Sheaffer Fountain Pen Id

[southpaw52]

Is there an online source for iding Sheaffer Pens?

[mrcharlie]

I don't think there is any one site that will guarantee you enough information to ID any Sheaffer, but here are two that have a lot:

Ravens March Sheaffer page (http://dirck.delint.ca/beta/?page_id=480)
Has pages for many models with a fair number of pictures and descriptions.

Sheaffer Targa homepage (http://www.sheaffertarga.com/sheaffer%20targa%20homepage.htm)
Has a lot of information for identifying various Targa model numbers, but also information about some other classic models as well.

[Jon Szanto]

Richard Binder's reference pages are also good, at least once you know the particular family branch the pen is.

[welch]

Also, try Teri M's Peyton Street Pens: http://www.peytonstreetpens.com/resources/pen-resources/sheaffer_models_part_1

(Keeping in mind: Sheaffer seems to have re-used model names and blurred the difference between models. Consider all the varieties of "Sheaffer Imperial")

[southpaw52]

Thanks everyone. I have a renewed interest in Sheaffers. Recently picked two nearly nos Craftsman and a 5-30. Wanting to educate myself on the Sheaffers pens.

[Roger W.]

[QUOTE=welch;69583]Also, try Teri M's Peyton Street Pens: http://www.peytonstreetpens.com/resources/pen-resources/sheaffer_models_part_1

Teri's site is hugely general with no real model names or dates available so I would tend to avoid it. The balances all appear to be the same length which distorts what models they are as well.

Roger W.

[carlos.q]

[QUOTE=welch;69583]Also, try Teri M's Peyton Street Pens: http://www.peytonstreetpens.com/resources/pen-resources/sheaffer_models_part_1

Teri's site is hugely general with no real model names or dates available so I would tend to avoid it. The balances all appear to be the same length which distorts what models they are as well.

Roger W.
Thus the proper disclaimer:
We don't claim that this list is comprehensive or scholarly, and we acknowledge that we may have identified some pens incorrectly. These are pens we've had a chance to capture via photograph and identify via research. The dimensions are not to scale, nor will you get anywhere by comparing one pen to another, if you are looking for an idea of comparative size. (Send us a message, and we can probably dig up more info about the specific pen we photographed.)

[Roger W.]

[QUOTE=welch;69583]Also, try Teri M's Peyton Street Pens: http://www.peytonstreetpens.com/resources/pen-resources/sheaffer_models_part_1

Teri's site is hugely general with no real model names or dates available so I would tend to avoid it. The balances all appear to be the same length which distorts what models they are as well.

Roger W.
Thus the proper disclaimer:
We don't claim that this list is comprehensive or scholarly, and we acknowledge that we may have identified some pens incorrectly. These are pens we've had a chance to capture via photograph and identify via research. The dimensions are not to scale, nor will you get anywhere by comparing one pen to another, if you are looking for an idea of comparative size. (Send us a message, and we can probably dig up more info about the specific pen we photographed.)

To be honest - why bother? It ends up being essentially a random collection of pics - granted roughly dated and they are all Sheaffer but, mostly the same size so it gives very little information. Someone could get the same amount of information scanning the offerings on EBay. Pen Lovers a decade ago had this available with better detail though it had errors as well. I'll admit that those of us that know have done a mediocre job of putting up anything in the way of a decent website. I have over 500 ads up but, Sheaffer didn't advertise a lot of models. As soon as I can I'm going to put something together - just busy doing the day job for now. I do have several desk bases - 65 sets in date order. I've got some 46's up but, there are even relative only to one another. I can do a fairly definitive job from 1912-1941, touchdowns-snorkels and targas. To do it right there are a huge number of pens to photo in a certain way and then lay out in a way that makes sense. It becomes a not light undertaking when one wants to do it correctly which is why I've never gotten around to it. You can see what I have at www.sheafferflattops.com.[URL="http://www.sheafferflattops.com"]

Roger W.

[terim]

Ouch.

[Jon Szanto]

I'll admit that those of us that know have done a mediocre job of putting up anything in the way of a decent website.

Enough said.

Maybe consider being just a tad more charitable to others until that site goes live - it is certainly conceivable that they are "just busy doing the day job" as well.

[Roger W.]

I'll admit that those of us that know have done a mediocre job of putting up anything in the way of a decent website.

Enough said.

Maybe consider being just a tad more charitable to others until that site goes live - it is certainly conceivable that they are "just busy doing the day job" as well.

