No Taste

[Empty_of_Clouds]

No real reason to post.

[Pterodactylus]

You make this sound like a bad thing.
Actually for me it isn’t.

We have a lot in common, I also like different pens (with respect to any aspect), although I favor flexible nibs in particular.
I‘m no calligrapher nor I never will be one (and have not the intention to become one).
I‘m also no collector.
I have no preferred hand regarding writing, I like to try always something new out.

This is a phenomen of my whole life, not only regarding pens.
Also in work I was never a narrowed specialized geek in the specific topic (I’m an IT guy).
I enjoy working in different fields, learn something new, but be also bored quite easy always doing the same thing.
I would describe myself as a generalist, knowing quite a bit of many things, but not being an absolutely expert in one area, and I like it that way.
Some might say I’m not an expert in any field and they are right, but who cares, and it is similar for me in the pen topic.

[Robalone]

EofC. Dude....you echo many of the sentiments I also have.
Being relatively new to fora in general, I have spent a long long time ....out in the wilderness , thinking no one else is as crazy as me .
I love writing. With anything , I can mimic styles ....I used to forge notes from my mum by copying her writing !!
Like you I love different styles of script , and seek out fonts to learn .
I spent years just doing a journal with ballpoints, and used to do different styles etc..

I was surprised as hell to find there was people that had the same interest as me.

I love pre war BHR very much, but also have a swath of Phileas pens, Parker 45s , Waterman 40s and several quite modern ones.

I love this . Thanks for your post 👍🏻

[catbert]

EoC, your experience doesn't sound weird at all. I've also reached a kind of disengagement, though I still have fairly clear aesthetic preferences, which means a higher likelihood of satisfaction if I follow them.

Often the 'rocky engagement' you mention seems as much with yourself as with us lot. You are too hard on yourself. What little I've seen of your handwriting, your artwork, and the pens you've retained is admirable.

I guess we've all been affected by online enthusiasm at one time or another. Hoping to experience such overt, performative enthusiasm oneself may be unrealistic, unnatural, out of character even.

[Chip]

Other than on forums (FPN, this one) I've not been around other fountain pen fans. Except for a writer friend who sends me her junkshop finds. Her parents used Esterbrook pens, so I've restored several and returned them as gifts.

My father and grandfather used Sheaffers, which are a family totem. The first pen I bought new was a Sheaffer/Levenger Connaisseur Mediterranean (it was bright blue).

In San Francisco, I went to an upmarket shop that sold Montblanc pens, pricey watches, and other executive gear. The counter guy was so snotty, obviously reluctant to let me test even the lowest-priced Montblanc, that I exited in a huff and found another store, an art supply, with a nice selection and pleasant staff, where I bought a Parker Duofold International in grey pearl.

That first impression gave me a lifelong dislike for Montblanc pens, and I've never thought of buying one. Not rational, p'raps, but there it is.

My collection takes in iconic American brands (Sheaffer, Parker, Conklin, Wahl Eversharp) along with Conway Stewart, Aurora, and Pelikan. If a pen doesn't suit me as a writer, I sell or trade it. So at this point, nearly all the pens in my cases have passed that personal test.

[Pterodactylus]

Other than on forums (FPN, this one) I've not been around other fountain pen fans. Except for a writer friend who sends me her junkshop finds. Her parents used Esterbrook pens, so I've restored several and returned them as gifts.

My father and grandfather used Sheaffers, which are a family totem. The first pen I bought new was a Sheaffer/Levenger Connaisseur Mediterranean (it was bright blue).

In San Francisco, I went to an upmarket shop that sold Montblanc pens, pricey watches, and other executive gear. The counter guy was so snotty, obviously reluctant to let me test even the lowest-priced Montblanc, that I exited in a huff and found another store, an art supply, with a nice selection and pleasant staff, where I bought a Parker Duofold International in grey pearl.

That first impression gave me a lifelong dislike for Montblanc pens, and I've never thought of buying one. Not rational, p'raps, but there it is.

