Learning Engrosser's Script

[JazzDoc]

Past three or four weeks I've jumped in and have been trying to learn Engrosser's script (Copperplate, Zanerian, etc.). Some really great resources are the IAMPETH website, Dr. Joe Vitolo's articles, a terrific DVD by Wm.Lilly, and a few books such as Mastering Copperplate Calligraphy.

I'm using HP 24lb laser paper, an oblique pen holder, either Higgins Eternal or McCaffrey's (iron gall) ink, and a variety of pointed pens, my favorites being Hunt 101, Zebra G, Hiro 40 and Hunt 108 crowquill.

Here's where I'm at after these few weeks (a practice sample I did this morning, took about 20-30 minutes) - please critique ruthlessly and offer any suggestions you might have. Truly fun to approach this beautiful form.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y28/b_d_bop/MorningSessionb_zpsde29c6ae.jpg (http://s2.photobucket.com/user/b_d_bop/media/MorningSessionb_zpsde29c6ae.jpg.html)

[earthdawn]

I had to read your post 3 times to be sure I understood that YOU wrote the page above....

WOW .. BRAVO ... and yes in all caps!

Now experts can critique and tell you what needs improving. I am not one of those for sure, your writing looks beautiful. Line variation and structure of the letters look fantastic!!

I hope someday to write that well.

[AndyT]

I can only echo the above: the sample is very impressive. English copperplate and American engrossers' script must be the two toughest pointed pen challenges going, because of the discipline and precision. I'm just an interested party and emphatically no penman, and therefore flatly refuse to offer a critique!

If you have some time to spare and can put up with dismal sound and picture quality, you may find it interesting to go through some of the videos here:

http://vimeo.com/user8301158/videos

There's good historical information and some practical observations which I haven't come across elsewhere.

[JazzDoc]

Thanks Andy and earthdawn. Lots of fun, but it does require some focus!

Thanks for the link, too, Andy! I'm on my way to view it.

[Marsilius]

Looks like real doctor's handwriting? :)

[JazzDoc]

Looks like real doctor's handwriting? :)

HA!!! Just like my chart notes, riiiiiiight.
Wouldn't that be a riot, though?
'Course everything's from a keyboard these days - shame.


- The preceding post is dispatched from my iPhone viaTapatalk. All waivers apply. /MP

[MisterBoll]

Very nice writing. I wish I could write in this style.

One thing you need to work on is letter and word spacing. It would make a big difference is so far as the flow and legibility.

[KrazyIvan]

Critique ruthlessly? Um... really? Actually, I don't think I can. Beautiful script.

[jbb]

Gorgeous!

[JazzDoc]

Very nice writing. I wish I could write in this style.

One thing you need to work on is letter and word spacing. It would make a big difference is so far as the flow and legibility.
Absolutely I figured first I'd work on the letter forms & shading, then the spacing, slanting and finer points. As I said, you really need focus for this style - and a relaxed pen grip with muscle & finger control.
Thanks for your input. Spot on.

[JazzDoc]

Critique ruthlessly? Um... really? Actually, I don't think I can. Beautiful script.
Thanks, KrazyIvan, but there are plenty of parameters which need refinement. Regardless, I'm so pleased you liked it!

[KrazyIvan]

Critique ruthlessly? Um... really? Actually, I don't think I can. Beautiful script.
Thanks, KrazyIvan, but there are plenty of parameters which need refinement. Regardless, I'm so pleased you liked it!

I just read MisterBoll's response and I agree if it makes you feel better. ;) :D

It is still way better than anything I could do.

[MisterBoll]

It was not my intent to be rude or critical. My intent was to be helpful.

The writing is lovely but from my years spent spec'ing type I am very sensitive, for lack of another word, to letter and word spacing.

Rest assured KrazyIvan I shall never utter a post in your direction.

[KrazyIvan]

It was not my intent to be rude or critical. My intent was to be helpful.

The writing is lovely but from my years spent spec'ing type I am very sensitive, for lack of another word, to letter and word spacing.

Rest assured KrazyIvan I shall never utter a post in your direction.

I think there is some misunderstanding or something I am not getting. Please note the use of emoticons in my response. I do it specifically so there is no misunderstanding and to show I am being playful. I am not sure why you would not want to utter a post in my direction. If I offended you, I apologize. I did not think you were being rude or critical and my original response was directed directly at the good doctor. He was the one that requested a ruthless critique.

I actually think you are spot on after going back and looking at the script closer. That was my only intent in referencing your post.

[JazzDoc]

Critique ruthlessly? Um... really? Actually, I don't think I can. Beautiful script.
Thanks, KrazyIvan, but there are plenty of parameters which need refinement. Regardless, I'm so pleased you liked it!

I just read MisterBoll's response and I agree if it makes you feel better. ;) :D

It is still way better than anything I could do.
Well I feel much better now!
;^]

Thanks again.

[woosang]

lovely script.

