Who is worse: Trump or McConnell?

[Linger]

Starting with a caveat: I am no US citizen, nor US resident. Just a concerned global citizen. My observation:

Trump is a dumb populist clown.
McConnell is a Machiavellian, unscrupulous, immoral, evil, sinister politician.

The former a tragic person, to be smirked at in future times.
The latter a clever architect whose influence will dominate US society, and its repercussions on global views on democracy, on civic organization in general, for decades.

What do you think?

[Chuck Naill]

Trump is more dangerous. McConnell is a willing accomplice. That McConnell would be more than willing to help him again, even though Trump disparaged him as a "political hack", says more about McConnell's character and makes him potentially dangerous.

[dneal]

Trump is a manifestation of an underlying symptom. McConnell is simply a master politician, navigating troubled waters.

What's up with those Dutch farmers?

[Bold2013]

Shhh… Not suppose to talk about antigovernment protests that don’t fit the narrative…

[Lloyd]

Shhh… Not suppose to talk about antigovernment protests that don’t fit the narrative…
Have there been any other capital police-killing, capital invading protests in our lifetime's?

Typos courtesy of Samsung Auto-Incorrect™

[dneal]

Not that I’m aware of. The capitol police weren’t at the city-burning riots, so they weren’t able to kill anyone.

Now about those Dutch farmers…

[Chuck Naill]

I suppose the Black Lives Matter protests is what is being referred to. No one is suggesting the looting and violence is acceptable because black people get a pass, but the reasons for those protests are built on a cultural reality whereas the capital protests were based on false information. Maybe others think differently, but following a popular conservative comparison of the BLM protests and January 6 insurrection is not the way to think. It is a false analogy.

[TSherbs]

Starting with a caveat: I am no US citizen, nor US resident. Just a concerned global citizen. My observation:

Trump is a dumb populist clown.
McConnell is a Machiavellian, unscrupulous, immoral, evil, sinister politician.

The former a tragic person, to be smirked at in future times.
The latter a clever architect whose influence will dominate US society, and its repercussions on global views on democracy, on civic organization in general, for decades.

What do you think?

I can't pick. We haven't been able to rid ourselves of either one of them yet, politically.

[dneal]

I suppose the Black Lives Matter protests is what is being referred to. No one is suggesting the looting and violence is acceptable because black people get a pass, but the reasons for those protests are built on a cultural reality whereas the capital protests were based on false information. Maybe others think differently, but following a popular conservative comparison of the BLM protests and January 6 insurrection is not the way to think. It is a false analogy.

You mean those protests in 2016, where they were burning cars and stuff because of that debunked, totally fake, conspiracy theory about Hillary's "illegitimate" loss to Russian bots?

[TSherbs]

Shhh… Not suppose to talk about antigovernment protests that don’t fit the narrative…
Have there been any other capital police-killing, capital invading protests in our lifetime's?

Typos courtesy of Samsung Auto-Incorrect™

Not exactly.

But the violence and mayhem both inside and outside of the 1968 Democratic convention in Chicago is now infamous.

And the 1967 march on the Pentagon could have gone very badly, but the 2500+ soldiers from various divisions/units inside the building beat back the 30 or so protesters who got in one door within minutes. Up to 25,000 troops had been either mobilized or put on alert before the protest. Unlike January 6, 2021.

[dneal]

I wonder why there were no troops available on Jan 6. Didn't anyone request them? Seems they knew it would be a contentious day.

[Chuck Naill]

I wonder why there were no troops available on Jan 6. Didn't anyone request them? Seems they knew it would be a contentious day.

I'll gift this which may help answer your question @dneal.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/21/us/politics/national-guard-january-6-riot.html?unlocked_article_code=AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACE IPuomT1JKd6J17Vw1cRCfTTMQmqxCdw_PIxftm3iWka3DKDmwb iPkORJCH_0bRZKF4IN06wzWcQtZFdbAyTeZ-i-1WOVFkURjt_N6emZMZZSUprIb5FkUH46XwZ5Fquzn7cjv-b-5l2Ly0ux_BO2jgC_Dc1iU-Iwhnp49idQquxSRYxPjaF-J139V9ivl3B5EtVi5AMHfRx4TgCxx_PdmDZhrd-1N2D7kfAWeP6Ibav7EQcwxSCkbESmd_4ws_6tBbPNAUP8XvPkJ qOZq-0fhKVDsefMr-DIYxRoPUi7xgrbXNzBSNw8axzP02f75GVrMNusoHU5vfmWJcmw hfPw&smid=url-share

[TSherbs]

I wonder why there were no troops available on Jan 6. Didn't anyone request them? Seems they knew it would be a contentious day.

