Am I The Only One Who Finds Cartridge Only Pens Really Frustrating?

[top pen]

There are quite a few pens that only take short international cartridges, most notably the KAWECO sport range of pens. I've become quite interested in another pen that falls into this category. But know learning that pen can only take short intentional cartridges, a pen that I was very likely to purchase in the next few months has become a pen that there are is a good chance I won't purchase.

Obviously there are ways around this e.g. mini converters, eye dropper fill, refiling cartridges etc. However non of these are as straight forward as a converter would be and in many cases 0.5-1cm of extra space in the barrel is all that would be needed to fit a smaller converter in, this normally wouldn't have a greatly detrimental effect on utility or Design whilst improving the functionality of the pen to a great deal.

Am I the only who avoids these smaller pens because of this?

[Silverbreeze]

I have a kaweco mini squeeze convertor.... Dislike it verging on hate

[VertOlive]

You're not alone. I dislike all of the inks I've gotten in mini-carts so far and refuse to mess about with syringes. I just sold one of my two mini's that require the small carts and am deliberating on selling the other. I won't buy another pen that requires them. Just don't like 'em.

[Nomdeplume]

Private Reserve makes little carts. So, though I, too, avoid most small cart pens, I can still have decent colors when I do use them.

[VertOlive]

Ouch! Most of my mini carts were from PR. :redface:

[Kaputnik]

There are some really tiny pens, such as the Kaweco Liliput, or the A.G. Spalding pens, where the tininess is one of the selling points, and using a short cartridge helps keep it that small. In the case of those particular pens, they are made of metal, so they can't be eyedroppered, and they aren't suitable for any converter I know of, even that useless Kaweco one. I see these as curiosities, something you would probably not pick as a daily writer, so it doesn't really bother me that the filling system isn't the best.

In general, I prefer something where you stick the nib in a bottle and work some sort of mechanism. I have a Kaweco Classic Sport that I'll probably fill with an eyedropper if I ever use it again, but it's a bit of a mystery why Kaweco couldn't design a decent converter for it.

[tandaina]

Yeah I don't like carts so that has ruled out many of the tiny pens for me.

[Waski_the_Squirrel]

I love my Kaweco Sport, but I hate the squeeze converter. The only thing worse is cartridges.

I was interested in the Monteverde Tool Pen, even though it's a ridiculous gimmick. The inability of the pen to hold a converter is why I got over that initial lust to acquire.

I agree with the OP, but have no advice to offer. Cartridges bother me, and this is why I don't like ballpoints.

[velo]

I don't have a problem with carts as a delivery system it's the ink that can be a little boring. Proprietary carts and converters are more irritating.

[Jon Szanto]

I own precisely zero pens that use a short cart. The reason why is left as an exercise for the reader.

[ac12]

I have an Ohto Tasche, short international cartridge only.
But because it is a pocket pen, compromises had to be made to keep it short.
And since I don't write a lot with that pen, filling the cartridge with an ink syringe is not that big of a deal for me.
Were it a pen that would get regular use, then it would be a PiA.

[Quantum Sailor]

I own precisely zero pens that use a short cart. The reason why is left as an exercise for the reader.

You wouldn't happen to read a lot of mathematics books would you? lol

[Jon Szanto]

I own precisely zero pens that use a short cart. The reason why is left as an exercise for the reader.

You wouldn't happen to read a lot of mathematics books would you? lol
Few people walking this Earth have a less close connection to mathematics than I. Well, except for counting all the measures rest until my first triangle entrance.

[erpe]

I love my Sports, they are designed for use on the road, in that situation, cartridges are much more practical than bottles. But: don't despair, there seems to be a piston version in the (re)making (it obviously was a pistonfiler to begin with since there simply were no cartridges at the time).

[dneal]

I'm indifferent to short cartridges, and have a few pens (mainly Kaweco's) that use them. I'm not sure I understand the animosity though.

