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Thread: Pen polisher product on ebay

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    Default Pen polisher product on ebay

    Has anyone used the following before, plus is it worth the money ?


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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    I have used a very similar 2 step product and that works really well. I don't know how much it costs from your source but I bought mine from someone on FPN who used to source it from an Australian manufacturer.

    As long as you are very careful when you use it and follow the instructions you should be OK

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    There are several multi-step abrasive products out there. This one seems to be re-packaged, so specific information about it's ingredients is going to be impossible to get. I would suggest that you try something by a manufacturer which follows good industrial practices (like providing WHMIS data), so that you can be sure you are not putting an ingredient on your pen which might damage it. (It should be noted that sometimes the residue left over from products can damage a pen's materials over time.)

    A good, and entirely benign, product line is sold by Novus. We have used this extensively, including on vintage pens, and can recommend it. The 2 oz. bottles are quite affordable, and will do many, many pens. They also sell tiny 'pillow packs'.

    Another very effective option is to use a polishing cloth impregnated with jeweler's rouge. Again, they are very low in price, and can polish many pens (and are very effective on metal parts, too.)
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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    Thank you for this information.

    Quote Originally Posted by D Armstrong View Post
    There are several multi-step abrasive products out there. This one seems to be re-packaged, so specific information about it's ingredients is going to be impossible to get. I would suggest that you try something by a manufacturer which follows good industrial practices (like providing WHMIS data), so that you can be sure you are not putting an ingredient on your pen which might damage it. (It should be noted that sometimes the residue left over from products can damage a pen's materials over time.)

    A good, and entirely benign, product line is sold by Novus. We have used this extensively, including on vintage pens, and can recommend it. The 2 oz. bottles are quite affordable, and will do many, many pens. They also sell tiny 'pillow packs'.

    Another very effective option is to use a polishing cloth impregnated with jeweler's rouge. Again, they are very low in price, and can polish many pens (and are very effective on metal parts, too.)

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    Quote Originally Posted by D Armstrong View Post
    There are several multi-step abrasive products out there. This one seems to be re-packaged, so specific information about it's ingredients is going to be impossible to get. I would suggest that you try something by a manufacturer which follows good industrial practices (like providing WHMIS data), so that you can be sure you are not putting an ingredient on your pen which might damage it. (It should be noted that sometimes the residue left over from products can damage a pen's materials over time.)

    A good, and entirely benign, product line is sold by Novus. We have used this extensively, including on vintage pens, and can recommend it. The 2 oz. bottles are quite affordable, and will do many, many pens. They also sell tiny 'pillow packs'.

    Another very effective option is to use a polishing cloth impregnated with jeweler's rouge. Again, they are very low in price, and can polish many pens (and are very effective on metal parts, too.)
    Note that the finer Novus polishes contain silicone and wax, so I don't use them. Rouge works on metals primarily through a burnishing action, not via abrasion.

    --Daniel
    “Every discussion which is made from an egoistic standpoint is corrupted from the start and cannot yield an absolutely sure conclusion. The ego puts its own interest first and twists every argument, word, even fact to suit that interest.”
    ― Paul Brunton, The Notebooks of Paul Brunton

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    Quote Originally Posted by kirchh View Post
    Note that the finer Novus polishes contain silicone and wax, so I don't use them. Rouge works on metals primarily through a burnishing action, not via abrasion. --Daniel
    Hi Daniel,

    When you have a moment is it possible if you could please let us know which product do you use?

    Many thanks.

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    Quote Originally Posted by RuiFromUK View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by kirchh View Post
    Note that the finer Novus polishes contain silicone and wax, so I don't use them. Rouge works on metals primarily through a burnishing action, not via abrasion. --Daniel
    Hi Daniel,

    When you have a moment is it possible if you could please let us know which product do you use?

    Many thanks.
    I don't do much polishing of non-metal pens; I try to get them clean, which improves their appearance, and I mostly use a Selvyt cloth for wiping down pens (the most expensive untreated product they offer). The Micro-Mesh abrasive sheets/pads/sticks have their place for exterior work, and if a liquid product is called for, I suggest their Micro-gloss, which isn't formulated to leave behind any sort of gloss enhancer or protectant, though one must take care to remove all traces of the residue; however, having said that, I haven't used it in quite some time. I also use a Sunshine cloth on rare occasion on metal parts, though rarely, and I make an effort to scrub off anything it leaves behind. All the usual cautions about contact between hard rubber parts and water-based liquids apply.

    --Daniel
    “Every discussion which is made from an egoistic standpoint is corrupted from the start and cannot yield an absolutely sure conclusion. The ego puts its own interest first and twists every argument, word, even fact to suit that interest.”
    ― Paul Brunton, The Notebooks of Paul Brunton

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    What are the problems with having wax or silicone on a pen surface? Both are inert and have no chemical or physical interaction to degrade the plastic.

