What Parker is this?

[mhosea]

I think the pli-glass sacs were originally advertised to be good for at least 30 years. In practice they've done much better. I've heard of them breaking down, but I've restored a dozen or so 51 Aeros, and I haven't seen a bad pli-glass sac yet. Seen gummy connectors and corroded breather tubes, though. But neither of those things would prevent you from enjoying your pen. They would just limit your ink capacity.

[stub]

mhosea, with the "crime lab" chops, uping the geek in fpgeeks. heh.
nicely done.

[Laurie]

I agree. It was a bit like the crime scene investigations on TV. The camera shot comparison and the picture adjustments. And then the correct profile. Mike I think you have an alternative vocation in forensic penography. And BTW I think Hugh may be spot on with the Aero id. I am over the first hurdle but now have to see the condition. I suppose for the price I paid I can send it away for any restoration as I am not experienced enough to do it myself. As a fellow Aussie, Hugh do you have any recommendations for an Australian based restorer if needed?

[pajaro]

I think the pli-glass sacs were originally advertised to be good for at least 30 years. In practice they've done much better. I've heard of them breaking down, but I've restored a dozen or so 51 Aeros, and I haven't seen a bad pli-glass sac yet. Seen gummy connectors and corroded breather tubes, though. But neither of those things would prevent you from enjoying your pen. They would just limit your ink capacity.

When you mention a gummy connector, do you mean gummy deposits in the connector, or is the material of the connector gummy? I don't normally delve this deep into the pen, but maybe I should have taken them fully apart more often.

[mhosea]

When you mention a gummy connector, do you mean gummy deposits in the connector, or is the material of the connector gummy?

The latter. Apparently, the early pli-glass sacs leeched plasticizer into the sac nipple, turning it soft. The sacs are usually adhered pretty well to the nipple, I think, so it wouldn't necessarily leak, and the cover doesn't stress the sac nipple, so it can last a long time like this, maybe until you need to replace the sac for some reason.

At need or not, I usually fix it when I find it. I've replaced a couple of them with NOS connectors (complete with new sac, from vintagepens.com, not cheap), and others I've "drilled" out (drilled in quotes because I carefully bore it out by hand, mostly with abrasives rather than drill bits--a tedious process) and epoxied in a short section of tubing to form a new sac nipple. There's mention of it, and a picture of the latter type repair, here on Richard Binder's site.

[Laurie]

After doing a bit more research I believe that Parker released a 51 Special in 1950 which had a steel nib and a hooped filler bar. If this pen was given as a gift in 1951 there is probably a real chance that it is a special. I am hoping that the Norwich Football Club werent penny pinchers with their gifts and went for the slightly dearer ordinary Parker 51 with the gold nib. I suppose the Special was also a good pen and you probably wouldnt notice any difference between the nibs as I have read the Parker 51 nibs were nails in any event.

[jar]

After doing a bit more research I believe that Parker released a 51 Special in 1950 which had a steel nib and a hooped filler bar. If this pen was given as a gift in 1951 there is probably a real chance that it is a special. I am hoping that the Norwich Football Club werent penny pinchers with their gifts and went for the slightly dearer ordinary Parker 51 with the gold nib. I suppose the Special was also a good pen and you probably wouldnt notice any difference between the nibs as I have read the Parker 51 nibs were nails in any event.

The "51 Special" was still a great pen but IIRC came with the "Octanium" nib.

[HughC]

I agree. It was a bit like the crime scene investigations on TV. The camera shot comparison and the picture adjustments. And then the correct profile. Mike I think you have an alternative vocation in forensic penography. And BTW I think Hugh may be spot on with the Aero id. I am over the first hurdle but now have to see the condition. I suppose for the price I paid I can send it away for any restoration as I am not experienced enough to do it myself. As a fellow Aussie, Hugh do you have any recommendations for an Australian based restorer if needed?

This person is probably okay http://www.pensmith.com.au/. Haven't used him but he's been around for a while.

