Water resistance, how important to you?

[VertOlive]

Yep. Having only lived a year in Texas, I've had to run for cover from some spontaneous weather event many times already.

That said, I avoid waterproof inks. This because I write my journal in bed and do not want my hand tailored linen sheets stained beyond what the laundry can repair. Besides, I'd hate to miss out on the color choices available in not waterproof inks!

When I want to protect my addressed envelopes, I wax them with a candle.

Things do occasionally spill on written pages, it doesn't trouble me.

[MaxG]

I address all envelopes with Kung Te-Cheng and have no worries. That stuff is amazing.

[Gobblecup]

Yep. Having only lived a year in Texas, I've had to run for cover from some spontaneous weather event many times already.

That said, I avoid waterproof inks. This because I write my journal in bed and do not want my hand tailored linen sheets stained beyond what the laundry can repair. Besides, I'd hate to miss out on the color choices available in not waterproof inks!

When I want to protect my addressed envelopes, I wax them with a candle.

Things do occasionally spill on written pages, it doesn't trouble me.

Yes the weather here is so unpredictable, especially spring through fall, but we can have rainy winters too! And staining nice bedsheets would be a pity, I can see why you avoid the permanent inks for that reason.

I address all envelopes with Kung Te-Cheng and have no worries. That stuff is amazing.

I loved the bottle of Kung Te Cheng I had when I had it, which was years ago. I need to replace that bottle at some point actually. Lately I’ve been addressing envelopes with Noodler’s Black Eel!

[Jon Szanto]

I've never specifically forged an interest in waterproof inks, but I have eventually settled on primarily two of them: Sailor Kiwa-Guro and Namiki Blue. The former is fairly well-known for the property but the Namiki flies under the radar. I love the blue for many, many uses, it is one of my top inks and in a number of pens. The Sailor is in only one pen, a very fine-pointed Pro Gear, and it lives only to write on postcards. I have these two inks to use for postal items with exposed writing - while I live in the relatively arrid climate of SoCal, many of my friends live where water falls from the sky. I've never had a problem mailing postcards or envelopes to any of them when I've used one of these inks. I've felt no compulsion to look for any others, as well.

[KKay]

Gobblecup you are not alone. I also treasure inks that are waterproof, or at least water resistant. I also like to have archival inks on hand as well. I have a couple of journals that I write in, that I want to last. I have a wide assortment of ink. I have found the past year or so, that I would like to add more of these inks to my collection. I like to switch inks in my journal, as I find that visually pleasing. It also lets me know that I came to the end of a particular subject. I only have a few inks that are completely permanent. Most of my inks are for fun, but some are meant to last. I want at least water resistance these days for most of my ink. If it isn't at least recoverable with a little water, I won't use it in my journals anymore.

This is just about how I approach inks these days, I want my journals to be recoverable, and to have archival quality ink on hand. Do you have any ink recommendations for me? I’d be interested in any colors, but I’d love to have an Orange because I don’t have anything on that spectrum that is water resistant. I’m thinking I may have to get De Atramentis Document Ink in Yellow and try mixing it with Red (which I already have) and perhaps dilution solution to get some shading out of it.

I don't know about an orange one, sorry. I have Noodler's-Lexington Gray, Bad Black Moccasin, and Bad Belted Kingfisher. If you go to the Noodler's site, they have a pdf file that tells you which inks will have what properties, or not. I found that USS Texas is archival, which made me happy. (I love that ink and I own it) I have tried Chisholm Trail, and I must get that one day, I love it. I have also tried Texas Live Oak and liked it too, I would love to own it. I also have Sailor-Kiwa guro and love it, it is waterproof. I am not sure if it is archival. I also have tried Sei boku, and really liked that, especially in one pen in particular. I have seen Henry Hudson Blue, and I like it, but I've never tried it.

Many of the GvFC inks I've read are waterproof, or highly water resistant. Aurora-Blue Black has some water resistance, as well as Pelikan-Dark Green. Noodler's-Zhivago, Green Marine and Burma Road Brown have water resistance. These are just off the top of my head. For the Noodler's Warden Series inks, I would only keep them in a pen for a week, flush, then refill. Sometimes I just refill without flushing, but it is best to flush it. (Same thing for Lexington Gray) Don't let those inks dry in your pen, or you will regret it. I also have tried General of the Armies, but it wasn't a buy for me. I liked it but didn't love it. Some of the ink I mentioned is from Dromgooles in Houston. You don't have to keep USS Texas in your pen for a short time, and it is not hard to clean out of your pen.