My collection takes in iconic American brands (Sheaffer, Parker, Conklin, Wahl Eversharp) along with Conway Stewart, Aurora, and Pelikan. If a pen doesn't suit me as a writer, I sell or trade it. So at this point, nearly all the pens in my cases have passed that personal test.

I had to smile when I read your story.
A very similar thing happened to me when I was a young man and resulted in a long lasting dislike of a specific brand.
I completely understand your feelings.

For me it was not pens it was cars.
My mother had a small taxi business (only 2 cars) and planned to buy a new car as replacement for one of her taxis (the one she drove).
So I took over the task to make a preselection of possible cars which she might like.

I went through quite a long list of car dealers (here most dealers are bound to one specific brand).
As said, I was a really young man, surprisingly all the pricy premium car dealers, like Mercedes, BMW or Audi treated me respectful and took me serious, it was no problem to schedule test drives and all my questions were answered in detail, they showed me their cars and options.
I felt welcomed as potential customer.

Then I entered the showroom of a Skoda dealer and faced the same snotty reluctant behavior you described.
I felt completely disregarded, they neither answered my questions properly nor showed me their cars (which are not the premium league) only questioned if I would be able to buy one of their cars.
Soon I left their building with a bitter feeling and a big disliking of the brand (which lasted very very long) not only of that specific dealer.
I wouldn’t have bought a car there even the alternative would have meant only riding a bike.
My mother finally bought an Audi (also based on my recommendation).

Salespersons which act like that on potential customers should imho immediately get fired, because they obviously are not qualified for their jobs.


Not so long ago I had a experience not that crass, but also with a total incompetent salesperson (again with cars).
I drive Mercedes since over 20 years, but a few years ago I looked for a new car and considered also different brands.
I entered with my son a Volvo showroom, nobody but us in the room, the salesman sat at his desk in a corner.
He saw us obviously interested in a Volvo V60, he had obviously nothing to do, but did not found it worth to come and ask if he can help us.
After 5 minutes ignored by him we left the showroom again and I crossed Volvo from my list.
Finally I bought a Mercedes again.

[Chip]

It's curious, since the aim of most adverts is to give the viewer a positive set of associations with the brand, that frontline salespeople don't recognise the emotional aspect and treat potential customers accordingly.

Never seen a Škoda, apart from films about spies and such.

[catbert]

My handwriting is legible and my drawing just passable to be honest, but that's really not what this thread is about. See, I don't have a clear aesthetic preference, for anything related to writing, other than choosing a fountain pen over another mode. I notice that I have three pens, that's 10% of the pile of pens here, that I have never inked. Which presumably means that I am not that fussed about how they write? Choosing ink to fill a pen is often a bit of a lucky dip - just plunge my hand into the ink box and grab whatever. Paper to use is whatever is on hand where I am. I suppose some choice is made for paper inasmuch as it has to be fountain pen friendly. And some further choices are governed primarily by cost, given my location.

@Robalone, my Mother was a lefty and underwrote with a left-leaning slant. I could mimic her handwriting such that she could not tell if it was me or her! Never practiced either, it just seemed simple to do.

Don't knock legible. I'd settle for legible. :rolleyes:

A clear aesthetic preference helps sometimes, but probably closes me off to a lot of things. And even pens I own and enjoy don't elicit an amped-up influencer-style 'THIS PEN IS AMAAZING!!!' response (I would never do that). I want them to disappear in hand. As for paper and ink, I'm not that fussed either.

I think what I'm trying to grasp is — why do you consider your experience weird or somehow 'wrong'? What would be normal or 'right'?

[Robalone]

One has to assume a certain level of engagement with FPs from folk , to be here on this site...therefore there will always be a spectrum of preference.
In my limited experience there are members whose engagement ranges from a passing interest, with one or two pens and a pretty 'meh' attitude to inks and paper ...through to others at another level (? Semantic interpretation) who are besotted, and have , sometimes many MANY pens , and are immersed in the hobby as obsession.

I love how there's all of us here ... I'm at the borderline dangerous end of the spectrum....and to quote Maxwell Smart ...
"....And loving it."

I'd hate to think anyone was intimidated because they 'only' had two pens , and their writing was maybe not 'as good' as someone else's !