[Laurie]

51 Jewel Resized.jpg51 Nib resized..jpgFiller ID resized.jpgWell the pen arrived today. I was sure it would be a 51 Special but to my delight it is a straight Parker 51. From my research I think it is a Mark 1 as it has the black end on the filler system. It has a grey jewel. The nib is gold. I tested the sac and drew up some water and flushed it but not much came out. In fact it didnt suck up a lot of water but it may be that I am just not doing it right. I will read a bit more but it may be that problem with the breather tube deterioration and maybe the the sac connection has rotted away. I will soak it over night and see what happens. It looks a bit like a medium nib certainly a bit broader than fine. After soaking I will see what comes out. Sorry I couldnt get a clearer shot of the nib but my camera (Panasonic Lumix with macro mode has its limitations)

[mhosea]

It can be a little deceiving because the collector can hold a prodigious amount of ink. If the breather tube is good, you'll be able to push bubbles into the water and draw in more water in with each of 4 presses or so. If the breather tube is compromised, then depending on where it is compromised, you will be able to draw in less water, and stop being able to push any significant amount of bubbles, after some earlier stroke. If it is corroded at its base, by the second press, you're done, i.e. one press to saturate the feed and collector, another to draw into the sac what you may.

[Laurie]

Thanks Mike. I have followed the following link: http://www.fountainpennetwork.com/fo...hand-now-what/ I have used some of Goulet Pen Co. flush and have it now sitting straight up after drawing in some of the flush and then swirling it up and down. I now have it back in the flush in a narrow bottle up to the clutch ring. I will leave it for a few days and then try again to see if the sac appears okay. In fact the water in which it is sitting is quiet dark now so obviously there is a bit of dried ink coming out.
I have watched a couple of interesting youtube articles on disassembling the 51 and then inspecting and cleaning the breather and sac and sac nipple. Also how to clean the collector. It was very interesting and doesnt look that hard. Here is the connection:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YHdzy4RuYg
In this video he removes the parts after soaking in hot water (sometimes three times) and eventually got everything disconnected without any breakage. It doesnt look that hard but maybe it is harder than it looks. What are your thoughts. I could buy a new sac and breather for about $20 AUD from the UK. I will see how the pen performs after soaking

Do you think it is a Mark 1. I am just polishing the barrel with some micro gloss liquid abrasive and it is coming up well.. Apart from the engraving on the barrel and a small dent on the cap it appears to be in pretty good order.

[mhosea]

I didn't have the patience to watch it, just skim through, but from discussions on FPN, I think Glenn would know what he is talking about. I don't think servicing a 51 aerometric is very difficult, especially if the breather tube is in good shape and the nib and feed are properly set already (in which case you needn't remove the feed from the collector). You'll need thread sealant or shellac, possibly a new o-ring, though I've never felt like I absolutely had to replace the o-ring because I seal the threads and don't rely on it, anyway.

Replacing the breather tube is an operation that is only made difficult by the task of removing the fragments of the old one that might be stuck in the feed. David Nishimura suggests a certain micro-tap for this, but I've been suffering along without it (and I do mean "suffering"--I've spent way too much time picking out little bits with this or that makeshift tool).

For sure it's a Mark 1. We'd need a time warp to get the Mark 2 back to 1951.

[Laurie]

I am sorry for my ignorance about the Mark 1 and Mark 11 but I am still learning about the Parker 51 and my research was mainly what about whether this was a Special or a regular 51 . Congratulations on your very early prediction. I am quiet thrilled that I have got an iconic pen at a very reasonable price. And it is certainly in very reasonable condition (other than the engraving). But I dont intend to sell it so the engraving is part of its history. The barrell has polished up really well. I just used a liquid micro mesh but under a loupe I found a few scratches so I used some micro mesh pads followed my more micro liquid and it is glistening. Thanks again Mike for your spontaneous responses. I really appreciate your help.

[Laurie]

It can be a little deceiving because the collector can hold a prodigious amount of ink. If the breather tube is good, you'll be able to push bubbles into the water and draw in more water in with each of 4 presses or so. If the breather tube is compromised, then depending on where it is compromised, you will be able to draw in less water, and stop being able to push any significant amount of bubbles, after some earlier stroke. If it is corroded at its base, by the second press, you're done, i.e. one press to saturate the feed and collector, another to draw into the sac what you may.

Thanks Mike. I have had the pen soaking for quite a while and noticed that the water has turned quite black. Been sucking up the flush fluid and inverting the pen and swilling it side by side and placing it back in the flush liquid. Just changed the flushing fluid and again sucked some up and noticed that it does expel air bubbles on each of the six discharges. So hopefully that means I have a functional breather pipe . Will now leave it to soak for another 24 hours and flush out the pen with distilled water and will ink up and give it a write. Maybe it starting to look like I can put off a full restoration for a little while longer. Must admit I was looking forward to my first full separation of parts and a full clean and maybe some replacements.

