What do you think the best pen is?

[calamus]

Marmite, melted New Zealand Cheddar, bacon, and avocado on lightly toasted sourdough.

Is that an eyedropper or piston filler?

It's a converter. One bite, and you're converted.

Yea, I dunno about the marmite.

Look how much they're spreading on their toast! No wonder they hate it!

[Wile E Coyote]

Marmite, melted New Zealand Cheddar, bacon, and avocado on lightly toasted sourdough.

Is that an eyedropper or piston filler?

It's a converter. One bite, and you're converted.

Yea, I dunno about the marmite.

Look how much they're spreading on their toast! No wonder they hate it!

"It's sort of like camembert, but bad."

[calamus]

Camembert and marmite... I'll bet that's good, but not as good as Somerset Brie and marmite.

[calamus]

But look, we're losing sight of the subject of this thread, which has nothing to do with marmite. The question the OP posed was "What do you think the best pen is?"

It is interesting to note that in the current philosophical milieu, which has been corrupted by subjective idealism and relativism and Hegelian dialectics and all the other ills that the modern mind is suffering from, one and all have answered the question with some variant of "That is a non-question" or an "unanswerable question" or "that question needs to be reworded and redefined and massaged and tweaked and twisted into an entirely different question to be answerable," or some similar absurdity. And of course, everyone has come up with their own personal definition of what "best" means to them. That's right, just chuck the dictionary right out the window and try to communicate using words that have different meanings for everyone who employs them.

You're all overthinking the question. No one is daring to take it at face value, "What do you think the best pen is?" as in "What do you think the best pen in the whole world is?". Even this wording throws a sop to the modernists, because it falls short of what is probably the purest form this question, or one like it, could take, which would be, "What is the best pen in the world. "None of this "what do you think is the best" pussyfooting about.

I can hear dozens of voices all protesting, "But it's all subjective."

Rubbish. You might as well say that beauty is subjective. (Yes, I know, everyone believes that too. But as me dear, sainted mum used to say, "If everyone jumped off a bridge, would you do it too?" Just because everyone believes something, doesn't mean everyone is right.)

Some years ago in Topanga Canyon, which is in Southern California, a man named Alan Hjerpe succeeded in quantifying beauty, thereby making it possible to evaluate it objectively. He devised a unit of beauty, which he called the Helen. He was inspired by Helen of Troy, whose beauty was such that her face launched a thousand ships. A face with the beauty of one Helen, therefore, was sufficiently beautiful to launch a thousand ships. Consequently, a 500 milliHelen face could launch 500 ships, and a face of minus 200 milliHelens could sink 200 ships. All very straightforward and scientific.

This is the sort of thinking we need to bring to bear on the question of what is the best pen.

[Ahriman4891]

We need to build a mathematical model for the deflation of ships throughout history. How do 1186 Achaean ships sailing for Troy compare to a modern carrier strike group?

[calamus]

Good point!

[RocketRyan]

People could always say what pen they like the most and give a reason. Or talk about marmite which I happen to love.

[calamus]

They could, or they could try to develop a method based on metrics for determining the objectively best pen in the world. There would need to be different quantifiable categories, all weighted correctly. For example, beauty would be one of the factors that would need to be evaluated. In that case we could use the aforementioned Helen. Until a workable conversion factor is developed, we could stick with the Helen Classic, 1000 Achaean sailing vessels worth of pulchritude. Other factors might include ink capacity and ability to double as 007-style spy gear. And so forth.

We will need to form a committee.

[RocketRyan]

Or maybe just have an opinion, it's quite nice to hear people's reasonings, gives you an insight into their character. Be almost like making friends and enjoying a hobby together.

This is a light hearted reply, please read as such.

[Bold2013]

Tight tolerance eyedropper fitted with whatever nib suits your fancy

[KrazyIvan]

If I had to choose, it would be a pen with a smooth 1.1 mm nib mated with a somewhat free-flowing feed.