All one has to do to be here is love the FP you have , and enjoy writing with it/ them.

[dneal]

Good post.

There's no rhyme nor reason to the pens I've kept. Some I thought I wouldn't enjoy are my favorites, and many I thought I would love have been passed on - sold or given away. Some lend themselves to printing and some script, although I've been writing in cursive much more recently.

I agree on the enthusiasm contagion, although that hasn't happened for some time. Most vintage Parkers and Sheaffers are long gone, although a 51 Demi is finally starting to grow on me.

Complaints and niggles aside, when it works, it's wonderful. A sort of synchronicity between utensil, hand and thought. The nib almost dancing and a nice ink entertaining as it pools, shades and transforms as it dries.

[Chip]

A major part of my engagement with fountain pens is repairing and restoring them. Having lived in remote spots for most of my adult life, I've had to learn how to diagnose and fix a range of items: saddles and harness, wood stoves, space heaters, sketchy plumbing, chain saws, well pumps, kero lamps, and all sorts of automotive bugger-ups.

I enjoy working on fountain pens because they are small and delicate, often puzzling, with a small amount of physical effort yielding great improvements in function and appearance.

To work on a derelict pen, repair it, clean it, polish it, fill it with ink, and write gives me immense pleasure.

My sort of pen peace.

[catbert]

Good point, although I don't consider my experience wrong rather than different from what appears to be the more common experience, if going by reports on websites and YTube and stuff.

Also, it goes somewhat against the received wisdom of enthusiasts that there is some path that leads to a goal where one has a pen for all seasons, as it were. That doesn't seem to apply.


Edited to add: You also raise another point. At the risk of sounding inevitably critical, I do sometimes feel that there are hobbyists who seem more interested in being seen as influencers rather than as hobbyists. There is a degree of wonderment at play when I watch reviews of people who spend huge sums of money on pens that will never provide the remedial training that their handwriting needs. A poor way of promoting fountain pens.

Based on responses in this thread at least, you may not be as much of an outlier as you think. Which may or may not be a consolation... :)

Yes, there are many paths through pendom. That was what I was trying to say. Your path may differ but it is yours.

As for lousy handwriting in pen videos — (1) I'm in no position to condemn, can barely read my own scrawl, (2) these days I'm more bugged by the ubiquitous fox pangram variant (https://fpgeeks.com/forum/showthread.php/34107-About-that-pangram?p=322437&viewfull=1#post322437) and hit fast-forward through most writing samples.

[Chuck Naill]

Forums do lead to acquisitions for some folk.

Pens are a tool for me. I do enjoy using old stuff like my straight razors, radios, and pens, but I am not easily swayed. I was probably going down that path already.

[adhoc]

I personally almost don't care what the pen looks like as long as it is not gaudy. All I care about is how the nib performs and if it's an interesting grind. Also, how comfortable the pen is to write with.

[penwash]

Edited to add: You also raise another point. At the risk of sounding inevitably critical, I do sometimes feel that there are hobbyists who seem more interested in being seen as influencers rather than as hobbyists. There is a degree of wonderment at play when I watch reviews of people who spend huge sums of money on pens that will never provide the remedial training that their handwriting needs. A poor way of promoting fountain pens.

I never have any issues with people spending a lot of money on pens without any desires or motivations to improve their handwriting.
What if they just like how the pen looks?
What if they are fine with their handwriting as is?
Does that instantly make them somewhat "inferior" to those who do?

Using me as an example, my handwriting is just as inconsistent as when I started this hobby years ago.
But I have tons and tons of fun restoring, collecting, and of course, sketching with my fountain pens.

There are so many ways in which one can enjoy this hobby.
From your musings, it looks like either you haven't found yours, or that you have found it, but somehow, it is not enough.

[Chip]

My first fountain pen, a gift (or cast-off) from a lit professor, was an Osmiroid 65 with a stiff, scratchy italic nib. Hard to write without catches and blots, but over several years I got the hang of it, learning some rules: check for leaks every time the pen is uncapped; don't rush a stroke; never push the nib; keep the pen full; don't expect a good result from cheap paper; use a line template under the page until you can write straight lines without it; practice (repeat 100x).

