Waterman ID help please

What is this?

Measures 110mm capped
Cap length 50mm
Double cap band
Barrel imprint "Waterman's MADE IN ENGLAND" - No other helpful numbers on the barrel.
Nib marked "Waterman's IDEAL ENGLAND"
Attachment 8606

Looks like a Waterman from the 40's,possibly a 513.


John

Agreed. But only 110mm short, so maybe a 512v?

I was going to say 354 but then I looked at mine and it only has one cap band. Other than that, it looks almost identical.

I thought 512v but that double cap band is the kicker.

Quite a few thirties, forties and fifties English Waterman models have neither names nor numbers. They're often not directly comparable with the American versions made at the same time. I think Waterman did it with an eye to confusing collectors of the future.

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Originally Posted by Deb

Quite a few thirties, forties and fifties English Waterman models have neither names nor numbers. They're often not directly comparable with the American versions made at the same time. I think Waterman did it with an eye to confusing collectors of the future.

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Exactly! This barrel is in good condition so not worn enough for any number to have vanished. It will remain a bit of a mystery, as is the nib. Although I am pretty sure it is an original nib, it does not have the flex I associate with Watermans of the period.

thanks all for the help.

2 bands would make it a 513, from around 1944-1946. On the nib does it say W2-A?. English Watermans were less flexible during that time to facilitate quicker writing. If you are looking for a slightly more flexible W2 nib, you have a higher probability of finding it in a Canadian model.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Deb

Quite a few thirties, forties and fifties English Waterman models have neither names nor numbers. They're often not directly comparable with the American versions made at the same time. I think Waterman did it with an eye to confusing collectors of the future.

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That's a position I've long held as well. I suspect they had a bet on with Sheaffer as to who could cause the most sleepless nights among pen collectors fifty years later.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ernst Bitterman

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Deb

Quite a few thirties, forties and fifties English Waterman models have neither names nor numbers. They're often not directly comparable with the American versions made at the same time. I think Waterman did it with an eye to confusing collectors of the future.

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That's a position I've long held as well. I suspect they had a bet on with Sheaffer as to who could cause the most sleepless nights among pen collectors fifty years later.

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They are not called the Waterman Confuser for nothing.

It will be easy to identify if you add more clear pic