Using that criteria to match pens in my collection, the following work for me:

TWSBI 580
Scriptorium Pens Exemplar
Fisher of pens (I forgot the model)
Ken Cavers Bamboo
Lamy AL-Star (I have several)
Lamy Logo
Lamy CP1

[Empty_of_Clouds]

Some years ago in Topanga Canyon, which is in Southern California, a man named Alan Hjerpe succeeded in quantifying beauty, thereby making it possible to evaluate it objectively. He devised a unit of beauty, which he called the Helen. He was inspired by Helen of Troy, whose beauty was such that her face launched a thousand ships. A face with the beauty of one Helen, therefore, was sufficiently beautiful to launch a thousand ships. Consequently, a 500 milliHelen face could launch 500 ships, and a face of minus 200 milliHelens could sink 200 ships. All very straightforward and scientific.

This is the sort of thinking we need to bring to bear on the question of what is the best pen.

I prefer to use the Doris. She worked in the canteen. The face that shipped a thousand lunches.

[calamus]

Or maybe just have an opinion, it's quite nice to hear people's reasonings, gives you an insight into their character. Be almost like making friends and enjoying a hobby together.

This is a light hearted reply, please read as such.

Is my humor really that dry? I would have thought the reference to 007 spy gear capability, at any rate, would have been a dead giveaway to anyone who hadn't figured out yet that I was pulling their leg.

[Wuddus]

I'll offer up an answer to this question, along with full reasoning. First we need to look as what criteria are needed...

Cost: Must be affordable. A pen is no good is you can't afford it, or cant afford to replace it if lost.

Versatility: International cartridge/converter gives the best scope for being able to refill it it you've gone travelling, and have to work with whatever the unfamiliar shops there have to offer.

Durability: No soft delicate nibs, and no brittle materials in the pen construction.

Colour Neutral: It shouldn't clash with whatever you're wearing or carrying. Or to put this another way, it should not look out of place, irrespective of attire, occasion, or circumstance.

Muted appearance: it shouldn't look like it's worth stealing, or make you look affluent enough to be a worthwhile target for other theft.

Availability: Along with price, this is important not solely for first purchase, but to replace it in the event of loss.

Comfort: No obnoxious steps on the transition from section to barrel, or other uncomfortable corners or textures.

Reliable: Secure lid, grippy clip, drop proof, not too fussy about what paper you're writing on or ink you're using, and easily adjusted should the nib or feed need a little tweaking for repair or to suit your preferences.

To me that indicates a cheap and freely available stainless pen with clip, and so far, I haven't found anything that ticks all the boxes better than a Baoer 388. Yes, there are more expensive pens, prettier pens, higher capacity pens, more desirable and collectable pens, flouncy writers, blingy pocket jewellery, and hand finished works of art ... but I haven't seen anything that appears to be a better PEN.

[calamus]

I'll offer up an answer to this question, along with full reasoning. First we need to look as what criteria are needed...

Cost: Must be affordable. A pen is no good is you can't afford it, or cant afford to replace it if lost.

Versatility: International cartridge/converter gives the best scope for being able to refill it it you've gone travelling, and have to work with whatever the unfamiliar shops there have to offer.

Durability: No soft delicate nibs, and no brittle materials in the pen construction.

Colour Neutral: It shouldn't clash with whatever you're wearing or carrying. Or to put this another way, it should not look out of place, irrespective of attire, occasion, or circumstance.

Muted appearance: it shouldn't look like it's worth stealing, or make you look affluent enough to be a worthwhile target for other theft.

Availability: Along with price, this is important not solely for first purchase, but to replace it in the event of loss.

Comfort: No obnoxious steps on the transition from section to barrel, or other uncomfortable corners or textures.

Reliable: Secure lid, grippy clip, drop proof, not too fussy about what paper you're writing on or ink you're using, and easily adjusted should the nib or feed need a little tweaking for repair or to suit your preferences.