After the black Osmiroid beast, my first new fountain pen, a blue Sheaffer/Levenger Connaisseur, was a dream come true.

[alexwi]

...but I doubt anyone else here experiences it all to the same degree of indifference that I do.

LOL! I could copy your original post on my profile and there wouldn't be a single lie there.

alex

[alexwi]

...The other thing I noticed is just how susceptible I am to the influence of enthusiasts, whether active or passive. Many a time I've bought a pen simply because of the enthusiasm of others, and not because they (the pens) spoke to me in any way.
...

Yah. This happens to me as well. There's a direct correlation between my activity level on ebay and on the fora. I would see a pen that tickles a special part of my brain, then I start looking at pictures of it, videos, reviews, and before I know it, eight different variations made it into my watch list on ebay.

It varies quite haphazardly from pens I own in colors I didn't know I liked or different nibs, or pens I knew about but never considered, or pens that I never even knew existed.

Some of these don't "speak to me," immediately, but like you, I sometimes seem to get tired of using the pens I have inked and get the itch to use a group of pens completely different, or another ink color, and so on. Which pens (or group thereof) "speak to me" is random and, given that I have a largish ("hoardish," according to my wife) collection, I'm able to switch things around.

Likewise, sometimes I'll ink a pen and as soon as the first line leaves it (or not) I realize why it was stored for such a long time. I have to get rid of a number of pens, but it's hard to make the time when life (and new pens) keep interrupting.

Alex

[Robalone]

I personally almost don't care what the pen looks like as long as it is not gaudy. All I care about is how the nib performs and if it's an interesting grind. Also, how comfortable the pen is to write with.

Bravo . This is one of the many branches of the tree of ' FP / writing instruments / art' , and lotsa folk love this one.

I sometimes feel that if some of the wonderful nibs I have were stuck in the end of a stick , they would write just as beautifully.
I have some quite cr*ppy pens with nibs to die for !! And, some very expensive pens that have nibs that are not that great at all.....

I've thought it a lot of times.......it's all about the NIB.

But like I said, this is just one branch... and there's many many more which are there to explore.

[AzJon]

Yeah, but we all new you were tasteless EoC ;)

As a baseline, I only care about one thing: does this pen actually work?

Not company, not brand, not style, that specific, individual pen.

I do think I have a preference in some aspects: prefer piston filler, prefer nib with some bounce, prefer pens that don't double as blunt weapons, and pens that aren't overly heavy.

I find many pens, at least in visual design or material choice, very beautiful.

[TSherbs]

... And that is perhaps associated with why I am so susceptible to going after things that other people enthuse about.

Of course this is only if you actively seek out opinions on more pens. Perhaps another question is, Why are you seeking out these opinions? I am not perfect about avoiding this, by any means, but I have noticed that I like my own pens more the less I keep looking at other ones on line. It is not a direct relationship, but there is a correlation.

Why do you want to like your pens, or any one type of pen, more than you already do? Isn't your appreciation for your pens as perfect as it is ever going to be? (serious question, not sarcastic or ironic).

[Chip]

Perhaps its strange how indifferent I am to the enthusiasm of others when it comes to personal gear such as pens. Close friends have all urged me to get a Montblanc, Omas, or Lamy (based on their love for the brands). My introduction to Montblanc (above) put me off for life. I tried a triangular Omas and disliked how it felt in my hand, like a medical appliance. I got a Lamy (Safari I think– bright red with black nib and trim) in a multi-pen swap. Didn't fancy the look, cheap euro-plastic, or the beaky nib, and didn't like how it wrote: the school pen from Hell.

From which I draw two conclusions. I don't care what sort of pens anyone else likes. They're welcome to their darlings.

Irrespective of brand or buzz, I don't know whether I'll like a pen until I try it. I end up liking some dimestore knock-offs (Arnold, Cavalier) and tend to be attached to specific pens rather than brands. While I collect Sheaffers and Parkers, I've gotten some excellent pens I dislike, which I've passed on.

The principle isn't limited to pens. The same resistance to being influenced applies to skis, climbing gear, clothing, cookware, wine, books, films, politics, et many ceteras.