I'll gift this which may help answer your question @dneal.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/21/us/politics/national-guard-january-6-riot.html?unlocked_article_code=AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACE IPuomT1JKd6J17Vw1cRCfTTMQmqxCdw_PIxftm3iWka3DKDmwb iPkORJCH_0bRZKF4IN06wzWcQtZFdbAyTeZ-i-1WOVFkURjt_N6emZMZZSUprIb5FkUH46XwZ5Fquzn7cjv-b-5l2Ly0ux_BO2jgC_Dc1iU-Iwhnp49idQquxSRYxPjaF-J139V9ivl3B5EtVi5AMHfRx4TgCxx_PdmDZhrd-1N2D7kfAWeP6Ibav7EQcwxSCkbESmd_4ws_6tBbPNAUP8XvPkJ qOZq-0fhKVDsefMr-DIYxRoPUi7xgrbXNzBSNw8axzP02f75GVrMNusoHU5vfmWJcmw hfPw&smid=url-share

Attorney General Ramsey Clark (in 1967), one timeline notes, authorized additional troops 18 minutes after they were requested from him: interestinglingly, at exactly 4:17PM, the timestamp of Trump's "go home, we love you" video. But they had built up military defense units weeks in advance. After all, it was the Pentagon that was the target that time, not lowly despicable US congress with the President actually leading the cause against them.

[Chuck Naill]

I am curious if Pence trusted the Secret Service??

[Chip]

It's a secret. . .

[Chip]

Which is worse: the bubonic plague or colon cancer?

[Lloyd]

Which is worse: the bubonic plague or colon cancer?
Bubonic plague

Typos courtesy of Samsung Auto-Incorrect™

[Chip]

Which is worse: the bubonic plague or colon cancer?
Bubonic plague.

That's Trump.

https://i.imgur.com/gTYqUN1.jpg

[Chuck Naill]

The worse is which can do the most damage.

[sharmon202]

Starting with a caveat: I am no US citizen, nor US resident. Just a concerned global citizen. My observation:

Trump is a dumb populist clown.
McConnell is a Machiavellian, unscrupulous, immoral, evil, sinister politician.

The former a tragic person, to be smirked at in future times.
The latter a clever architect whose influence will dominate US society, and its repercussions on global views on democracy, on civic organization in general, for decades.

What do you think?

Biden & Co. Judge me as you will

[sharmon202]

I've been seeing quite a few non-US people on social media making fun of and being very condescending, w superior attitude toward US conservatives. Making me wonder if they are being paid and assigned to the task. An odd trend, seems to me. I am on Twitter as @sharmon202 & Getter as @PurduetheINUniv if you would like to join a more relevant site for political social discourse. My political affiliation, pre-2021, was none. I usually get scoffed when I reveal this. OK. I traditionally decide how to vote by the issue, the candidate, what it might mean if they win. I read a lot, I believe I am a very informed person I get tv news from Fox, CNN, and occasionally Newsmax, Plus many internet sources. I had to go partisan when I saw policies being enacted (if you call a record number of executive orders, policies, and not the legislation mostly required by law). Yes I know Trump signed many EOs, So did Obama. As I see this country going down hill quickly, I cannot consciously support the human causes.

[sharmon202]

There was a Capitol police murdered Jan 6. I don't think so.

[sharmon202]

I think no need for analogy, apple to oranges, to me.

[sharmon202]

I thought all this was because of the police murder of G. Floyd. I said murder so don't go off half cocked here. Killed a national hero who was a drug user, drug seller, criminal. Also had fentanyl in his system at time of death. I wonder if he sold fentanyl? I thought this was the trigger, or excuse, for rioting, burning, destroying businesses of innocent people. Of course maybe it was rioting in Ferguson MO, bought & paid for.

[Chuck Naill]

I thought all this was because of the police murder of G. Floyd. I said murder so don't go off half cocked here. Killed a national hero who was a drug user, drug seller, criminal. Also had fentanyl in his system at time of death. I wonder if he sold fentanyl? I thought this was the trigger, or excuse, for rioting, burning, destroying businesses of innocent people. Of course maybe it was rioting in Ferguson MO, bought & paid for.

He was no hero and never heard anyone say he was, but he was something you and I both have in common; he was a human being and did not deserve to be killed for passing a fake bill.

You shouldn't be killed for selling cigarettes, jogging, or being in your back yard. You should not be drug down a road behind a pickup. One might conflate looting and storming the US capital armed and trying to overturn the will of the majority, but you won't get my agreement.

Even if you're a radicalized Trump supporter and attacking the US Capital, only one was shot dead.

The carnage inflicted on the US Capital Police is well documented, so perhaps your sources are not keeping you properly informed.

[sharmon202]

I thought all this was because of the police murder of G. Floyd. I said murder so don't go off half cocked here. Killed a national hero who was a drug user, drug seller, criminal. Also had fentanyl in his system at time of death. I wonder if he sold fentanyl? I thought this was the trigger, or excuse, for rioting, burning, destroying businesses of innocent people. Of course maybe it was rioting in Ferguson MO, bought & paid for.