I am still got a few goose bumps over the fact that I actually have such an iconic pen for such a reasonable price. Also it appears to be fully functional. Just another chapter in my fountain pen and dip nib experience. I am worried that the fire has now been rekindled. What is next?

[jar]

All sounds great. Now patience will be your friend.

A couple hits on general use. I always waited a long ten count between presses on my aeros to allow time to draw in ink through those little channels. Also, about once a year I would do a really good flush like you are doing now. I have not yet had a single "51" Aero sac fail.

[pajaro]

I don't think a 51 cap would fit on a 21 anyway. They didn't when I tried it. I don't think it's a Vac 51. 51 on the barrel, later than 1949 51 aero?

[Laurie]

Just an update on my wild 51. Just finished soaking for 24 hourss in Goulet Pen Flush. Nothing but clear water coming out now. Rinsed several times in demineralised water to get ride of the flush. Then let stand tip down into some blotting paper. Gave many flicks until no sign of any water coming out. Polished barrell with a micro mesh pad followed by micro finish paste. Might repeat later but to the naked eye it is glistening. Camera shots can be very critical especially in macro.

Inked up with Diamine Bilberry and attached is a photo of the writing sample and the pen. Not sure but I would describe it as a fine/medium. Writes smoothly without any vices. Will try and use it constantly for a while to ensure everything ok. I was sort of looking forward to trying a pull down and restoration but I think it is better that I didnt have to take this course as I have read how difficult it can be to get out the breather tube and other parts and how easy to break some of these small parts. Read that it is good to practice on a cheap pen like the Hiro 616. Why do people recommend that particular pen. Is it because it looks like a 51 and is cheap. Obviously it wouldnt have the same inners as a 51.

Thanks all for your constructive replies. I am going to keep my eye out at the antique shops etc and try and find a partner for my 51. Would like to try and get a blue or burgundy one next time
BTW I was looking at the barrel with a triplet and noticed that it has the words "Made in England" just where the main barrel joins the clutch ring. I cant see any other writing. on the barrel.

Parker 51 writing sample resized..jpgPolished Parker 51 and cap resized.jpg

[Laurie]

For sure it's a Mark 1. We'd need a time warp to get the Mark 2 back to 1951.

Hi Mike I am getting a bit confused. Here is an excerpt from an article:
"There are also two models of the MKII Parker "51": The first, MKII-A 1948-1949 had the transitional clip and the filler instruction engraving included "Press ribbed bar 6 times. There were two types of filler sleeves (see below) one was made of aluminium, the other of chrome-plated steel. Also the barrel threads were extended (raised). The second MKII-B model was made from 1950 and on, had a shorter clip and the filling instruction read: "Press ribbed bar 4 times", and the filler sleeve itself was made of brushed stainless steel. A rubber O-ring was fitted by the threads under the hood joint and the barrel threads were indented. There are no O-rings on the vacumatic fillers. MKII pens of course had a brand new filling system that was to be adopted by virtually all Parkers in the future, the Aerometric. "

Also I am presently doing writing tests with this 51 just to check that the collector and feed are unclogged and providing a constant good flow of writing. When I put the nib squarely on the paper and write I am noticing the occasional skip particularly on up strokes. So I thought it might be a feed problem. But I just came back and did more writing. When I roll the pen a bit to the left so that the left side of the nib is writing on the paper the writing suddenly become much smoother and much juicier. It actually feels and writes like a real medium nib and there is a much better and fuller ink flow. It feels so much better. Is this just a nib variation. I just havent experienced this feeling before. I am thinking that the original user of this pen may have written regularly on this slant so that the nib got worn in that way. Is this a common experience?

[mhosea]

The article you are reading is using a more finely graduated system than than the one I'm used to, which is http://www.richardspens.com/ref/profiles/51.htm . I think it is only a matter of parlance. It's perhaps beneficial to know that relying on these after-the-fact labels can be confusing because two different systems are in use.

The tines on your nib may be out of alignment. Here's your excuse to take the hood off. Note that you needn't remove the collector or feed. The nib can be pulled out directly once the hood is off and re-seated over the feed putting it back. If the tines are altered when putting it back on, you may need to supply some heat to relax the ebonite feed a bit.

[pajaro]

You might have a medium oblique, if you hit the sweet spot when rotating to the left. So, look at the nib. If it has a slant off to the left, it's a left oblique (direction like "/" ).