My oldest pen yet, a Moore BCHR lever filler.

[KBeezie]

My newest and probably my oldest (by age) acquisition. A Moore BCHR (Black Chased Hard Rubber) lever filler from around 1910 to 1920. Freshly blackened, and I just got around to sealing the section and smoothing/adjusting the nib. The nib is an untipped 14K gold nib with some flex to it. The feed is just a straight (no fins/collectors) hard rubber feed.

Got it currently filled up with Rohrer & Klingner Salix (Blue-ish Iron Gall).

The two write samples on Rhodia 80g (#12 pad, 3.3in x 4.7in) is the front and back, the first being the initial fill and testing, and the back side is when I went and re-smoothed it to get the outer sides from catching on the paper.

http://static.karlblessing.com/pens/moore_bchr/capped.jpg

http://static.karlblessing.com/pens/moore_bchr/uncapped.jpg

http://static.karlblessing.com/pens/moore_bchr/uncapped_2.jpg

http://static.karlblessing.com/pens/moore_bchr/posted.jpg

http://static.karlblessing.com/pens/moore_bchr/write_salix.jpg

http://static.karlblessing.com/pens/moore_bchr/write_salix2.jpg

[Jon Szanto]

Could you say what it was that caused you to decide to apply blackening to the pen?

[KBeezie]

Could you say what it was that caused you to decide to apply blackening to the pen?

I didn't apply it. Sean soaked it in a blackening solution before sending it to me. In the chat when he said it was still in the "blackening solution", I asked about that and this was the response:



Yeah the HR turns brown, kinda like rust in a way, I soak them in a solution that draws the brown out and returns them to their natural black color


So... not sure what you're getting at, if it's the natural color of the hard rubber.

By the way I think this one is an Moore L92, found some online identical in design/shape/chasing but mine has just a blank smooth spot where it would normally say "Lever Self-Finning The Moor Pen Co..." and I don't have the brand on the clip. I also noticed some variations of the L92 had a cap band.

[Jon Szanto]

Awkward wording, I suppose: I didn't mean *you* did it, I assumed that your restoration person did it. I've never heard it quite phrased that way, as the brown color is oxidation of the surface of the rubber. I don't understand how something could "draw out" the brown color, though it has me curious, since messing around with old BHCR can be a delicate process and decision. Nice pen from a great era.

There is some good material on reblackening on David Nishimura's site (http://www.vintagepens.com/FAQrepair/reblackening.shtml).

[KBeezie]

Awkward wording, I suppose: I didn't mean *you* did it, I assumed that your restoration person did it. I've never heard it quite phrased that way, as the brown color is oxidation of the surface of the rubber. I don't understand how something could "draw out" the brown color, though it has me curious, since messing around with old BHCR can be a delicate process and decision. Nice pen from a great era.

There is some good material on reblackening on David Nishimura's site (http://www.vintagepens.com/FAQrepair/reblackening.shtml).

I asked Sean if he had a hard rubber pen I might like because I wanted to get something quite vintage looking but not metal and not resin/celluloid, and figured I might enjoy hard rubber, which he said he'd look at his bulk of recently acquired pens which he has a little over a dozen different BCHRs and would met me know if he found one that fit my budget. He did, put a new sac on and got it back to it's original black color and cleaned it up a bit. I just adjusted and smoothed the nib to my liking and that was about all I needed to do once I got it. There wasn't much that needed to be done to it.

Figured it to be a Moore but couldn't find an exact model because unlike all the other Moores of exactly the same shape/clip/lever/size, mine simply does not have a brand on the clip or barrel. The square shape opposite of the lever where it would normally say something like "Self-Filling Lever The Moore Pen Co..." is just smooth as if it never had an imprint. It resembles the early L-92 (~ 1918) as it's the same minus the plating and branding (the nib is "Warranted" instead of a specific brand). Based on what I could find out about the company, I guess it could be possible that it was before 1915 when they were still making cheaper pens and didn't bother to brand them. But I don't think it's any older than 1910, but it's not newer than 1920 if it is the L-92 because it lacks a cap band.

But yea that's all speculations and all, so would love to see any additional information.

