Why big nibs?

[scud80]

I have several pens with large nibs: King of Pen, M1000, MB149. I'm not actually sure why I enjoy them so much, but I do. Functionally they don't seem to me to do too much aside from moving the hand slightly farther away from the paper. I mostly just like the way they look. I really want to get a Namiki Emperor as well, and the enormous nib is a fair part of my interest in it. Is there actually any functional reason to use larger nibs, or is it just an aesthetic thing? I don't know any of the history regarding nib size.

[Jon Szanto]

https://forddaily.net/attachments/bigfoots-worlds-first-lifted-truck-1-jpg.2402/

[mathew]

I have several pens with large nibs: King of Pen, M1000, MB149. I'm not actually sure why I enjoy them so much, but I do. Functionally they don't seem to me to do too much aside from moving the hand slightly farther away from the paper. I mostly just like the way they look. I really want to get a Namiki Emperor as well, and the enormous nib is a fair part of my interest in it. Is there actually any functional reason to use larger nibs, or is it just an aesthetic thing? I don't know any of the history regarding nib size.

The longer the nib, the more character there can be to the writing experience based upon how the manufacturer uses that length. Different nib geometries/shapes, as well as differences in what metals are included in the gold alloy, can lead to dramatic differences in how the nibs write.

[Pterodactylus]

I have several pens with large nibs: King of Pen, M1000, MB149. I'm not actually sure why I enjoy them so much, but I do. Functionally they don't seem to me to do too much aside from moving the hand slightly farther away from the paper. I mostly just like the way they look. I really want to get a Namiki Emperor as well, and the enormous nib is a fair part of my interest in it. Is there actually any functional reason to use larger nibs, or is it just an aesthetic thing? I don't know any of the history regarding nib size.

The longer the nib, the more character there can be to the writing experience based upon how the manufacturer uses that length. Different nib geometries/shapes, as well as differences in what metals are included in the gold alloy, can lead to dramatic differences in how the nibs write.

I don’t agree to this statements.

“Character” is not bound to nib size at all.

Look e.g. at this tiny 100 year old Waterman, this tiny pen with it’s tiny nib has massive character.
In fact it is one of my all time favorite nibs, one of my best (maybe the best) flex nib I own.

https://live.staticflickr.com/1548/25030483182_25a3dde41b_o.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/E8RLAS)Show_response_868 (https://flic.kr/p/E8RLAS)

(Waterman 12 1/2 ..... J. Herbin Emerald of Chivor)


Also a specific nib material is not bound to any specific attribute of the nib.
To say e.g. gold nibs feel soft or …. Is completely nonsense (you also always write with the tipping material, the nib material does not touch the paper).
There are gold nails and steel nails as well as gold flex nibs and steel flex nibs.

e.g. this vintage Degussa full flex steel nib (Hosted in a modern Guider Marsala body)…. Also not a huge nib….

https://live.staticflickr.com/732/22788105067_984341f2d3_o.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/AHGZHe)Frankenpen_Response_02 (https://flic.kr/p/AHGZHe)

(Guider Marala - Degussa Vintage Full Flex Steel Nib)


IMO the size of a nib is more a design option than anything else.
Also a matter of personal preference, but not related to specific nib attributes,

Last but not least pen manufacturers can take much more money for bigger pens, as it seems to be deeply engraved into many brains that bigger is better (and more expensive).
For sure the size of the nib/pen does not correlate with the material value, the additional material value is marginal between a big and a small pen.

[whichwatch]

I Like Big Nibs and I Cannot Lie

I'm not so sure why, but in my case I think it is simple aesthetics. It's hard to make King of Pen or MB 149 nibs look small, but I do have a couple that accomplish that. Left to Right in photo are King of Pen, Montblanc 149, Namiki Emperor (#50), and Tohma Hachikuma (#55)

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51658774946_425656cbb9_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2mGUJ2y)

[penwash]

Big nibs looks cool on the right-sized pens. If you like big nibs for the looks, then go for them.

But the size has nothing to do with what the nib can produce.

If anything after years of restoring vintage pens, I learn to *never* underestimate small nibs. Some of the best flexible nibs are downright tiny.

[Blue Note]

https://forddaily.net/attachments/bigfoots-worlds-first-lifted-truck-1-jpg.2402/

Is that your daily driver, Jon?:rockon:

[bunnspecial]

Most of my big nib experience is with 149s.

I've had MBs ranging from the tiny little #2 nibs on the 142 as well as the "butterfly nibs" of the 12/14/22/24 on up to #9s on 149s. I've written a lot with 146s and other pens with MB #6 nibs(like a lot of the LEs).

To me, there's something very special about the overall feel of the big MB nibs. That's not to say that the smaller ones lack character-far from it. It's just that 149s write like no other MB I've used.