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    Quote Originally Posted by elaineb View Post
    What are the problems with having wax or silicone on a pen surface? Both are inert and have no chemical or physical interaction to degrade the plastic.
    Wax may release acids over time, and both wax and silicone can be very difficult to remove completely should either prove deleterious to the health, feel, or operation of the pen, or should a different coating system (or none at all) be desired. Both can attract dust (wax in particular), and wax can become frosty and flaky over time. I generally avoid procedures that result in leaving anything behind on a pen.

    --Daniel
    “Every discussion which is made from an egoistic standpoint is corrupted from the start and cannot yield an absolutely sure conclusion. The ego puts its own interest first and twists every argument, word, even fact to suit that interest.”
    ― Paul Brunton, The Notebooks of Paul Brunton

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    Quote Originally Posted by elaineb View Post
    What are the problems with having wax or silicone on a pen surface? Both are inert and have no chemical or physical interaction to degrade the plastic.
    This has been discussed at pretty great length here before. Daniel has some strong reservations, in terms of look, feel, and preservation. Also, while one may say that "wax" is inert and has no interaction, there is more recent evidence that some of the very wax products developed for "museum quality" protection (I'm looking at you, Renaissance Wax) have ended up causing problems.

    In the end, I suppose, it is down to personal preference, *especially* if the pens will never be re-sold. In that case, it makes sense to examine all viewpoints.

    ETA: Annnnd, while I was typing, Daniel chimed in. So that's that.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    I'd be interested in seeing conservation research on the interaction between older plastics and things like wax and silicones. Look and feel are, of course, personal preference and I respect that people want their own tools to look and feel a certain way in hand.

    But I have worked extensively with conservators (paper, textiles, art objects) and they were always very careful to do accelerated aging testing of material interactions, and base their conclusions on hard data. When I hear "wax releases acids over time", I need to see a citation that documents this. I'm not challenging the veracity of the claim, but I do want to see the specifics of the testing: what waxes and plastics were involved? What acids were released? Were there environmental factors involved? I don't know much about Renaissance Wax, Jon -- what has the research shown about its long term use?

    I'm also guessing from Jon's words that this may have been a heated debate at some point? If I've accidentally tread onto dangerous ground, I apologize and won't push this any further.

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    Elaine, I wouldn't say heated, but a fair number of people presented info and laid down their claims. Some of this happened a few years ago on FPN, I do believe the topic has come up here as well.

    Indeed: it is very much "to each their own". There is a great span between the person who wants a nice-looking daily user and the pen collector who wants to preserve a certain object in a certain way, more for future pristine preservation than any form of use. Even within collectors there are camps between "make it look nice" to "patina rules".

    I'm a bit swamped so I can't do too much dedicated digging. The one entry in research topics that I've remembered and been able to find is here, regarding Renaissance Wax. At least *these* conservators are urging caution. I note that one pen where I had used that had some similar (if lesser) problems, and it was a sterling silver Sheaffer.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    I would like to read more on problems with Renaissance Wax as well. I have put it on a lot of archived pens and you make me scared.

    EDIT: Thanks, you were faster.
    Last edited by nico; April 21st, 2015 at 12:54 AM. Reason: Time race condition :)

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    Quote Originally Posted by nico View Post
    I would like to read more on problems with Renaissance Wax as well. I have put it on a lot of archived pens and you make me scared.
    See my post above yours, and I don't know that I would be scared. I never used it often, and it has certainly caused me caution, but I don't know that the jury is in on this. I tend to go on the minimalist end of the spectrum when I can, anyway, but knowledge is power.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    Well, honestly, the article is about problems of removal of a thick coating of wax from a metal surface that had been cleaned with highly reactive chemicals prior to application. It is a very different context than the use of wax on plastic. I'm not trying to pick nits here, but the chemistry of the materials involved is very different. The difficulties that the wax presented could have absolutely no application in our context of vintage pens, like saying "water drowned those people, so it must be harmful to drink."

    I do respect the desire to be conservative and not do anything to a beloved pen that wouldn't be reversible down the line. But there has to be some sense of proportion to it.

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    The article Jon shared was an interesting read. If we were speaking about a pen worth thousands of dollars, I'd absolutely consider the findings in the article.

    However, with respect to the context of this thread, I believe wax poses a different issue.

    If your goal is to correct the scratches on a pen, wax (or everyone that I'm aware of) will not meet the challenge.

    If your goal is to MASK the scratches on a pen, that's where a wax/sealant might add value.