I'd love for Kaweco to come out with a new Sports with piston filler.

[Jon Szanto]

I'm not sure I understand the animosity though.
No worries. Just takes time, and empathy. ;)

[snedwos]

I don't really understand why there are so few modern lever filers. It seems such an elegant, simple solution that would be much much simpler to implement than a piston, and less of a pita than short carts only

[KBeezie]

I only have two pens that are strictly cart loaded. A Kaweco AL Sport, and a Pilot Petit1. Oddly, I don't mind that the Petit1 is cartridge only (probably because it holds more ink in it's little cart than a short standard international does anyways), but am kind of iffy that the Kaweco is a cart-only pen.

Would not say that I *hate* it per se, as I don't always mind syringe filling a cartridge. But that may change if I run out of ink out in the wild (and I'm syringe filling from a bottle).

At least there's a ton of other options to pick from if you just hate cartridge only unless you manage to land your hands on a pen that you absolutely love, but that one fatal flaw (ie: like the Kaweco AL Sport). But Hate? I'd just make a decision, and move on.

But if you REALLY want to get the Kaweco Sport or AL Sport and must use a piston style converter, you can get this.

http://templarink.com/03_MiniConverter.html
http://templarink.com/images/MiniConverter.jpg

Just make sure that when you order to specify that you want the "Skinny Mini" in the special instructions, as that's the one that was designed to work in the Kaweco sport line.

I did order one of those, but I probably won't get it until the middle of next week. I plan on reviewing it on my site.


I don't really understand why there are so few modern lever filers. It seems such an elegant, simple solution that would be much much simpler to implement than a piston, and less of a pita than short carts only


Not sure either, maybe most of the companies do not think there's a big market for it outside of vintage or that they don't trust users not to damage the lever?

[Jon Szanto]

But if you REALLY want to get the Kaweco Sport or AL Sport and must use a piston style converter, you can get this.

What does that thing hold, 4 drops if ink?

[KBeezie]

But if you REALLY want to get the Kaweco Sport or AL Sport and must use a piston style converter, you can get this.

What does that thing hold, 4 drops if ink?

Probably, gotta be less than what the Monteverde mini converter holds, guess we'll find out soon enough eh. But hey, when you need to refill, you won't have to deal with a pesky cartridge :D lol.

[milkb0at]

As a quick rule of thumb, any question that begins "Am I the only one...?" can be answered "No".

I grew up with cartridge fountain pens (Parker Vector, mostly), so I have no animosity for them. In my Kaweco Sport I've moved from the rubbish converter to a Diamine cartridge and it's miles better.

Cartridges aren't my favourite ink storage mechanism, but they're not the end of the world. There's no need to be sniffy about them.

[kernando]

If you stop looking at cartridge pens, you won't be frustrated by ones that take cartridges only. There are lots of self fillers that take neither cartridge nor converter, and plenty of them are small.

[amk]

I don't find anything wrong with the cartridge system. When I'm on the road, I prefer it to other systems - less mess, and no need to take an ink bottle with me. When I'm at home, I prefer to swap the cart for a converter. Admittedly then I find pens that don't take converters or for which I can't find converters (Waterman CF I'm talking about you) rather a nuisance.

Cart/converter seems to me an excellent and well designed system and I don't understand why it arouses such hatred... though I prefer piston fill.

One big exception: if I buy a demonstrator, I want to see the ink. I just don't see the point of a transparent pen unless it's a piston filler, vac, or eyedropper - that is, one of the filling systems that uses the barrel as its ink container. Having a converter (or a sac) in a demo just seems stupid.

I *don't* like lever fillers much. I see a lot of vintage pens where the lever pin has started to deform the barrel. I far prefer button fillers or piston fillers. And using those, your fingers are a lot further away from the lip of the ink bottle, which is a real issue with a shorter pen, and a half-empty bottle of ink :-)

[KBeezie]

I don't find anything wrong with the cartridge system. When I'm on the road, I prefer it to other systems - less mess, and no need to take an ink bottle with me. When I'm at home, I prefer to swap the cart for a converter. Admittedly then I find pens that don't take converters or for which I can't find converters (Waterman CF I'm talking about you) rather a nuisance.

