Ink Manufacturers?

[Brilliant Bill]

Does anyone know of a publicly available overview of the fountain pen ink manufacturing industry? I've seen market reports available, but they're for sale, and I'm not buying -- I'm curious but not THAT curious.

I started to wonder because Birmingham Pen Co. has some interesting ink colors (Or maybe I'm just overwhelmed by the interesting names? Like Allegheny Arsenal Gunpowder Black and Pennsylvania Railroad Boiler Steam Blue-Black?), and I've got a few samples. They claim to hand-make the ink in their Pittsburgh facility. They also say the inks are manufactured in Germany. I wonder what that means.

Over the years I've seen all sorts of claims (always unsubstantiated) that one manufacturer makes another brand's inks. I would not be surprised to learn there are only a few companies actually formulating and manufacturing inks while supplying them to many different brands. It's openly known, of course, about relations between Sailor and Bungu Box and a few other open relationships. But I don't have any overall answers for the whole marketplace, and I haven't found any answers in research I've done so far. Anyone know?

[aquafox]

I'm fairly sure that l'Artisan Pastellier is an independent manifacturer of inks.
Cheap and well behaved, too, on par with J. Herbin.
They just lack the glamour, or the marketing, of it.

[fountainpagan]

I'm fairly sure that l'Artisan Pastellier is an independent manifacturer of inks.
Cheap and well behaved, too, on par with J. Herbin.
They just lack the glamour, or the marketing, of it.

You are right. They are their own manufacturer, and yes their inks are very good, bt marketing wise they do not take care of t. however, Herbin is rising its objectives, and has a better marketing policy.

[Chrissy]

I would not be surprised to learn there are only a few companies actually formulating and manufacturing inks while supplying them to many different brands.
I'm in this camp. :thumb: Once you can find out the Country a particular ink brand is made in, you can sometimes narrow it down.
One example is that the Montblanc manufacturing facility is in Hamburg, Germany. However, their ink bottles state that the ink is made in Austria. There is a well known, large, ink manufacturer in Austria. So do they make it? I know for certain that this Austrian company makes inks for several other brands. Sometimes the ink manufacturers are required to keep this information secret, and sometimes they aren't.
Sailor has never kept secret the fact that they make inks for many Japanese stores.

[calamus]

I started to wonder because Birmingham Pen Co. has some interesting ink colors (Or maybe I'm just overwhelmed by the interesting names? Like Allegheny Arsenal Gunpowder Black and Pennsylvania Railroad Boiler Steam Blue-Black?), and I've got a few samples. They claim to hand-make the ink in their Pittsburgh facility. They also say the inks are manufactured in Germany. I wonder what that means.

Nicholas at Birmingham Pens told me in an email that their inks are manufactured in Germany by more than one company, and are blended there according to Birmingham Pen's formulæ, then shipped to Pittsburgh where they are bottled and labeled in small individual bottles. He also said they plan to start blending some German made inks in-house soon.

[FredRydr]

...There is a well known, large, ink manufacturer in Austria....
What is the Austrian company, and does it sell ink under it's own brand?

[AzJon]

...There is a well known, large, ink manufacturer in Austria....
What is the Austrian company, and does it sell ink under it's own brand?

Yeah, I'm drawing a blank on that one, too.

[Chrissy]

...There is a well known, large, ink manufacturer in Austria....
What is the Austrian company, and does it sell ink under it's own brand?
The Austrian company is Monteverde and it does sell ink under it's own brand. :)

[AzJon]

...There is a well known, large, ink manufacturer in Austria....
What is the Austrian company, and does it sell ink under it's own brand?
The Austrian company is Monteverde and it does sell ink under it's own brand. :)

Oh huh. I guess I never assumed Monteverde would have been the overarching ink maker. I assumed it must have been a separate company that produced Kaweco, Montblanc, and Monteverde.

[migo984]

If you are just considering the US/European ink brands there are relatively few large ink manufacturers, who produce for a number of ink labels. There are, however, still a number of smaller own label makers such as Robersons, Octopus, L’A Pastellier etc. If you go on to include world-wide makers then there are numerous, both large & small, in Eastern Europe/Russia, the Indian subcontinent, Asia, (especially China/Taiwan/S. Korea), Japan & Australasia. I only know of two in South America but I’m sure there are more.

[carlos.q]

....I only know of two in South America but I’m sure there are more.

Which are those? :noidea:

[arrow]

My guess is that all the brands sold from India and other places in Asia probably are made there, at least if the prices are noticeably different. I have assumed Pelikan still maked ink in the factory outside Hannover, but it needs to be confirmed. Parker have had ink and pen prodcutions all over the world since forever (I at least since 1950s). It needs a bit of investigation, and I don't think it's easy to get a full picture of the situation. Is there any close relation to production of printer inks?

[migo984]

Is there any close relation to production of printer inks?