There's a strange aesthetic that makes that nib really work on the 149 sized pen too.

[Jon Szanto]

Is that your daily driver, Jon?:rockon:

Hahahaha... nope. :D

As to nibs, I think big nibs have a place, and that is usually in a big pen. I get that some people like that it puts distance between hand and nib and paper, but that has a lot to do with the barrel design as well. The only thing I raise my eyebrows at are people who chase big nibs just to have big nibs in their pens, even if the nib is aesthetically too large. At least a portion of these cases is compensation for being small in other areas and bragging rights. That kind of behavior is just lame to me, but to each their own.

[bunnspecial]

Is that your daily driver, Jon?:rockon:

Hahahaha... nope. :D

As to nibs, I think big nibs have a place, and that is usually in a big pen. I get that some people like that it puts distance between hand and nib and paper, but that has a lot to do with the barrel design as well.

I agree that a big nib needs to fit in an appropriately sized pen.

If you look at the stereotypical "big pen", the 149, the nib just fits the overall "package" of the pen. After looking at a bunch of them, I can generally "spot" a 149 nib from a photo without any scale reference based on the overall proportions of the nib. With that said, if I put up a photo of either a 146 or 149(or 147...) without anything else for scale/reference many people without experience handling these pens would struggle to tell which it was.

Much the same can be said of comparing an M800 to an M1000, or a 1911L to a KOP.

My point in all of this is that those three pens have "scaled" the nib size roughly in proportion to the rest of the pen. Not all the big nib pens do that overly well.

Along those same lines, I have a Ranga 9B(premium ebonite), which is a pen I like on the whole. Mine has a Ranga Flex nib on it, which I think is #6 sized(and looks a whole lot like an Ahab nib) but most Ranga pens in general are made with #6 nibs from Ranga, Bock, or Schmidt. That nib looks okay in relation to the stepped-down section(which I actually find comfortable on that pen-I don't like them in general) but to my eye it looks awfully small on the pen as a whole.

I feel much the same too about a lot of the newer MB Great Characters and the like pens, which are chunky pens with 146(#6) size nibs.

[Jon Szanto]

I agree that a big nib needs to fit in an appropriately sized pen.

To be clear, I'm not really even addressing the situations where a brand new LARGE pen comes with a corresponding LARGE nibs. No, it is more a case of watching people modding other over-the-counter pens and trying to swap in the biggest nib they can. There's a whole fad of putting #8 nibs in pocket pens. It looks stupid (to me) and can't have anything really in the way of functionality beyond "because I can" and macho swagger.

[BoBo Olson]

In I favor medium-small like a 140, standard like a P-75 or 400 or medium large like a Osmia 76 or a Pelikan 600, I'm not into big pens and or big nibs. I do have a 1000 and a 149, some 146's.

I have what we'd call today a medium large...actually looks smaller than it measures so a large pre'24 MB Safety Pen with a #6 Simplo nib that really looks big when it is twisted out of the pen.
I would have thought the pen medium-large, if that, until I put it next to a 800....and the old nib is bigger.
The nib does look a bit big for the pen, but it is a Weak Kneed Wet Noodle, and that then perhaps was the normal size of a nib for a Safety Pen of that era. What we grew up with influences what we think of as a big nib, the youth who grew up with large pens as their standard ones, don't see a 149's nib as big as I do.

I did have one bigger than a 149's nib on a no name pen, but I gave it away.....the nib was just way too big for me, and I didn't keep it long enough to become accustomed to it.


https://i.imgur.com/lnHrQjX.jpg

With permission of Penboard.de they make great pictures, I don't. My '30's Fend Safety Pen has a smaller nib. Yet is not much longer. And only slightly thinner, but the nib size seems better matched. My 18 K rolled Gold Fendomatic has a slightly different chased pattern than the one shown.
https://i.imgur.com/UPQpECd.jpg

[Detman101]

64715
I have to admit that I LOVE big oversized pens...they just fit my hand better.
However, the only nibs that have stood the test of time are my #2 Mabie Todd Swan flex and my #5 Delike Alpha stub. Both miniscule pens...
All of my large flex nibs have presented some issue given enough time and use...while the Swan keeps doing it's thing without failing.
It says a lot about quality and the fact that it's Gold speaks volumes to me. If it were only bigger it would be my #1 pen...sadly, I can't write with it more than a paragraph without hand cramps.

So in the end...for me...Bigger just feels better.
(hahaha...that's what she said!)

[couldn't resist...lol]

[Wile E Coyote]

Because, whatever anyone says, size matters.

[pajaro]

Large brain.

[Lloyd]

You know what they say.... big nib, big feed.
Wouldn't the bigger feed give the potential for better ink flow, slower dry out?