[DGG]

Beautiful font and really very nicely done! It is such a shame to see the importance of handwriting fading from modern society. Many primary schools are abandoning the teaching of cursive. Very misguided.

Wish I had any advice to give you, but I'm really in awe of your technique. I've been actually so disgusted with my lack of care in writing over the years, that I have begun to force myself to write in a more considered and refined cursive in stead of print. Only problem was that for a while I would chuckle at myself thinking through making letters like a first grader. :haha:Hahahaha.

Anyway, practice and patience has helped immensely, and I'm feeling good about the progress. These are baby steps compared with the calligraphy you are working on, but it reminded me of my own care and interest in handwriting. I'm sure the more you continue to work in this engrosser's script, the more at ease you will become with the gestures and flow. Enjoy!

[JazzDoc]

Thanks so very much, woosang and DGG!!

Here's a letter i wrote to my sister yesterday. Step by step progress, long way to go...

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y28/b_d_bop/PENS-DearLaurie_zps561e0442.jpg (http://s2.photobucket.com/user/b_d_bop/media/PENS-DearLaurie_zps561e0442.jpg.html)

[KrazyIvan]

Even a stylized smiley? Hats off to you Doc.

[ThriveToScribe]

Past three or four weeks I've jumped in and have been trying to learn Engrosser's script (Copperplate, Zanerian, etc.). Some really great resources are the IAMPETH website, Dr. Joe Vitolo's articles, a terrific DVD by Wm.Lilly, and a few books such as Mastering Copperplate Calligraphy.

I'm using HP 24lb laser paper, an oblique pen holder, either Higgins Eternal or McCaffrey's (iron gall) ink, and a variety of pointed pens, my favorites being Hunt 101, Zebra G, Hiro 40 and Hunt 108 crowquill.

Here's where I'm at after these few weeks (a practice sample I did this morning, took about 20-30 minutes) - please critique ruthlessly and offer any suggestions you might have. Truly fun to approach this beautiful form.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y28/b_d_bop/MorningSessionb_zpsde29c6ae.jpg (http://s2.photobucket.com/user/b_d_bop/media/MorningSessionb_zpsde29c6ae.jpg.html)



Beautiful! Where do you obtain the oblique pen holder, and does it take its own point or can you use your other nibs to write this way?
I need to check out IAMPETH. Thank you for sharing this.

(P.S. None of my doctors write like this! ):thank_you2:

[JazzDoc]

Beautiful! Where do you obtain the oblique pen holder, and does it take its own point or can you use your other nibs to write this way?
I need to check out IAMPETH. Thank you for sharing this.

(P.S. None of my doctors write like this! ):thank_you2:

Thanks for the nice words!
Two great sources for this "gear" (oblique nib holders, nibs, books on the subject, etc.) are http://www.paperinkarts.com/ and http://www.johnnealbooks.com/prod_detail_list/133.

Definately take advantage of the IAMPETH web site's articles and posts!

[Marsilius]

Spelling Police Alert:
"Definitely"
(Spoil sport)

[JazzDoc]

You're right, and thanks - I saw that after I mailed it. DAMMIT!!! :boom:

[Marsilius]

Damn it. (I couldn't resist!!!!)
Of course Dammit is in the dikshunerry.
I also like "that demm'd elusive Pimpernel".

[AndyT]

The letter looks superb, Doc. There's a confidence to some of the capitals which is positively jaunty. :)

[JazzDoc]

Damn it. (I couldn't resist!!!!)
Of course Dammit is in the dikshunerry.
I also like "that demm'd elusive Pimpernel". HA! That was purposeful, Marsilius. If I wrote it your way (the actual way) I could be banned for bad language, no? :whip:

[JazzDoc]

The letter looks superb, Doc. There's a confidence to some of the capitals which is positively jaunty. :)
Thanks, Andy. That's how it feels when you fashion some of those letters, too!!
By the way, your part of the world is my favorite anywhere - I've photographed the Ribbleshead Aqueduct at great length on a few occasions, and I've had the best rack of lamb with mint sauce in Ingleton EVER!!! A favorite town to see is Haworth against the hills north of it. We have dear friends in Clitheroe, Lanc (fellow bulldoggers). Lucky YOU!! :thumb:

[Marsilius]

I knew that was intentional, and it is official, too. I also love Yorkshire!

[woosang]

That smiley is amazing

[AndyT]

By the way, your part of the world is my favorite anywhere - I've photographed the Ribbleshead Aqueduct at great length on a few occasions, and I've had the best rack of lamb with mint sauce in Ingleton EVER!!! A favorite town to see is Haworth against the hills north of it. We have dear friends in Clitheroe, Lanc (fellow bulldoggers). Lucky YOU!! :thumb:

Why thank you! Haworth is about three miles away in one direction, and our kitchen window faces Ilkley Moor in t'other. The weather might leave a little to be desired, but the view is always grand. :)

[snedwos]

WEST Yorkshire? Harrumph... Foreigners...

Just joking, my grandfather's from Morley.