Oh, and I would only trust Kiwa guro and USS Texas in a more expensive pen. (of those waterproof, and archival etc...) Chisholm Trail and Texas Live Oak might be okay though, that is up to you. I want to try more pigmented inks. I have tried Platinum Classic IG Forest Green. I like it, but I would only put it in certain pens. I would like to try more pigmented and IG light inks. I have Zhivago but it is not archival, but says it is waterproof. I would say it has a lot of water resistance, maybe not totally waterproof.

I’m looking into the GvFC inks now, while pricey they aren’t as expensive as my precious Sailor inks. I am trying to figure out which are considered waterproof now, it seems like some are and some aren’t. I did however order some more Noodler’s today, I’ve been wanting more green and brown, so I got #41 Brown and Green Marine. I’ll have to look into the Pelikan dark green. I remember having some of the Texas Noodler’s inks from Dromgoole’s yeaaaars ago, I’m pretty sure I used all of what I had, but I don’t make the trip to Houston too often.


I have tried the Rohrer und Klingner Scabiosa and Salix, but I don’t use them very often, I do have a bottle of each in my rotation, however. I prefer the Scabiosa. And I use Sailor’s Jentle inks a lot, but only find them water resistant not so much proof as they usually leave behind a blue but lose the rest of the coloring when washed. I have Tokiwa-Matsu, Rikyu-Cha, and Miruai (which from what I remember of my old bottle of Zhivago I had years ago is on the same super black-green spectrum).

I’m personally a bit afraid of the warden series! But maybe I’ll try them out at some point. And I haven’t tried Aruroa inks yet but might snag a bottle when I buy my next Optima (probably through Goldspot).

Thanks for suggesting the Aurora and GvFC, and the Texas Noodler’s I had forgotten about!

Yes, GvFC inks are pricey, but you do get a big bottle, and a very nice bottle at that! I have not tried #41 Brown, maybe one day I will. I also have Tokiwa-Matsu, Rikyu-Cha, and Miruai, they are water resistant? That would be great if so, I didn't know that. I love all 3 of those inks.

[Gobblecup]

Yes, GvFC inks are pricey, but you do get a big bottle, and a very nice bottle at that! I have not tried #41 Brown, maybe one day I will. I also have Tokiwa-Matsu, Rikyu-Cha, and Miruai, they are water resistant? That would be great if so, I didn't know that. I love all 3 of those inks.

I just received my bottle of #41 Brown today, but I have too many inked pens and haven’t had a chance to play with it yet. However from the reviews I’ve seen it’s very water resistant. As for the sailor inks, Tokiwa-Matsu and Rikyu-Cha leave behind a legible blue line but the green will wash away/smear. And Miruai will leave behind a very dark, blue black looking line, again the green will wash away. If I could figure out how to attach an image here I’ll post my water tests. I dunked half the page in water for at least 60 seconds.

[Jon Szanto]

You guys ever going to figure out how to trim replies?

[Gobblecup]

You guys ever going to figure out how to trim replies?

You mean cut out all the replies and just include the most recent post being replied to? I think I could figure that out.

Edit: there I think I got it. That was quite a bit of redundancy to scroll through!

Edit 2: also, sorry I missed your post Jon, I too love Pilot Blue, I’m working on trading a bottle of Noodler’s I don’t want anymore with another local FP user for a bottle of it, as I haven’t had any in a few years. As for the Sailor Kiwa-Guro pigmented black, I haven’t tried it, but I don’t use much black ink so I’m reluctant to buy more blacks (I’m already thinking of getting a bottle of De Atramentis Document Black in addition to two Noodler’s black inks (Bernanke and Eel) to use for mixing with other De Atramentis Document colors). I’m growing more and more fond of the De Atramentis Document line for the full spectrum of waterproof colors you can mix out of them!

Add a part of a pigmented or other waterproof ink - obviously the colour of the original ink may be changed, but the waterproof ink will be left behind if washed. Also, if for example a red pigment is added to a black ink, you will then have tamper evidence as well as indelibility, as anywhere the black has been washed will be red!

Sorry I didn’t get to reply to this sooner! Thank you for the reply, and I see what you’re talking about now. However, I’ve always avoided mixing say bulletproof black, or a De Atramentis Document Ink with inks from other brands, or in Noodler’s case even with other Noodler’s. Is this caution too much you think? Which inks have you found play friendly together?

[Jon Szanto]

You mean cut out all the replies and just include the most recent post being replied to? I think I could figure that out.

Edit: there I think I got it. That was quite a bit of redundancy to scroll through!

Certainly not a major thing, but when the threads get long and people get into 'deeply nested quotes', you can sprain a finger scrolling the page!

I’m already thinking of getting a bottle of De Atramentis Document Black...