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

[penwash]

Because, whatever anyone says, size matters.

Size impress(es).

Whether that impression will matter in the long run or not, that's a different discussion.

[christof]

The longer the nib, the more character there can be to the writing experience based upon how the manufacturer uses that length. Different nib geometries/shapes, as well as differences in what metals are included in the gold alloy, can lead to dramatic differences in how the nibs write.

Actually, I think there is something to it.
Of course, there are other factors like geometry and grinding that give a nib character, but size is not to be underrated at all, especially when it comes to flexibility. The larger the nib, the greater the possible line variance.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51062774727_0b5d4e7322_c.jpg

And yes, of course there are also aesthetic reasons.

[Lloyd]

Bragging rights

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

[Empty_of_Clouds]

If the aesthetics of nib size was based on proportion to other elements of the pen, then presumably there would be a formula for a pen that has perfectly balanced elements. Just a thought.

[scud80]

I definitely find the Tohma pens intriguing, but I don't like the carbon-fiber look of their normal pens and the urushi ones are far too expensive for me. Maybe I'll get to try one at a pen show sometime to see how it feels (anybody in LA own one?). With a nib that big it almost seems like it would put the hand too far away from the contact point to be comfortable.

[bunnspecial]

a. What we grew up with influences what we think of as a big nib, the youth who grew up with large pens as their standard ones, don't see a 149's nib as big as I do.

I'd probably be classed as a "youth" given I'm in my early 30s and have never been around FPs as a primary writing instrument.

Still, I think that it's incorrect to call big pens/nibs a modern phenomenon. Lest we not forget that the 149 has been continuously produced for nearly 70 years now, and as part of my collection I specifically seek out larger pens. Even relatively common pens like the 1920s Parker Duofold Senior are the size of a modern 146, give or take. I have pens specifically sold in the 30s as Oversize including the Vacumatic and Balance.

Lest we not forget also that Montblanc once made, if I'm not mistaken, eyedroppers/safeties/button fillers with a size 12 nib, and I think Waterman went up to a size 20 or so.

[pajaro]

Easier to see a big nib when your eyesight wanes.

[BoBo Olson]

My MB Safety Pen only has a size 6 nib so must be a small one. Just a touch longer than a Pelikan 600 with longer nib of course.
My day was late '50-s-mid 60's for fountain pens. And no one was using old '30's fountain pens then. I didn't even know what they looked like. A P-51 was an old pen. Even if still the Prince of Pens.

One did strive to keep up with the Jones even with Wearevers, one had to keep up to date. Even if better made, one didn't use post war Wearever fountain pens any more than one drove an 8 year old car.
(Outside of us...but the '49 Buick Roadmaster was still a solid 'powerful' car.) There was a jump of HP in the mid '50's as the Mercury muscle car came in.....like with in the last 5 or 6 years with the basic 500 HP car. When Ferrari just wrecks a 750HP test car, 500HP is no longer much to write home about.)

[KBeezie]

Size doesn't matter as much to me as long as I can see the point and orientation of the nib well. That seems a tad easier on a larger one versus a skinny partially hooded nib (though a larger nib hooded which isn't likely to happen. Would probably have the same drawback).

And at least the bigger vintage ones I've tried felt nicer to me than the modern, is reiterates that the size isn't the only thing that changes the feel if anything.

So I just think it's mainly about appearance, preference if it matters how you see it, and mostly a luxury to have it big.

[although]

It seems to me that, from a design standpoint, once the ink leaves the safety of the barrel it is in danger of drying out and causing problems. Big nibs leave a lot more acreage for air to contact ink. I see big nibs as a risk factor when it comes to reliability. I think there is a reason that the Parker 51 has a reputation as being a reliable writer. Big nibs look cool. I've got a 149, and it's a lovely pen. But, I feel like any pen maker has chosen a more difficult path when they go for the giant nibs...

[Jon Szanto]

I've got a 149, and it's a lovely pen. But, I feel like any pen maker has chosen a more difficult path when they go for the giant nibs...

Which begs your own question: is the pen still reliable? Does the ink "dry out and cause problems"? Where theory and practice meet is right in your hand.

[vdiantonio]

This is a very interesting question and I've been watching the replies with interest. I like big nibs on my pens and, conversely, I don't like small nibs on my pens. (I also don't like very large pens, rather I like smaller pens with big nibs!) The Edison Beaumont is one of my very favorite pens precisely because its a smaller pen (when posted) with a larger pen nib (#6 I think). Disturbingly, I'm not sure I can adequately articulate why I like big nibs. It must be the aesthetic beauty of large nib running over the paper, its the only way I can describe it. Or maybe its due to the BIG FORD PICKUP factor that someone else posted a picture of!