No overarching truth, other than a quote from Wilde: If one likes that sort of thing, then it's precisely the sort of thing one likes.

[TFarnon]

I'm very close to you in outlook. I have a few limits, subject to modification as time goes on. I don't buy pens costing more than $1000. I don't tend to buy lots of inks, preferring blue and black and blue-black inks. I've unintentionally purchased a lot of different notebooks, just to bring my total up to the minimum for free shipping. I prefer medium nibs in all pens, operating on the principle that pens are designed to work best with a medium nib. It doesn't matter to me that one brand's medium is another's extra fine, or broad. But if a pen I want isn't available in a medium nib, I buy what's available. I like antique, vintage and new pens. I generally prefer smallish, slender-ish pens over large, heavy, thick pens. Given a choice, I'll choose a 14 (or higher) K gold nib over a steel nib. In modern pens, I generally prefer a colored pen over a black pen. Generally speaking. I generally don't feel drawn to red radite and red marbled antique/vintage pens, but there are exceptions to everything. I like a lot of the "tacky" acrylic resin pens. I also like BCHR pens. To a small degree, I mildly prefer certain brands, among them Parker, Platinum, Sailor and Pelikan. That's always followed by: "But wait! I also love Lamy and Pilot and Sheaffer and Cross and Merlin and Waterman and Mabie Todd and Conway-Stewart and and and..." I don't buy pens that don't appeal to me. I think that's what, four or five of them now? I will never write with a few of the pens, even pens I love, because I want them to stay preserved. Usually that means a non-discolored antique celluloid pen. I won't ever put in a new sac or fill it with ink, because I don't want it to discolor. In those cases, I bought them because I think they are beautiful. I don't care about resale value. Besides, my EDC pens, the ones I use the most, are Zebra disposable fountain pens. No fuss, no muss, and cheap. They aren't anything special, but they are functional and fine for scrawling notes and so on.

I just like fountain pens.

[fountainpenkid]

If we had a way to measure the rate of ink flow precisely, as well as the force necessary to move a nib across paper, you would find that differences in ink behavior are quantitative, non-subjective things. Some things don't even need special sensors--look at the way certain inks 'pool' more than others, a result of more or less surface tension, and the ink-paper interaction. In that way different inks can change the line width of a pen, as well as the character of its writing (i.e more or less shading). And inks change their behavior over the course of a fill--after a few days in a pen, they have coated the feed and the flow (especially with flex nibs) can become more steady. I think this is all about attunement (or willful lack thereof).

[Chuck Naill]

My first ink was Pelikan before turning to Waterman. Real or imagined, the Waterman was more smooth in the same pens.

[fountainpenkid]

My first ink was Pelikan before turning to Waterman. Real or imagined, the Waterman was more smooth in the same pens.

Not imagined!

[Sandy]

Maybe I could add where I am?
I grew up with fountain pens. I had to use them at school.

As such, fountain pens are the most comfortable writing tool for me.

After a few years of "accumulating" pens, I now have around 6 or 7 pens I use all the time, and the rest just don't get much of a look in.

I need a pen to be well balanced and able to lay down a consistent line without interruption.

As a teacher, I need a pen that will write, whatever the surface - and the Lamy Aion does that pretty well.

As a writer, who is focusd on long fiction, a pen that will write for hours without interruption or hand cramp is important.

As such. The MB146, Cross Townsend, Parker 51, Parker 51, Parker Sonnet and Nakaya does the trick.

I think part of the problem lies with the death of pen stores. If all folks had to do was walk to their local pen shop, as they would their local shoe shop, then there wouldn't be quite such a palava online.

But, the idea of being able to walk into a shop and buying a pen as you would a pair of shoes has lead to a lot of the discussions and reviews online.

I have several pens that are the right "fit" for me, but to get them required a considerable amount of trial & error.

I suspect that if I'd just bought the right pen in the 1st place, I might have fewer pens

[Chuck Naill]

I decided not to save pens and carried them as often as I wanted. Over the years I’ve acquired antique items that appeared little used. All ways makes me sad for whoever owned it. They missed the joy of use.