Anywho I really do like the feel of it. It's lightweight, more so than some of my resin/celluloid pens, but it's not heavy or cold like a metal pen, and the material warms to my hands a little faster than the plastic pens I have. It also feels pretty solid/durable. The nib has some tooth to it even after smoothing mainly on more fibrous paper and it's better since I smoothed off the outer sides that may have been catching. It's also nice that I can write quickly at normal pace with consistent normal ink flow but it doesn't take much at all to flex it, but it's not too flexy that it interferes with normal writing. The Salix ink seems to give it the desired dryness.

[discopig]

Moore pens are very underrated pens. I love the few I have and the nibs are always amazing.

[marie9999]

Thanks for sharing the photos of your pen. The "blackening" looks really nice - I have always been too chicken to try to modify the brown.





Moore pens are very underrated pens. I love the few I have and the nibs are always amazing.

I agree. :)

[Jon Szanto]

Everyone can, and should, do with their pens what they like. After all, they own the pens.

The thing is that the "to blacken, or not to blacken" question regarding BH(C)R pens is a long-standing one, and not only are there various ways that this can be accomplished, but they do so with varying degrees of degrading the original. If one never wishes to pass the pen along and keep it just for personal use, truly whatever. If one has a model that may have both a provenance and also a future value, the decision you make on this issue can have a significant impact on that future value.

Just a pen area where it is good to know the background on all of this subject, and to very much ask questions before purchase, etc.

[Farmboy]

I'm not sure what 'draw[ing] out" the black color means. You either dye the surface black or you remove the surface to expose the undamaged rubber that is black. We can discuss this at length if wanted.

To Jon's point, the blacken or not blackened issue is important on many levels. Most collectors prefer unaltered pens and are not upset by a little discoloration. It quickly gets complicated. Sean clearly sold the pen as 'blackened'. You might well decide to move the pen on and may or may not indicated the pen is 'blackened'. I suspect you will but you could forget, who knows. The next person may sell it as 'original color'. Discerning buyers will know how to tell and likely pass. (Note that this isn't a particularly expensive or sought after pen so it is a bit difficult to apply the logic--so I will relay an example.)

About 2 years ago I was asked to look at and evaluate two substantial hard rubber pens. First was a Parker Giant, second a Waterman 20. The Giant had uneven fading and a particularly memorable imprint. I made a significant offer for the pen but was turned down. The 20 had the crispest chasing I had seen in a long time. It was evenly discolored but not olive like some. I made a good offer on this pen as well. The seller again refused. Several months pass and I'm shown the same two pens again but this time they were blackened. (It is rather easy to tell if you know what to look for.) I was given a price for each and for both. I passed though the price was essentially what I offered before and would have accepted the offer for the previously unaltered pens. I should add that the seller likely didn't remember it was I who had made the offer on the pens pre-blackening. I also didn't comment on the blackening when shown the pens.

Now jump ahead about a year. I get the two pens for 'evaluation' and 'appraisal', this time from a new owner. I confirmed the source of the pens with the owner. I put on the evaluation that both pens had been reblackened and in my opinion this hurt the appraised value. The owner asked if I had proof they were reblackened, I did. Remember that memorable imprint, well it was still memorable and I had a picture of it in the 'faded' condition as proof. (The imprint was particularly deep and had one unusual scratch through the letters that couldn't be easily addressed-and wasn't).

Moral of the story. Pen got reblackened and sold as an original to someone that didn't know and I believe overpaid for an 'investment' quality pair of pens.

Do as you will.

[sloegin]

Figured it to be a Moore but couldn't find an exact model because unlike all the other Moores of exactly the same shape/clip/lever/size, mine simply does not have a brand on the clip or barrel. The square shape opposite of the lever where it would normally say something like "Self-Filling Lever The Moore Pen Co..." is just smooth as if it never had an imprint. It resembles the early L-92 (~ 1918) as it's the same minus the plating and branding (the nib is "Warranted" instead of a specific brand). Based on what I could find out about the company, I guess it could be possible that it was before 1915 when they were still making cheaper pens and didn't bother to brand them. But I don't think it's any older than 1910, but it's not newer than 1920 if it is the L-92 because it lacks a cap band.