Cart/converter seems to me an excellent and well designed system and I don't understand why it arouses such hatred... though I prefer piston fill.

One big exception: if I buy a demonstrator, I want to see the ink. I just don't see the point of a transparent pen unless it's a piston filler, vac, or eyedropper - that is, one of the filling systems that uses the barrel as its ink container. Having a converter (or a sac) in a demo just seems stupid.

I *don't* like lever fillers much. I see a lot of vintage pens where the lever pin has started to deform the barrel. I far prefer button fillers or piston fillers. And using those, your fingers are a lot further away from the lip of the ink bottle, which is a real issue with a shorter pen, and a half-empty bottle of ink :-)
Main problem I have with cartridges is they don't come in the color I want

[top pen]

I don't find anything wrong with the cartridge system. When I'm on the road, I prefer it to other systems - less mess, and no need to take an ink bottle with me. When I'm at home, I prefer to swap the cart for a converter. Admittedly then I find pens that don't take converters or for which I can't find converters (Waterman CF I'm talking about you) rather a nuisance.

Cart/converter seems to me an excellent and well designed system and I don't understand why it arouses such hatred... though I prefer piston fill.

One big exception: if I buy a demonstrator, I want to see the ink. I just don't see the point of a transparent pen unless it's a piston filler, vac, or eyedropper - that is, one of the filling systems that uses the barrel as its ink container. Having a converter (or a sac) in a demo just seems stupid.

I *don't* like lever fillers much. I see a lot of vintage pens where the lever pin has started to deform the barrel. I far prefer button fillers or piston fillers. And using those, your fingers are a lot further away from the lip of the ink bottle, which is a real issue with a shorter pen, and a half-empty bottle of ink :-)
Main problem I have with cartridges is they don't come in the color I want

That's exactly my problem the pen in question comes in both a smaller size which is cartridge only and a Larger size that is c/c but the problem is the finish of the pen I'm interested in only comes in the smaller pen.

[velo]

I just bought Pilot carts for my VP as the convertor holds sweet you-know-what. The blue ink was really meh so I emptied it and refilled it with Diamine Syrah. Sweet.

[KBeezie]

I just bought Pilot carts for my VP as the convertor holds sweet you-know-what. The blue ink was really meh so I emptied it and refilled it with Diamine Syrah. Sweet.

Yea I've syringe-filled cartridges (Pilot's being one of the easier ones to do that with), but out-and-about it's not very practical when you need to pop another cartridge in. My issue is primarily having those colors already available in cartridges so I don't have to syringe fill every time I run out.

But on the upside bottled inks are more economical (though a converter would be even more economical, no left-overs in the syringe).

[Kaputnik]

I just bought Pilot carts for my VP as the convertor holds sweet you-know-what. The blue ink was really meh so I emptied it and refilled it with Diamine Syrah. Sweet.

Yea I've syringe-filled cartridges (Pilot's being one of the easier ones to do that with), but out-and-about it's not very practical when you need to pop another cartridge in. My issue is primarily having those colors already available in cartridges so I don't have to syringe fill every time I run out...

Actually, in this respect, the Pilot cartridges are different from the short international cartridges that the OP was talking about. When you empty a Pilot cartridge, pull out the little plastic disk with a tweezers. Refill the cartridge with a syringe. Very slowly push the disk back in with something like an orange wood stick of appropriate diameter until it's in just far enough (use an unused cartridge as a reference). Now you have a sealed cartridge with whatever ink you chose, which you can use at any time. The last couple of times that I've traveled, I've carried a number of spare Pilot cartridges that I'd refilled myself.

Some people have talked about refilling international cartridges, short or long, and sealing the ends with electrical tape for use later. I don't know how well this works.