To me that indicates a cheap and freely available stainless pen with clip, and so far, I haven't found anything that ticks all the boxes better than a Baoer 388. Yes, there are more expensive pens, prettier pens, higher capacity pens, more desirable and collectable pens, flouncy writers, blingy pocket jewellery, and hand finished works of art ... but I haven't seen anything that appears to be a better PEN.

You've been lucky getting a good Baoer; the quality control on low end Chinese goods, including pens, is notoriously poor, and lots of defective products slip through the cracks. If you look around online you'll find that a lot of people have had significant problems with the Baoer 388, especially with the nibs, the feeds, the plating and with caps that are very difficult to remove. You'll need good luck to be able to replace the one you have with one as good. In reality, it'll be a crap shoot.

Plus, the pen, being a knockoff of the Parker Sonnet, looks expensive, so there goes your argument about not enticing thieves to steal your pen or your wallet. Using that same argument, by extension, the BEST clothes would have to look cheap, and the BEST car would also have to be a cheap one that no self-respecting thief would consider stealing. (Of course, you'd still be in danger from thieves lacking self-respect.)

The ideal pen is not one that takes international cartridges or converters, but a piston-filler or one that can be used as an eyedropper. Much better ink capacity, and certainly no constant stream of discarded empty cartridges ending up in landfills, and you can use any bottled fountain pen ink you desire.

I have a Pilot Prera that jetpens.com sells for $32.50 that is as close to perfect as any inexpensive pen I know of. A nib as smooth as butter, excellently crafted, and easily convertible to an eyedropper — all you need is a smear of silicone grease on the threads and you're in business.

For me, though, it still can't be the BEST pen, because part of the fountain pen experience for me is the aesthetic and emotional aspect of wielding a finely crafted, beautiful and even luxurious writing instrument. As nice as the Prera is, and it's extremely nice, there are more expensive pens that I like better. The Prera is my everyday workhorse, but the experience of a gold nib gliding across fine paper is a special delight. I rarely take my more expensive pens out of the house because I'm afraid to lose them, but that doesn't mar them in my eyes. I wouldn't consider a lump of coal better than a diamond just because I wouldn't worry about losing it or getting it stolen. I would consider a lump of coal better than a diamond if I needed to burn it, but if both the coal and the diamond were intended for the same use, say as a paperweight or desk ornament or investment, I'd go with the diamond, assuming I could reasonably afford it.

With pens, if my primary concerns were that they be cheap, reliable, comfortable in my hand, and write reasonably smoothly without skipping or hard starts, I'd be hard pressed to find anything better than Bic ballpoints.

[Wuddus]

You've been lucky getting a good Baoer; the quality control on low end Chinese goods, including pens, is notoriously poor, and lots of defective products slip through the cracks. If you look around online you'll find that a lot of people have had significant problems with the Baoer 388, especially with the nibs, the feeds, the plating and with caps that are very difficult to remove. You'll need good luck to be able to replace the one you have with one as good. In reality, it'll be a crap shoot.

As I have six of them and haven't experienced any problems yet, I'll be sure to buy a lottery ticket this weekend

Plus, the pen, being a knockoff of the Parker Sonnet, looks expensive, so there goes your argument about not enticing thieves to steal your pen or your wallet. Using that same argument, by extension, the BEST clothes would have to look cheap, and the BEST car would also have to be a cheap one that no self-respecting thief would consider stealing. (Of course, you'd still be in danger from thieves lacking self-respect.)

I wouldn't consider the 388 to look expensive at all, and I don't expect many thieves to know what a Parker Sonnet is, so I'll consider that point moot. As to clothing, I wear what is befitting the occasion, call it "urban camo" if you will, just blending in. Neither my pens nor my clothes have locks, alarm systems, or GPS trackers like the car, and they tend to be in a different price bracket too

The ideal pen is not one that takes international cartridges or converters, but a piston-filler or one that can be used as an eyedropper. Much better ink capacity, and certainly no constant stream of discarded empty cartridges ending up in landfills, and you can use any bottled fountain pen ink you desire.