Octopus in Germany primarily manufacture printer inks but also make fountain pen inks.

https://www.octopus-office.de/shop/en/printer-ink/fountain-pen-ink-writing-ink/

[SIR]

Well, 'tis a good question - who makes only their own inks, who makes inks for others; a bit like the nib manufacture question but a bit more involved.

Can we start a sticky called something like 'know your inks'?

[aquafox]

Is there any close relation to production of printer inks?

Octopus in Germany primarily manufacture printer inks but also make fountain pen inks.

https://www.octopus-office.de/shop/en/printer-ink/fountain-pen-ink-writing-ink/

Hm. Yes, Octopus seems to be quite a big company.
I suspect they make ink for Cleo Skribent, despite the claim of being handmade in Germany by Cleo Skribent itself.
The bottle of black I bought seemed quite similar to Pelikan, although I'm no ink connaisseur and I may just lack the fine taste of others.



in Eastern Europe/Russia

Gamma, huh?




...There is a well known, large, ink manufacturer in Austria....
What is the Austrian company, and does it sell ink under it's own brand?
The Austrian company is Monteverde and it does sell ink under it's own brand. :)

Monteverde does not produce inks, nor pens. They outsource.

[Chrissy]

Monteverde does not produce inks, nor pens. They outsource.
Where to?

[arrow]

My latest bottle of Parker Quink is made in France. My Pelikan inks a Blue-Black 4001 and an Edelstein Onyx are made in Germany.

[calamus]

I recently bought a bottle of Kaweco Paradise Blue and it said "Made In Austria" on the bottle, but I have no idea by what company.

[Chrissy]

I recently bought a bottle of Kaweco Paradise Blue and it said "Made In Austria" on the bottle, but I have no idea by what company.

I have previously tried to find out what this ink manufacturing facility in Austria is called without much success. :(

[aquafox]

Monteverde does not produce inks, nor pens. They outsource.
Where to?

China for pens. Conklin Victory (top) is a Baoer 517 (bottom).

https://www.cultpens.com/imgs/products/cp/450x450_fitPad/CK57967-ZZZ~Conklin-Victory-Fountain-Pen-Ruby-Red_P1.jpg

https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1J6oVJVXXXXX2XFXXq6xXFXXXN/BAOER-517-Orange-Red-Line-Business-Medium-Nib-Fountain-Pens-Silver-Trim-New.jpg_640x640.jpg

the Monteverde Monza (top) is a rebranded Jinhao 992 (bottom)

http://www.monteverdepens.com/images/monza_top_banner.jpg

https://www.picclickimg.com/d/w1600/pict/163504963598_/Penna-stilografica-Jinhao-992-trasparente-chiusura-a-vite.jpg

While Austria for bottled inks and Germany (schmidt I heard) for ballpoint and rollerball refills.

[Chrissy]

While Austria for bottled inks and Germany (schmidt I heard) for ballpoint and rollerball refills.
Please can we start again? We were talking about Monteverde making inks, not pens, and I suggested that they were ink manufacturers who made ink brands in Austria until you replied: "Monteverde does not produce inks, nor pens. They outsource." So are you now agreeing that their inks are made in Austria, but that they are made under some other brand name rather than Monteverde? You lost me. :confused::confused:

[AzJon]

So, doing a search for chemical companies specializing in dyes and inks, there are any number of main manufacturers that could be producing those inks that isn't owned by any of the aforementioned companies.

To give an example, where I lived in Germany, there was a chocolate factory just over the boarder in Switzerland. That chocolate company sold their own brand chocolate at the factory only but was in production to make chocolate for other companies with no trace of where it came from other than "Made in Switzerland". I found some of their chocolate sold at Trader Joe's in the States at one point (they had a distinctive packaging and bar mold I could pick out). I reckon that this is the same deal with the manufacturer of Montblanc, Kaweco, and Monteverde. That said, it is also possible that they are in fact made in different facilities throughout Austria.

[FredRydr]

Perhaps a German-speaker has access to the Austrian equivalent of the American ThomCat or Thomasnet directory for ink manufacturers, e.g. https://www.thomasnet.com/browse/chemicals/inks-1.html These used to be in reference libraries in large multivolume sets, and I expect most industrialized nations have their equal. It's been decades since I needed them (when they were in book form).

[AzJon]

Perhaps a German-speaker has access to the Austrian equivalent of the American ThomCat or Thomasnet directory for ink manufacturers, e.g. https://www.thomasnet.com/browse/chemicals/inks-1.html These used to be in reference libraries in large multivolume sets, and I expect most industrialized nations have their equal. It's been decades since I needed them (when they were in book form).

That's kinda what I was looking over this morning. I went through lists of chemical companies, but didn't find anything definitive.

Ptero lives in Austria, maybe he can lend a hand an have a look. If he sees this thread, of course.

[calamus]

When I was corresponding with Nick at Birmingham Pens about his German-made inks and I told him I had heard they were made by De Atramentis and asked if that were correct, he replied that they were made by more than one company, and that he wasn't allowed to reveal their names. FWIW.