[velo]

Hmm I noticed that little disc but I didn't remove it as I thought it might have something to do with the flow.

Your storage suggestion is interesting and I'll try it next time.

[jar]

From responses it seems you are not alone, which is good for me. I prefer the short international cartridge pens to any other filling system.

[Wile E Coyote]

But on the upside bottled inks are more economical (though a converter would be even more economical, no left-overs in the syringe).

There's no reason for leftovers in the syringe. After the first time you know how much a cartridge holds, only fill the syringe to that level. If you're that concerned about waste, fill the cartridge with water the first time.

[Wile E Coyote]

I have to agree that international cartridge only pens are a PITA. Though I prefer cartridge converter pens, especially Japanese brands. I'm fickle with my ink and like to change colors often. A cartridge/converter pen is the easiest to clean between ink changes. The fact that a Pilot 823 holds so much ink and is difficult to clean is what I don't like about it.

[snedwos]

People always forget when saying that cartridges hold more ink than converters that when you fill with a converter, you also fill the feed, which you don't do with a cartridge. If you put a cartridge in a clean pen, observe how far the ink level in the cartridge drops before you can start writing.

This is more relevant for me, I guess, since I very rarely fill with the same ink twice in a row.

[Kaputnik]

Hmm I noticed that little disc but I didn't remove it as I thought it might have something to do with the flow.

Your storage suggestion is interesting and I'll try it next time.

It might have something to do with the flow at that, but you don't have to take it out when you're actually using the pen. When you've used it to reseal a cartridge, you just push the cartridge in the pen normally, and it turns sideways again as it did the first time.

There is probably a limit on how many times you can do this before something wears out, but I haven't reached it yet. Only been doing this a short while.

[Sailor Kenshin]

From responses it seems you are not alone, which is good for me. I prefer the short international cartridge pens to any other filling system.


I kinda like 'em, too...I have a thing about NEEDING to see my ink.

[Tracy Lee]

Converter or eyedropper only please. I've no time for cartridges!!

[Tubal Cain]

I have an Elysee that I bought about 20 years ago which will only take the short cartridge. Nib is 585 and really smooth.

Doesn't get much use though. If any.

[GING GING]

I don't mind them. It is what it is. If I really want to use the pen with another ink, I just use a syringe.

[betsypreston]

I don't mind them. It is what it is. If I really want to use the pen with another ink, I just use a syringe.

+1

I avoided cart-only pens for years. But eventually, there were too many intriguing cart-only pens so I broke down and started buying some. In a way, it's convenient to be able to throw some extra carts in my bag and go. I refill when I'm at home so I can use any color I choose. Just another tool in the box. Can't get too worked up about it one way or t'other.

[bitterwonder]

Prefer cartridge pens. Nice to know wherever i am i can refill without spilling ink on someone else's property. Also, when out drawwing in the field it is hard to fill from a bottle if you are standing and only have two hands. You can also refill with a cartridge in a dark theater setting.

[discopig]

Prefer cartridge pens. Nice to know wherever i am i can refill without spilling ink on someone else's property. Also, when out drawwing in the field it is hard to fill from a bottle if you are standing and only have two hands. You can also refill with a cartridge in a dark theater setting.

I don't think I could ever get myself to refill a pen at work or anywhere, so I usually just bring 3 pens on me, then at least if one runs out I have another.

[KBeezie]

Hmm I noticed that little disc but I didn't remove it as I thought it might have something to do with the flow.

Your storage suggestion is interesting and I'll try it next time.

It might have something to do with the flow at that, but you don't have to take it out when you're actually using the pen. When you've used it to reseal a cartridge, you just push the cartridge in the pen normally, and it turns sideways again as it did the first time.

There is probably a limit on how many times you can do this before something wears out, but I haven't reached it yet. Only been doing this a short while.

Doesn't affect the flow, nor does it improve it (as the converters don't have it, outside of maybe an agitator).