I refill ink cartridges with whatever bottled fountain pen ink I desire rather than ditching them to landfill after a single use, and have no problems getting ink from the last 1/4" at the bottom of a bottle. I don't need the pen to have the capacity of a camel's bladder, as that might lead to boredom with the ink colour. I do have a few piston fillers that I like, but do like to swap ink colour after a while, and they're useless with nearly empty ink bottles, so they could never be a one pen solution for me.

I have a Pilot Prera that jetpens.com sells for $32.50 that is as close to perfect as any inexpensive pen I know of. A nib as smooth as butter, excellently crafted, and easily convertible to an eyedropper — all you need is a smear of silicone grease on the threads and you're in business.

I've not gone the eyedropper route for the above reasons, plus I understand heat and pressure changes can cause them to vomit ink on your shirt. I'll steer clear, thanks.

For me, though, it still can't be the BEST pen, because part of the fountain pen experience for me is the aesthetic and emotional aspect of wielding a finely crafted, beautiful and even luxurious writing instrument. As nice as the Prera is, and it's extremely nice, there are more expensive pens that I like better. The Prera is my everyday workhorse, but the experience of a gold nib gliding across fine paper is a special delight. I rarely take my more expensive pens out of the house because I'm afraid to lose them, but that doesn't mar them in my eyes. I wouldn't consider a lump of coal better than a diamond just because I wouldn't worry about losing it or getting it stolen. I would consider a lump of coal better than a diamond if I needed to burn it, but if both the coal and the diamond were intended for the same use, say as a paperweight or desk ornament or investment, I'd go with the diamond, assuming I could reasonably afford it.

I lack whatever neural mechanisms are required to get all "readers digest" about inanimate objects. This is why I'm unable to see the value in the kind of pens that most of this forum would gravitate towards. I have handled a few, and felt nothing. No loving connection, no heavenly lights or choirs of angels, no misty eyed lip quivering adoration. It puts ink where I want it, and doesn't put it where I don't want it, but my cheapos do that just as well in my eyes (even if I did need to do a few seconds of nib smoothing first)

With pens, if my primary concerns were that they be cheap, reliable, comfortable in my hand, and write reasonably smoothly without skipping or hard starts, I'd be hard pressed to find anything better than Bic ballpoints.

We do agree on this and I do still use them occasionally, but having "returned" to fountain pens, I do now prefer the pressure free writing of a fountain pen, plus the ability to swap inks quite freely.

I'll sit back with my feet up and let you lot all chase around hunting for perfection, I've already found mine

[calamus]

As I have six of them and haven't experienced any problems yet, I'll be sure to buy a lottery ticket this weekend

Plus, the pen, being a knockoff of the Parker Sonnet, looks expensive, so there goes your argument about not enticing thieves to steal your pen or your wallet. Using that same argument, by extension, the BEST clothes would have to look cheap, and the BEST car would also have to be a cheap one that no self-respecting thief would consider stealing. (Of course, you'd still be in danger from thieves lacking self-respect.)

I wouldn't consider the 388 to look expensive at all, and I don't expect many thieves to know what a Parker Sonnet is, so I'll consider that point moot. As to clothing, I wear what is befitting the occasion, call it "urban camo" if you will, just blending in. Neither my pens nor my clothes have locks, alarm systems, or GPS trackers like the car, and they tend to be in a different price bracket too

The ideal pen is not one that takes international cartridges or converters, but a piston-filler or one that can be used as an eyedropper. Much better ink capacity, and certainly no constant stream of discarded empty cartridges ending up in landfills, and you can use any bottled fountain pen ink you desire.

I refill ink cartridges with whatever bottled fountain pen ink I desire rather than ditching them to landfill after a single use, and have no problems getting ink from the last 1/4" at the bottom of a bottle. I don't need the pen to have the capacity of a camel's bladder, as that might lead to boredom with the ink colour. I do have a few piston fillers that I like, but do like to swap ink colour after a while, and they're useless with nearly empty ink bottles, so they could never be a one pen solution for me.

