibs in the same style might be more helpful, that doesn’t mean the person reviewing those nibs shares the particularities of those they are talking to. I think the OP is entitled to their option to look for a variety of opinions and experiences. Maybe I’m taking things the wrong way, but it seemed like a tag team declaration that one opinion/experience trumped all others and that doesn’t come off in a very helpful way. Especially when Jar didn’t say exactly what about the Pilot nib was mediocre except saying it was.

You have misjudged my commentary to a great degree. I tried to take pains to explain that I didn't want the OP to favor the nib I was mentioning, but to only give it due consideration. I am seeking to broaden the pool of data that the OP is using to make their choice. The fact that jar, whom I have known on forums for a number of years through agreements and disagreements, was only coincidental. That said, his comments showed a knowledge of not only the items in question but other nibs beyond that. That shows me an understanding not only of the individual respective nibs but also the technology (if you will) behind the entire category. Of course, having read the forums for a number of years and knowing his input, I already knew him to be a savvy owner and user of these writing instruments, and I have a lot of respect for his wisdom and experience. Which leads to:


I think that it’s somewhat condescending to make a post saying one person’s expertise is more helpful than everyone else’s, regardless of how prolifically they post or how specific their expertise may be.

Yeah, ok, whatever. Condescending? Please. It simply makes sense to give weight to an information stream that is of higher content, better s/n than the average response. If I go to a pen forum and ask advice about pulling a section, I might very well get some guy who has resacced a half dozen Esties telling me what to do (because he loves to share his thoughts) and I might very well get one of the reputable repair people who frequent some of these places, who have removed thousands of sections on Esties all the way out to the most problematic pens.

You seriously aren't proposing that both of those responses should be given equal weight, are you? Does my valuing the 2nd de-value the 1st? (No, it doesn't). No, it isn't condescending in the least to suggest that there are people who know more than I or you or others on some particular topic and that it might be a great thing to Really Listen To That Commentary if you are making some kind of decision. Yeah, I think that makes a great deal of sense and there is no judgemental attitude attached to it whatsoever.

[Jon Szanto]

One person's opinion on its own, no matter how much experience they have, is meaningless.

I seriously hope you never have to consult an oncologist. Good day to you.

[Gobblecup]

If that was addressed to me, it is because I have so many stub nib pens that are truly superb and so the Pilot stub is mediocre at best. If I had not used so many really great stubs I might have found it really nice but compared to a Sheaffer Fort Madison stub or Aurora stub or Montegrappa stub or even just a Montblanc "B" or wider nib the Pilot stub is simply boring.

This is why individual responses, with regard to their content, are so much more meaningful than a tally of the number of people who say "yeah, I like that". Trying to come to a decision on a piece of technical gear - which this is - cannot be done as a popularity contest but only by weighing the relative merits of the opinions given. Whether or not you agree with a person like jar, you can see that he has broad experience (and broad nibs) and is able to compare the items under discussion with a good degree of expertise. This is the kind of response that is helpful.

Saying “THIS IS THE KIND OF RESPOSNE THAT IS HELPFUL” makes it seem as if all other contributions to the thread were unhelpful and you weren’t even the OP so I don’t know why it was something you had to point out. Except to solidify that you thought everyone else commenting was inexperienced. It is entirely condescending. It makes it seem as if you know that every other poster in this thread DOESN’T know what they’re talking about. I’m not going to go into what experience I have or don’t have, I’ve handled plenty of stub nibs in my time. I simply feel you could be a little less of a irate fellow if you really do want to help new members and curious explorers of the fountain pen world and the others who wish to contribute to their experiences. If you can’t see how your landguage comes off then oh well, it’s a waste of time arguing about it, there aren’t enough voices on these forums or any as it is.

[SIR]

Thread went south, and not in a good way, quickly; obviously OP has preset/determined criteria and that's their prerogative but... civility, open mindedness, and respect for other's particular judgment - particularly when specifically requested - should prevail, right?