Honestly, I'm not trying to be mean. By the same token you can't put out something along the lines of a "guide" if it really isn't. If anything I would hone what I would say to Teri is think comprehensively about what you are trying to achieve. Obviously it takes time to put together anything. If I never get out a guide worthy of the name in my estimation then by default anything put out along any lines is better than my alternative. I can tell you I put up all the desk set pics in date order because it is a lot less daunting than to do a guide on the pens. The other problem with too general a guide is that folks come to chats sites all the time wanting to know precisely what their pen is down to the actual year (not really possible with many Sheaffers). Maybe Teri's site can be a place to start from. Same as if you owned a pen reference book because they are fairly inaccurate on Sheaffer's as well but, if you only have a casual interest they are still a good place to start. I apologize for being a bit over the top.

Roger W.

[LunaAzurina]

[QUOTE=welch;69583]Also, try Teri M's Peyton Street Pens: http://www.peytonstreetpens.com/resources/pen-resources/sheaffer_models_part_1

Teri's site is hugely general with no real model names or dates available so I would tend to avoid it. The balances all appear to be the same length which distorts what models they are as well.

Roger W.
Thus the proper disclaimer:
We don't claim that this list is comprehensive or scholarly, and we acknowledge that we may have identified some pens incorrectly. These are pens we've had a chance to capture via photograph and identify via research. The dimensions are not to scale, nor will you get anywhere by comparing one pen to another, if you are looking for an idea of comparative size. (Send us a message, and we can probably dig up more info about the specific pen we photographed.)

To be honest - why bother? It ends up being essentially a random collection of pics - granted roughly dated and they are all Sheaffer but, mostly the same size so it gives very little information. Someone could get the same amount of information scanning the offerings on EBay. Pen Lovers a decade ago had this available with better detail though it had errors as well. I'll admit that those of us that know have done a mediocre job of putting up anything in the way of a decent website. I have over 500 ads up but, Sheaffer didn't advertise a lot of models. As soon as I can I'm going to put something together - just busy doing the day job for now. I do have several desk bases - 65 sets in date order. I've got some 46's up but, there are even relative only to one another. I can do a fairly definitive job from 1912-1941, touchdowns-snorkels and targas. To do it right there are a huge number of pens to photo in a certain way and then lay out in a way that makes sense. It becomes a not light undertaking when one wants to do it correctly which is why I've never gotten around to it. You can see what I have at www.sheafferflattops.com.[URL="http://www.sheafferflattops.com"]

Roger W.

I thought this post was unnecessarily mean, Roger. The images on Teri's site piqued my interest. My husband whisked me off to Santa Cruz this weekend for my birthday and I thought her site was so helpful, I am planning to try to visit her in person today, if Peyton Street Pens is open. This would be my first official pen shop stop! My previous purchases of Lamys and Noodlers were made on Amazon but I am all for supporting a brick-and-mortar business whenever practical.

I have found in this world that grouchy people generally make two or three cheerful ones come out of the wood works. I understand it's a huge undertaking to catalog so many pens but you yourself admit that you have not found the time to do it. So, until you do, you should practice patience with the efforts of others.

[79spitfire]

Last I checked Teri didn't have a B&M store, online only.

I hope that changes...

[LunaAzurina]

yeah... I just drove by and it was quite residential. My bad!

[david i]

Roger's post wasn't mean. It was blunt. Bluntness, rather than would-be online warm-n-fuzziness, can be refreshing and can be helpful, at least to those who seek information, not false reassurance.

Online resources for Sheaffer are somewhat limited, at least from the perspective of those of us who know something about Sheaffer.

To put things in perspective, for those who want to learn to "easily" ID and cachet-stratify their pens, here is a not-quite-done profile of just one Sheaffer series, made for about a decade, vs Sheaffer's overall century run.

Spend a half hour with it. Got everything down pat? Probably not.

Or goto Sheaffertarga.com. Pretty much everything is there for series addressed.


Sheaffer Snorkel Guide at Isaacson's Vacumania.com (http://vacumania.com/website/sheaffersnorkelguide.htm)

Imagine what it would take to cover everything ;)

Richard hosts a profile of Balance, a basic intro to the series. Jim at penhero has profiles of some of the series. I will be placing profiles such as that Snorkel profile online in coming months at Vacumania.com

But, Roger is wholly correct in noting there is not *an* online resource for identifying Sheaffers, noting that "identifying" is a bit vague, as it does not specify degree.

Perhaps I'll do a timeline-style profile offering major series with era of production and with series names, at least to allow the most gross identification. Then people at least can hunt for specific series profiles online.


regards

david

[Jon Szanto]

Roger's post wasn't mean. It was blunt. Bluntness, rather than would-be online warm-n-fuzziness, can be refreshing and can be helpful, at least to those who seek information, not false reassurance.