I usually removed it, because I didn't think you could actually rotate it back into place and still be secured.



Prefer cartridge pens. Nice to know wherever i am i can refill without spilling ink on someone else's property. Also, when out drawwing in the field it is hard to fill from a bottle if you are standing and only have two hands. You can also refill with a cartridge in a dark theater setting.

I don't think I could ever get myself to refill a pen at work or anywhere, so I usually just bring 3 pens on me, then at least if one runs out I have another.

I've yet had to refill on-the-go, since I'll sometimes 'top off' a pen before going to a place I'd need it... but I'm not a huge time writer, I don't go thru ink like that. With so many pens inked at the moment, it'll be a couple of weeks before any one needs a refill (or dries out really fast like some of the Jinhaos I no longer own).

[Mags]

Yes not a fan or cartridge only pens. But I did buy 50 cartridges from Mr Pen in the UK so set for my lifetime.

[milkb0at]

For students, and I suppose people out and about, cartridges are miles more convenient. You only need one pen and a few spare cartridges. If ink runs out in the middle of a lecture, just swap in a new cartridge. The alternatives are the relative complexity and delay of refilling from a bottle (which you hope hasn't broken or leaked in your bag) or the expense of having another pre-filled fountain pen to hand.

[Brisboy]

I only have two pens that are strictly cart loaded. A Kaweco AL Sport, and a Pilot Petit1. Oddly, I don't mind that the Petit1 is cartridge only (probably because it holds more ink in it's little cart than a short standard international does anyways), but am kind of iffy that the Kaweco is a cart-only pen.

Would not say that I *hate* it per se, as I don't always mind syringe filling a cartridge. But that may change if I run out of ink out in the wild (and I'm syringe filling from a bottle).

At least there's a ton of other options to pick from if you just hate cartridge only unless you manage to land your hands on a pen that you absolutely love, but that one fatal flaw (ie: like the Kaweco AL Sport). But Hate? I'd just make a decision, and move on.

But if you REALLY want to get the Kaweco Sport or AL Sport and must use a piston style converter, you can get this.

http://templarink.com/03_MiniConverter.html
http://templarink.com/images/MiniConverter.jpg

Just make sure that when you order to specify that you want the "Skinny Mini" in the special instructions, as that's the one that was designed to work in the Kaweco sport line.

I did order one of those, but I probably won't get it until the middle of next week. I plan on reviewing it on my site.


I don't really understand why there are so few modern lever filers. It seems such an elegant, simple solution that would be much much simpler to implement than a piston, and less of a pita than short carts only


Not sure either, maybe most of the companies do not think there's a big market for it outside of vintage or that they don't trust users not to damage the lever?

Thank you! I love my Ohto rook but don't love that it's cartridge only so have ordered a couple of these mini piston converters. The other one will go in a kaweco sport to see how it compares to the squeeze converter.

[Lady Onogaro]

I don't mind them; I love Lamy Violet, and the only way you can get it is in cartridges. I like the J. Herbin cartridges in their little tin can. I also like the Chesterfield ones.

[Scrawler]

In the early 1990s I bought a Tombow Egg fp28 in anticipation of the day when I would develop arthritis and would need a thicker pen. It is short and fat and only takes the short cartridges. I also like inks that are not the standard blue or black. So I hid away a number of empty cartridges and syringes with it. Since that time the ink world has opened up and cartridges are now available in many colours. This is the only cartridge only pen I have. There are two reasons I do not like cartridge only. The first is that I do not like to squeeze them to prime the nib, and the other is that they look so empty and insubstantial when I separate the section from the barrel.

[orfew]

I have piston fillers, button fillers, c/c pens and one cartridge only FP. This happens to be my MB 147. It is my daily user because the carts are so easy to change. The pen comes with a case that holds 6 carts and the pen itself holds 2 carts so I never run out of ink. I love the convenience of this pen.