[SIR]

Relax and have a caipirinha (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caipirinha); that's what i'm doing ;).

[Gobblecup]

Also we’re not talking about expert fountain pen repair, we’re talking about nib preferences.... So why bring up those who have repaired thousands of pens? I felt that the OP was being ignored and others (myself included) demeaned, and I said something. People don’t need a PhD in fountain pens to participate.

[Gobblecup]

Relax and have a caipirinha (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caipirinha); that's what i'm doing ;).



That actually sounds like a great idea.

[SIR]

Relax and have a caipirinha (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caipirinha); that's what i'm doing ;).

That actually sounds like a great idea.

Your good health! ;)

[Jon Szanto]

It is entirely condescending.

If I felt like showing you condescension, you would very well know it. I have not.


Relax and have a caipirinha (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caipirinha); that's what i'm doing ;).

I've nursed a halfway decent Malbec part of the evening and now it's time for sleep. Have a good tomorrow!

[ethernautrix]

I would have to rate the Pilot SU nib as without a doubt the least interesting, least expressive, least enjoyable of all of my stub nibs. To label it as boring would be overselling it I fear.

This piques my interest even more, as I'm not looking for overt line variation. Over the years, I've enjoyed trying other pen friends' stub nibs, but I've learned that I like them while I'm trying them and not so much during extended writing sessions. So maybe Pilot is a good choice for me. (Also, I prefer hard nibs to soft and black ink to RAINBOWS! So perhaps I'm tempering the colors of my life with dull choices in pens and inks.) *Dog tap-dancing in sequined pants and top hat emoji*

[ethernautrix]

One person's opinion on its own, no matter how much experience they have, is meaningless.

I seriously hope you never have to consult an oncologist. Good day to you.

Dude.

C'mon.

[ethernautrix]

Guy says (Medieval, if you're not a guy, sorry), "Hey, after doing my due diligence, I've whittled my options down to these two specific brands and nibs types. Anyone have any feedback on these two specific brands and nibs that will help me choose between these two specific brands and nibs?"

Immediately, his due diligence is questioned.

After just over ten years of participating at fpn and in this forum (not much these past coupla years), I learned to answer the question. When someone asks for purchase options for a pen costing between $150 and $300, for instance, I don't hardsell him or her a Nakaya, even though Nakaya makes a very good and durable product and it is my favorite.

I might mention, "Hey, if you get to the $500 to $1,000 range -- as absurd as that sounds now -- you might want to consider a Nakaya, because (reasons)" after mentioning other pens in the price range requested.

I understand Medieval's frustration. If, like me, it takes a long time of considering this versus that versus the other thing and researching and comparing and then finally being able to dismiss all other options down to two -- then asking for opinions about those two options -- to have someone insist that I consider his favorite thing just because he's been on the boards for eight years, well, jesus christ. Frustrating!

The photo was helpful. Jon, you should have led with the photo.

[jar]

Also we’re not talking about expert fountain pen repair, we’re talking about nib preferences.... So why bring up those who have repaired thousands of pens? I felt that the OP was being ignored and others (myself included) demeaned, and I said something. People don’t need a PhD in fountain pens to participate.

No one has a right to not be demeaned.

Grow up.

[Jon Szanto]

The photo was helpful. Jon, you should have led with the photo.

Lisa, to be fair, I never insisted on anything. I only offered a counter-opinion to information I felt was not complete. I would have dropped it at that had the OP not distinctly stated that it didn't matter because every single opinion was equally valid. I happen to disagree with that. And to have an opinion, whether strong or not, does not denigrate another opinion - it is not a zero-sum game, it just doesn't overlook the fact that some people know more about what they are talking about than others.

A reading of my first offering would pretty clearly show that I meant no harm but only help, some extra illumination. OP seemed ok at that point. Then motives got questioned and the train ran South. I'm sorry that happened and I'll leave it all at that.