I have a Pilot Prera that jetpens.com sells for $32.50 that is as close to perfect as any inexpensive pen I know of. A nib as smooth as butter, excellently crafted, and easily convertible to an eyedropper — all you need is a smear of silicone grease on the threads and you're in business.

I've not gone the eyedropper route for the above reasons, plus I understand heat and pressure changes can cause them to vomit ink on your shirt. I'll steer clear, thanks.

For me, though, it still can't be the BEST pen, because part of the fountain pen experience for me is the aesthetic and emotional aspect of wielding a finely crafted, beautiful and even luxurious writing instrument. As nice as the Prera is, and it's extremely nice, there are more expensive pens that I like better. The Prera is my everyday workhorse, but the experience of a gold nib gliding across fine paper is a special delight. I rarely take my more expensive pens out of the house because I'm afraid to lose them, but that doesn't mar them in my eyes. I wouldn't consider a lump of coal better than a diamond just because I wouldn't worry about losing it or getting it stolen. I would consider a lump of coal better than a diamond if I needed to burn it, but if both the coal and the diamond were intended for the same use, say as a paperweight or desk ornament or investment, I'd go with the diamond, assuming I could reasonably afford it.

I lack whatever neural mechanisms are required to get all "readers digest" about inanimate objects. This is why I'm unable to see the value in the kind of pens that most of this forum would gravitate towards. I have handled a few, and felt nothing. No loving connection, no heavenly lights or choirs of angels, no misty eyed lip quivering adoration. It puts ink where I want it, and doesn't put it where I don't want it, but my cheapos do that just as well in my eyes (even if I did need to do a few seconds of nib smoothing first)

With pens, if my primary concerns were that they be cheap, reliable, comfortable in my hand, and write reasonably smoothly without skipping or hard starts, I'd be hard pressed to find anything better than Bic ballpoints.

We do agree on this and I do still use them occasionally, but having "returned" to fountain pens, I do now prefer the pressure free writing of a fountain pen, plus the ability to swap inks quite freely.

I'll sit back with my feet up and let you lot all chase around hunting for perfection, I've already found mine

Congratulations! The wisest sages say that the key to happiness is not getting what you want, but being content with what you have. Your attitude is very analogous to that. But really — six Baoers? (Sorry, couldn't resist!)

[Lloyd]

Unless I'm mistaken, the Prera has metal in it and, as such, shouldn't be used as an eyedropper filler.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[calamus]

Unless I'm mistaken, the Prera has metal in it and, as such, shouldn't be used as an eyedropper filler.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

In this particular case you're mistaken. It's acrylic resin, and the metal ring near the end of the barrel doesn't go all the way through. The nipple that the cartridge/converter goes onto is also acrylic. It's the Metropolitan that's metal.

[Wuddus]

But really — six Baoers? (Sorry, couldn't resist!)

What can I say? I'm a glutton for punishment

Bought one, loved it, wished I'd got that one first. Realised their availability might be time limited, and ordered five more. Washed, tested, approved, washed again, and stashed in the drawer as spares.

Not sure if it's wisdom or apathy though. Chasing "perfection" in other hobbies got expensive, tiresome, and rife with disappointment. a £200 putter doesn't make me better at golf, £200 running shoes don't make me any fitter, and my handwriting will still suck with a £200 pen. I'll not "enjoy" a £200 pen 100x more than a £2 one, I'll just be 100x more worried about losing it or damaging it, and 100x more frustrated if I do.

Cheap is incredibly liberating, and in my experience, being carefree is far more rewarding than pride of ownership, and is something that actually depletes as the value increases. So I can enjoy using the £2 pen more than the £200 pen, purely because I don't give a crap about it. That's probably an alien concept to many here, and it took me a few years of chasing perfection with other stuff to figure that out. It was only through buying stuff that was "too nice to use", and then using a "lesser" item instead, that I realised that using the cheaper item that I didn't care about was where the most fun was.