There is a middle path. Or many, actually. To assume that anyone seeking information only wants to be slapped upside da head is... not correct. ;)

The rest was well-said (in your post), and had a hilarious side-effect: just an hour or two ago, I spent some many minutes Google-searching FPB for all the Snorkel info, thinking "where the hell is that big mondo thing that David did on Snorks?" I never realized/remembered that it was hosted over on the Vacumania site. Doh.

[david i]

Roger's post wasn't mean. It was blunt. Bluntness, rather than would-be online warm-n-fuzziness, can be refreshing and can be helpful, at least to those who seek information, not false reassurance.

There is a middle path. Or many, actually. To assume that anyone seeking information only wants to be slapped upside da head is... not correct. ;)

The rest was well-said (in your post), and had a hilarious side-effect: just an hour or two ago, I spent some many minutes Google-searching FPB for all the Snorkel info, thinking "where the hell is that big mondo thing that David did on Snorks?" I never realized/remembered that it was hosted over on the Vacumania site. Doh.

So, John, has anyone asserted that anyone who seeks information only wants to be slapped in the head? ;)

regards

david

[Jon Szanto]

Blunt trauma.

In other news, I've got a post over at FPB that the Snorkel Guide almost made unnecessary, but I still need info.

[terim]

Thanks to everyone who contributed to this lively discussion! I am satisfied that all comments are constructive and well intended.

Perhaps if I re-titled the pages "Sheaffer Gallery" it would set better with folks who thinks we are over-stating what we have done? I didn't intend to supplant anyone's web site or efforts, let alone their hard won expertise, it was merely a place to send our own customers when they want to know what a model looks like. Perhaps that answers Roger's "Why bother?" question. I didn't bother, for instance, to cover the various Targa models since Gary's sheaffertarga web site is so thorough.

While I know we don't have the model numbers out of the catalog, we really did try to get as many of the model names right as we could. So I'm sorry to hear we have "no real model names." I guess we'll have to try harder. But I'm pretty sure it's more useful than scanning the listings on eBay.

This project was a fun collaboration between myself and one of my college student helpers, and it really has served to educate us and refine our thinking. I haven't done much to publicize it, knowing that it's not yet as comprehensive as it could be or will be. So if some people find it helpful, we are sufficiently rewarded for our efforts and motivated to carry on.

Best wishes!
TERI

[HughC]

I see and understand what Teri is trying to do, and in all fairness it's a decent effort to provide some basic info. I've never been a fan of her "snorkel and td " guide though ( question one would be better if it was "does it have a snorkel") and likewise lumping TM TDs and Snorkels together on the pen model page just adds further confusion as they are different pens (size, colours and trim variations).

Regards
Hugh

[mhosea]

Perhaps if I re-titled the pages "Sheaffer Gallery" it would set better with folks who thinks we are over-stating what we have done?

Probably. I appreciate all efforts and recognize that the responsibility for deciding what is authoritative or not for my purpose is mine alone. I don't care too much about disputes that only Roger, Daniel, and "Lazard" and a handful of others are prepared to debate. If something is wrong in a caption, c'est la vie. Being "right" with Sheaffer seems to require the skill of seeing order in chaos, anyway. The only thing I really yearned for was a sense of the different scale of the different pens.

[Jon Szanto]

Hugh, Teri: I'm wondering if maybe a bit of collaboration could happen? Even if only a modest effort, seems like a great opportunity.

[Roger W.]

Perhaps if I re-titled the pages "Sheaffer Gallery" it would set better with folks who thinks we are over-stating what we have done?

Probably. I appreciate all efforts and recognize that the responsibility for deciding what is authoritative or not for my purpose is mine alone. I don't care too much about disputes that only Roger, Daniel, and "Lazard" and a handful of others are prepared to debate. If something is wrong in a caption, c'est la vie. Being "right" with Sheaffer seems to require the skill of seeing order in chaos, anyway. The only thing I really yearned for was a sense of the different scale of the different pens.

Mike;

Radite flattops are fairly straight forward as they are full sized clip, short clip and ringtop. Diameters vary into four general classes with lengths being 5 1/4", and 4 1/2". Earlier BCHR has more trial and error but, the nib goes into the size code and things are real simple in 1913 as they had a fairly limited line. Balances have me hit the catalogs all of the time as there are many more colors and variations - maybe a fair amount of chaos as you point out.

In two weeks I'm going to start to put something together.

Roger W.