[Medieval]

The photo was helpful. Jon, you should have led with the photo.

Lisa, to be fair, I never insisted on anything. I only offered a counter-opinion to information I felt was not complete. I would have dropped it at that had the OP not distinctly stated that it didn't matter because every single opinion was equally valid. I happen to disagree with that. And to have an opinion, whether strong or not, does not denigrate another opinion - it is not a zero-sum game, it just doesn't overlook the fact that some people know more about what they are talking about than others.

A reading of my first offering would pretty clearly show that I meant no harm but only help, some extra illumination. OP seemed ok at that point. Then motives got questioned and the train ran South. I'm sorry that happened and I'll leave it all at that.

Thank you for your intentions of help, but going forward the best help you can give is to give experiences that will help me choose between the Pilot music nib and the Sailor music nib. Please, no other brand or type of pen.

[penwash]

Platinum music nib in a pen format that most people don't expect to see a music nib in:

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4724/25854679508_24b27a6dc8_c.jpg

[Sailor Kenshin]

I do have a Sailor Music nib, on a MINI Sapporo. It is a paintbrush. I can't access it now to see whether it's 14k or other, but apart from a couple of fude, this is the fattest, wettest nib I own.

I am a southpaw overwriter, too, so pens tend to write finer and dryer for me.

[Gobblecup]

Also we’re not talking about expert fountain pen repair, we’re talking about nib preferences.... So why bring up those who have repaired thousands of pens? I felt that the OP was being ignored and others (myself included) demeaned, and I said something. People don’t need a PhD in fountain pens to participate.

No one has a right to not be demeaned.

Grow up.

And no one has a right to deterimine what grown up behavior is, no matter how old they are. Bugger off!

[Gobblecup]

Also we’re not talking about expert fountain pen repair, we’re talking about nib preferences.... So why bring up those who have repaired thousands of pens? I felt that the OP was being ignored and others (myself included) demeaned, and I said something. People don’t need a PhD in fountain pens to participate.

No one has a right to not be demeaned.

Grow up.

And no one has a right to deterimine what grown up behavior is, no matter how old they are. Bugger off!

See we can all make absolute starements about our opinions on rights. But that’s right, your opinion counts for everything around here! I should have taken my shoes off and bowed before my retort.

Someone earlier suggested we should post with a mind to respect and civility, in what antiquated format of civil standards do people demean and show condescending atttitue towards their peers? Unless of course they don’t view others as peers but as unequal and lesser members of a group...

[wingwiper]

Hi wingwiper
Are you referring to vintage Platinum nibs being offering more line variation?
John Mottishaw is not an option for me as sending it there and back is not worth the cost, the effort, or the result. I consider the better option to be to choose the right pen.
I also don't think I will be considering vintage because I wish to keep things simple.

In case I have mistakenly led people up the garden path, I'm sorry, but I must clarify that line variation is not the most important feature otherwise I would buy a 1.5 or 1.9 Twsbi nib. Line variation is important, but only enough so that it can be distinguished from a standard round broad nib and enough to add some distinct panache to my writing.

I really don't want too much line variation and this is also why I've specifically chosen music nibs because they provide a maximum line width of approximately 1.1mm. Any more and it's just too much for me.

I'm liking the sound of the Pilot more than either the Sailor or Platinum because it has some softness, and that is the feature which will add more flair to my writing more than brute line variation.
Despite glowing reports from some people for the Platinum, it's not enough to counteract the high price and lack of softness as well as the large number of reports of being just ordinary.

The Sailor's 2 tines has practical advantages over the Pilot and Platinum in ease of use, so I'm surprised this hasn't been mentioned yet. It's also a consideration for why it's up against the Pilot while the Platinum is not being considered.

I would buy a Platinum Music Nib over the Pilot......, but that is me. My Pilot Music is nice, but a little on the fat side- however it does put down a wetter line.