He was no hero and never heard anyone say he was, but he was something you and I both have in common; he was a human being and did not deserve to be killed for passing a fake bill.

You shouldn't be killed for selling cigarettes, jogging, or being in your back yard. You should not be drug down a road behind a pickup. One might conflate looting and storming the US capital armed and trying to overturn the will of the majority, but you won't get my agreement.

Even if you're a radicalized Trump supporter and attacking the US Capital, only one was shot dead.

The carnage inflicted on the US Capital Police is well documented, so perhaps your sources are not keeping you properly informed.

You need to read for comprehension, sir. I said Floyd was murdered, by police. Per being a hero I was referring to actions. His face was on public walls & tv news for years. Things were done in his name, you don't think this is true? I am not implying right or wrong, just actions taken.

Your 2nd sentence went off the cliff, I can't see where I might have implied that any of this is ok to
do, except the overturning of the majority. At this time facts/video show this to be questionable.

I agree there was looting & storming, (getting your definition from context). I agree, only Jan 6 death was Ashli Babbitt. (Only one was shot dead? you make that sound like it was minimal and ok.) Is this the "carnage" to which you are referring? Merriam Webster defines carnage as great and usually bloody slaughter or injury as in battle. Over stating to make a point?

Exactly what "carnage" was inflicted on Capitol Police? There is govt video showing police opened doors & let people in. I would be very afraid if I were a policeman & in the middle of that, not knowing what will happen, never been thru anything like it, knowing that no back up is coming even though it was offered.

I am guessing you may be informed but let ideology, rhetoric, & emotion cloud your response. I get information from liberal/progressive and conservative sources. How about you? What are your favored sources and why if you don't mind spending the extra time for our conversation. Thx.

I invite a reply and would appreciate it being a more leveled and factual one. If not, its fun anyway. Thx

[Chuck Naill]

I thought all this was because of the police murder of G. Floyd. I said murder so don't go off half cocked here. Killed a national hero who was a drug user, drug seller, criminal. Also had fentanyl in his system at time of death. I wonder if he sold fentanyl? I thought this was the trigger, or excuse, for rioting, burning, destroying businesses of innocent people. Of course maybe it was rioting in Ferguson MO, bought & paid for.

He was no hero and never heard anyone say he was, but he was something you and I both have in common; he was a human being and did not deserve to be killed for passing a fake bill.

You shouldn't be killed for selling cigarettes, jogging, or being in your back yard. You should not be drug down a road behind a pickup. One might conflate looting and storming the US capital armed and trying to overturn the will of the majority, but you won't get my agreement.

Even if you're a radicalized Trump supporter and attacking the US Capital, only one was shot dead.

The carnage inflicted on the US Capital Police is well documented, so perhaps your sources are not keeping you properly informed.

You need to read for comprehension, sir. I said Floyd was murdered, by police. Per being a hero I was referring to actions. His face was on public walls & tv news for years. Things were done in his name, you don't think this is true? I am not implying right or wrong, just actions taken.

Your 2nd sentence went off the cliff, I can't see where I might have implied that any of this is ok to
do, except the overturning of the majority. At this time facts/video show this to be questionable.

I agree there was looting & storming, (getting your definition from context). I agree, only Jan 6 death was Ashli Babbitt. (Only one was shot dead? you make that sound like it was minimal and ok.) Is this the "carnage" to which you are referring? Merriam Webster defines carnage as great and usually bloody slaughter or injury as in battle. Over stating to make a point?

Exactly what "carnage" was inflicted on Capitol Police? There is govt video showing police opened doors & let people in. I would be very afraid if I were a policeman & in the middle of that, not knowing what will happen, never been thru anything like it, knowing that no back up is coming even though it was offered.

I am guessing you may be informed but let ideology, rhetoric, & emotion cloud your response. I get information from liberal/progressive and conservative sources. How about you? What are your favored sources and why if you don't mind spending the extra time for our conversation. Thx.

I invite a reply and would appreciate it being a more leveled and factual one. If not, its fun anyway. Thx


Primary source regarding the harm inflicted on the Capital Police comes from their own testimonies. There are also independent sources. If you read that broadly you would have already known.

No ideology or emotion here and odd that you felt the need to bring it up as it doesn’t strengthen your position. You vilified George Floyd with an emotional rant about his past. So maybe reconsider who is the emotional ideologue. Anyone remotely acquainted with the murder knows the protests were about his treatment by police officers. Anyway, answer this, did Floyd deserve to be smothered and die for using or selling Fentanyl? If he was a criminal our constitution provides due process protection.

I didn’t compare the January 6 insurrection to BLM looting, but some have. I don’t personally see a connection.

I use various investigative reporting sources, Reuters, NPR, and NYT. Like you, I read broadly.