    In my opinion, I'm not trusting some random seller on ebay. There are plenty of cost-effective options available that are offered by respected brands.

    Personally, I use Poorboys SSR polishes. They're most commonly used on automotive applications, but I've had tremendous success using them on pens.
    http://www.poorboysworld.com/super-swirl-removers.htm

    Long story short: there's nothing special about that ebay product. While it may very well be legitimate, there's minimal information to support that it is. Personally, I'd rather buy from a trusted source.

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    Quote Originally Posted by elaineb View Post
    I'd be interested in seeing conservation research on the interaction between older plastics and things like wax and silicones. Look and feel are, of course, personal preference and I respect that people want their own tools to look and feel a certain way in hand.

    But I have worked extensively with conservators (paper, textiles, art objects) and they were always very careful to do accelerated aging testing of material interactions, and base their conclusions on hard data. When I hear "wax releases acids over time", I need to see a citation that documents this. I'm not challenging the veracity of the claim, but I do want to see the specifics of the testing: what waxes and plastics were involved? What acids were released? Were there environmental factors involved? I don't know much about Renaissance Wax, Jon -- what has the research shown about its long term use?

    I'm also guessing from Jon's words that this may have been a heated debate at some point? If I've accidentally tread onto dangerous ground, I apologize and won't push this any further.
    I suggest an internet search exploring the issues with use of various waxes in conservation, as I gather you hadn't encountered this topic previously in your conservation work. Waxes such as beeswax and carnauba wax contain an acidic component. Some product formulations contain other ingredients to neutralize the acidity of the wax, though these stabilizers can lose effectiveness with environmental exposure over time; though carnauba wax is popular for use on automobiles, there are concerns in that arena that carnauba wax products turn acidic over time and attack paint, for example.

    Another issue with waxes and silicone unrelated to their possible deleterious effects on the object is the great difficulty of completely removing them, should that be desired for any reason.

    I see no reason to apply coatings to pens, and several reasons not to, so I don't.

    --Daniel
    “Every discussion which is made from an egoistic standpoint is corrupted from the start and cannot yield an absolutely sure conclusion. The ego puts its own interest first and twists every argument, word, even fact to suit that interest.”
    ― Paul Brunton, The Notebooks of Paul Brunton

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    Quote Originally Posted by elaineb View Post
    I do respect the desire to be conservative and not do anything to a beloved pen that wouldn't be reversible down the line. But there has to be some sense of proportion to it.
    But of course! And that sense of proportion should be generated by each individual, specific to their needs and desires. For instance, you mention that the example was "a very different context than the use of wax of plastic." Of course - except that pretty much my only use of the product was on pens with metal bodies and caps. So it bears, maybe, a bit more relevance to me, especially over time. I *did* notice one of the sterling silver pens starting to become cloudy, and I have back way off of my use of the product at the moment. I'll continue to evaluate it with less important or valued pens.

    I figure that if knowledge is power, ignorance is weakness. I'd rather have the information available and considered than have people making decisions based on... air.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    I absolutely agree, Jon, knowledge is power, which is actually why I'm playing devil's advocate here to some extent. I think people have to think more critically than ever about what information they accept and believe in this internet age, because there is more misinformation out there now than ever before.

    I'm still interested in this question of waxes and acids, because as far as I know, waxes contain a large component of -fatty acids- which are nothing like what we classically think of as an acid (i.e. a waterbased substance of low pH that causes reactive damage in many materials). Fatty acids, in contrast, are complex carbon-chain molecules that have no pH because they have no water component. I'm not sure where the name came from. Fatty acid molecules, like oleic acid, linoleic acid, stearic acid, etc., are the building blocks of oils and waxes. (A subset of fatty acids, called EFAs, or Essential Fatty Acids, are the so-called "Omega Oils" that people take for nutritional purposes.)

    If the problem with waxes is that they break down into fatty acids that get sticky from oxidation, that's a very different problem than if they break down into acidic substances that will eat away at the material they're supposed to protect. I'll go poking around on my own research now, because the question intrigues me. (Man, I sure wish I still had access to the conservation library where I used to work!)

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    Default Re: Pen polisher product on ebay

    I have concerns about waxes trapping harmful decomposition products in celluloid pens, thus accelerating those processes; waxes can also turn hazy or dull over time, and I recall that efflorescence can also be an issue with substances containing fatty acids. And, again, wax is difficult to remove from plastics.

    --Daniel
    “Every discussion which is made from an egoistic standpoint is corrupted from the start and cannot yield an absolutely sure conclusion. The ego puts its own interest first and twists every argument, word, even fact to suit that interest.”
    ― Paul Brunton, The Notebooks of Paul Brunton

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