Vintage Platinum I am speaking of is only ‘80’s-‘90’s so not so vintage

Of course my vintage Waterman, Warranted,Sheaffer, etc are all in league of their own[emoji41]




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[Jon Szanto]

Thank you for your intentions of help, but going forward the best help you can give is to give experiences that will help me choose between the Pilot music nib and the Sailor music nib. Please, no other brand or type of pen.

Please accept my direct apology for throwing the thread off-course and giving undesired input, no matter my intent. Your thread, your call, my fault for not keeping to that. Good luck on the nibs!

[Medieval]

Thank you for your intentions of help, but going forward the best help you can give is to give experiences that will help me choose between the Pilot music nib and the Sailor music nib. Please, no other brand or type of pen.

Please accept my direct apology for throwing the thread off-course and giving undesired input, no matter my intent. Your thread, your call, my fault for not keeping to that. Good luck on the nibs!
Apology accepted, and thank you.

[Medieval]

Hi wingwiper
Are you referring to vintage Platinum nibs being offering more line variation?
John Mottishaw is not an option for me as sending it there and back is not worth the cost, the effort, or the result. I consider the better option to be to choose the right pen.
I also don't think I will be considering vintage because I wish to keep things simple.

In case I have mistakenly led people up the garden path, I'm sorry, but I must clarify that line variation is not the most important feature otherwise I would buy a 1.5 or 1.9 Twsbi nib. Line variation is important, but only enough so that it can be distinguished from a standard round broad nib and enough to add some distinct panache to my writing.

I really don't want too much line variation and this is also why I've specifically chosen music nibs because they provide a maximum line width of approximately 1.1mm. Any more and it's just too much for me.

I'm liking the sound of the Pilot more than either the Sailor or Platinum because it has some softness, and that is the feature which will add more flair to my writing more than brute line variation.
Despite glowing reports from some people for the Platinum, it's not enough to counteract the high price and lack of softness as well as the large number of reports of being just ordinary.

The Sailor's 2 tines has practical advantages over the Pilot and Platinum in ease of use, so I'm surprised this hasn't been mentioned yet. It's also a consideration for why it's up against the Pilot while the Platinum is not being considered.

I would buy a Platinum Music Nib over the Pilot......, but that is me. My Pilot Music is nice, but a little on the fat side- however it does put down a wetter line.

Vintage Platinum I am speaking of is only ‘80’s-‘90’s so not so vintage

Of course my vintage Waterman, Warranted,Sheaffer, etc are all in league of their own[emoji41]




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks. As long as the line that the Pilot puts down is not too wet that it makes it appear almost like a broad, then I would be happy with that.

[Cyril]

I recently got a a Sailor with a Music nib. It is very disappointing as it is just a BB nib and I find it very wet and I never use it. I am planing to grind it to a medium cursive Italic and until then it is just laying in a drawer.
I believe the platinum is the best Music nib and then the pilot . But the pilot nib has some skipping issues than the platinum. It was shown in several reviews done by some good expert people who has given good examples.
Even though I had seen those reviews and I have five Sailor pens , I opted for a chance to try the sailor as the pen was very cheap with the music nib. So it is waiting for nib grind.

[Medieval]

Thanks Cyril. Sorry to hear of your disappointing experience though. The jury is still out but it's looking like I will opt for the Pilot.

Be great to hear of other people's experiences of the Pilot and the Sailor.

[Jon Szanto]

Medieval, FWIW: just be wary of confirmation bias, ok?

[Medieval]

Medieval, FWIW: just be wary of confirmation bias, ok?
I'll bear that in mind.

[Medieval]

Thank you to all who set out to help in this thread. After digesting the opinions together with reviews from other sources i decided to go with the Pilot.

Thanks again.

[dfo]

Thank you to all who set out to help in this thread. After digesting the opinions together with reviews from other sources i decided to go with the Pilot.

Thanks again.

Congrats. Pilot makes superb pens.