[KBeezie]

I have piston fillers, button fillers, c/c pens and one cartridge only FP. This happens to be my MB 147. It is my daily user because the carts are so easy to change. The pen comes with a case that holds 6 carts and the pen itself holds 2 carts so I never run out of ink. I love the convenience of this pen.

I've always been a little confused by MB's numbering system since from what I can tell ... least unsuccessfully so.

First digit is their tier (1xx flagship/top, 2xx mid-range, 3xx lower end)
Second digit is the filling system... or supposedly it was...
And third digit was supposedly the nib size (ie: a 149 having a #9 nib... or something like that).

But then I see a 146 that's a piston filler, and a 147 that's a cartridge pen, or a 220 that's a piston filler and a 225 that's also a piston filler, but both have same sized nibs, etc.

Was that numbering ever in practice outside of just the first digit, or have I pretty much heard BS regarding that :P

[Laura N]

Speaking of MB, I've always enjoyed the nib on the MB Bohème, and the size works for me. If it weren't crazy expensive, and if I didn't already have too many pens, I'd have one.

I don't mind cartridges at all. In fact I use only cartridges in my purse pen and when I travel. They are portable, they aren't messy, and carrying extra cartridges is more convenient than bringing liquid ink. The only thing that annoys me is that many companies use their own proprietary cartridge size.

[orfew]

I have piston fillers, button fillers, c/c pens and one cartridge only FP. This happens to be my MB 147. It is my daily user because the carts are so easy to change. The pen comes with a case that holds 6 carts and the pen itself holds 2 carts so I never run out of ink. I love the convenience of this pen.

I've always been a little confused by MB's numbering system since from what I can tell ... least unsuccessfully so.

First digit is their tier (1xx flagship/top, 2xx mid-range, 3xx lower end)
Second digit is the filling system... or supposedly it was...
And third digit was supposedly the nib size (ie: a 149 having a #9 nib... or something like that).

But then I see a 146 that's a piston filler, and a 147 that's a cartridge pen, or a 220 that's a piston filler and a 225 that's also a piston filler, but both have same sized nibs, etc.

Was that numbering ever in practice outside of just the first digit, or have I pretty much heard BS regarding that :P
See this article
http://www.collectorsweekly.com/articles/the-pinnacle-of-pens-author-barry-gabay-on-writing-in-style-and-the-montblanc-149/

[snedwos]

I dont mind cartridges, i mind them being the only option.

[ethernautrix]

I love using cartridges - they're my favorite. I refill and re-seal them. The pens I use don't use the international size (small) - but I do have a few that do use them (Montblanc 100 Historical, Kaweco Liliput), and it doesn't bother me to use them.

[caribbean_skye]

I love using cartridges - they're my favorite. I refill and re-seal them. The pens I use don't use the international size (small) - but I do have a few that do use them (Montblanc 100 Historical, Kaweco Liliput), and it doesn't bother me to use them.

kind of curious how you re-seal them, care to share that tid-bit?

[Algester]

normally people use hot glue but there are other methods I would guess... like rubber clay?
I dont hate cartridges either think of them as convenience if there is no more other way like running out of ink in the middle of things... say hand writing an entry for NaNoWriMo outside of your house?
not unless you have a tank of ink with you... or spend lots of USDs for that Visconti ink pot for each of your inks

[chatminouche]

I'm on the fence on this... on one hand, I love my Kaweco Sport because it is small and I have smaller hands... on the other hand, it is frustrating to have to refill so often... I guess a compromise for me is that I love the Kaweco Summer Purple colour, and the cartridges hold more ink than the silly squeeze converter... but I'm also willing to reload the cartridges if needed...

I also tried to convert my Sport into an eyedropper, but had some horrible blobbing issues... it would blob out huge amounts of ink on the paper spontaneously... that never happens when I'm using it with the cartridge or converter...

[Austin_Malone]

Cartridge only pens make me want to cry. Same goes to a pen that comes without a converter.