But yea that's all speculations and all, so would love to see any additional information.
If it is all speculation might it be better to call the pen a no-name than a Moore? Before Moore was called such it was called the American Fountain Pen Company and they made quality safety pens.

[Jon Szanto]

Farmboy = Gold.

[Hawk]

I thank all of you for your input. BCHR pens that are black or black with softened imprints or turned some shade of brown have interested me. I have one pen that is 'brown' and I have decided to leave it the way it is. I can't comment on other's pen treatment (or lack of it), it is what they want. Education of the buyer is important, you buy what you buy; right or wrong.....

[ainterne]

I bought some of this below recently..... I have been scared to try it on one of my normal pens, but I bought a cheap broken pen off Ebay this week to use a sacrificial lamb in my first test... I will show before and after shots if anyone is interested. Or perhaps someone knows about this stuff already and has posted here? Anyone use it?

Pensbury Manor Black Hard Rubber Pen Potion No. 9
http://www.pensburymanor.com/pensburymanor/PMBHRPPNo9.html

KBeezy, your pen looks gorgeous....very nice in deed and good job..... Its exactly what I would buy if it was for sale.

Phil...

[Jon Szanto]

Anyone use it?

Syd's potion is somewhat well-known in vintage pendom. There are some (and some with weight) who opine that, of the potential methods of making a previously black pen appear to be black again, using a coating (like the PP#9) is preferable to other methods (which remove the top, oxidized layer, therefore actually removing material from the pen). Again, this is a pretty often-discussed topic in vintage pen circles, and no camp ever totally gains the upper hand, save for the fact that if a pen is to be sold as vintage, it will often lose value if the appearance has been altered and not disclosed. A pen that has suffered damage in the effort to make it look young again, of course, is sad but obvious. Like an aging Hollywood starlet.

[Farmboy]

Familiar with #9. Used it on many radio knobs.

For pens I prefer potion #7. (Not so good with radios.)

[Jon Szanto]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tA6wySeeb6I

[KBeezie]

Just to throw some clarifications out there:
- I'm a user not a collector
- It was cheap
- If I decide to resell it, I'm not going to sell it as something it's not (ie: original condition branded pen)
- Most people don't *plan* to pass down the pens, if they did they usually get some pricey documented heirloom, as you can imagine I don't have plans to "pass it down", if by some sheer luck it survives me and my kids all grown get ahold of it, good luck to them.

[Jon Szanto]

Karl, I think most of those points you raise were already assumed by us, and I didn't mean these comments to seem to cast aspersions on *your* actions.

Nonetheless, one of the pluses, as well as one of the minuses, in online forums is that when things get posted, others can - and often do -take them at face value. I think a thread like this is a more-than-appropriate place to speak about the potential negative effects of blackening a vintage pen. One never knows who will end up with a truly impressive and worthy pen among an estate or inheritance, see the initial posts, and think "Cool! I'm going to get this pen all shiny black again!"

Without thinking it through, because they simply weren't aware. Not their fault, but easily corrected.

The very fine vintage pens that are left in the world are, by definition, a finite number. Every time one gets taken out of that category by naive or uneducated actions, that finite number is reduced. All we wish is that people have a full picture, so they can choose wisely.

[KBeezie]

Karl, I think most of those points you raise were already assumed by us, and I didn't mean these comments to seem to cast aspersions on *your* actions.

Nonetheless, one of the pluses, as well as one of the minuses, in online forums is that when things get posted, others can - and often do -take them at face value. I think a thread like this is a more-than-appropriate place to speak about the potential negative effects of blackening a vintage pen. One never knows who will end up with a truly impressive and worthy pen among an estate or inheritance, see the initial posts, and think "Cool! I'm going to get this pen all shiny black again!"

Without thinking it through, because they simply weren't aware. Not their fault, but easily corrected.

The very fine vintage pens that are left in the world are, by definition, a finite number. Every time one gets taken out of that category by naive or uneducated actions, that finite number is reduced. All we wish is that people have a full picture, so they can choose wisely.

I understand all that, and I'm just leaving my note as to where I stand on it.