I have a friend who's an artist (he's got stuff on FPG somewhere) who *swears* by DA Doc Black. He does all his illustrations with that first and then filles and washes with watercolors over the top. The ink Does. Not. Budge. I'm going to look into a bottle at some point but, yeah, I need more blacks like a hole in the head.

[Gobblecup]

Certainly not a major thing, but when the threads get long and people get into 'deeply nested quotes', you can sprain a finger scrolling the page!

I’m already thinking of getting a bottle of De Atramentis Document Black...

I have a friend who's an artist (he's got stuff on FPG somewhere) who *swears* by DA Doc Black. He does all his illustrations with that first and then filles and washes with watercolors over the top. The ink Does. Not. Budge. I'm going to look into a bottle at some point but, yeah, I need more blacks like a hole in the head.

I’m particularly interested in making my Red De Atramentis a little deeper with the black, but I’m sure it will come in handy for lots of things, especially if I delve back into painting with watercolors (it’s been over a decade since I have). I have noticed the De Atramentis Document inks, as you say, do not budge!! I love it, rich and vivid colors that hold up to any liquid thrown at it (even scotch!). That’s up my alley. I’ve got violet, red and yellow, and yes soon black and probably a few more in the coming months, along with the dilution solution to make them shade and more affordable per ml. That’s the only downside with them, the price!

[SIR]

Add a part of a pigmented or other waterproof ink - obviously the colour of the original ink may be changed, but the waterproof ink will be left behind if washed. Also, if for example a red pigment is added to a black ink, you will then have tamper evidence as well as indelibility, as anywhere the black has been washed will be red!

Sorry I didn’t get to reply to this sooner! Thank you for the reply, and I see what you’re talking about now. However, I’ve always avoided mixing say bulletproof black, or a De Atramentis Document Ink with inks from other brands, or in Noodler’s case even with other Noodler’s. Is this caution too much you think? Which inks have you found play friendly together?

Mixing inks is easy, the most important points to observe are mixing in a clean and sealable container, use very small amounts of ink (fractions of a ml), and make sure you leave the mix for at least 24 hours, just so as any chemical reactions which may occur have a chance to present themselves.

I'd never use any Noodlers ink, mixed or otherwise... Platinum Pigment inks seem to be safe with anything, as do Sailor inks, both of those I have used a lot of in mixes.

[Pterodactylus]

To my knowledge Rohrer & Klingner is the only major ink manufacturer which makes a real statement about mixing their inks.

R&K claims explicitely that all of their inks are mixable with each other.
The only exception is Sepia, which also can be mixed but they do not guarantee for the long term stability of these Sepia mixes.

[ethernautrix]

I prefer water-resistant/water-proof inks. Since I also prefer black, it's a no-brainer to use Noodler's Black. Not necessarily exclusively, but, yeah, almost always.

I do enjoy using other colors, but the vast majority of my ink use is black.

[wingwiper]

Water resistance is extremely important, which my go to standard inks are Noodlers and Iron Gall in my P45's, etc.

[MattiasW]

As I use them for drawing (without watercolouring), I dont care at all if the inks are water resistant, as I don't plan to drop water (or bleach, haha) on my drawings.

BUT... for me fade resistant is much more important. This is also harder to find information on. Most reviewers does not mention fading, probably because it is hard to test without time or because they don't think of it.

(I did write more here but realized I should start another thread on the subject fade resistance... )

[RudyR]

Iron gall and water resistance all the way baby. I live in the US PACNORTH and monsoons with winds are a daily event in the winter. less water resistant inks are relegated to quick notes that are easily disposed of.

[penwash]

To my knowledge Rohrer & Klingner is the only major ink manufacturer which makes a real statement about mixing their inks.

R&K claims explicitely that all of their inks are mixable with each other.
The only exception is Sepia, which also can be mixed but they do not guarantee for the long term stability of these Sepia mixes.

So does Callifolio.

[Wuddus]

I've just received half a dozen drawing inks today for using with a dip pen (that I'll be waiting a while for) and I'm going to give those a try for writing anything that I want water resistance for. I've never used this stuff before, so it'll be interesting to play around with. Obviously not much good for away from the desk, but out and about I still carry a ballpoint as well as a pocket fountain pen.

[chalkdust]

I am irrationally concerned with ink permanence. I have no explanation for my paranoia. I am consciously uncomfortable writing with any ink that I know is not waterproof.

[Kulprit]

Like most people, I assume, I make the majority of my ink choices based on an ink's more aesthetic qualities. That said, I always have at least one pen inked-up with something waterproof (or at least heavily water-resistant). In addition, I have a Metropolitan perpetually inked with Noodler's Heart of Darkness that is used solely for addressing packages or envelopes. I get enough rain-soaked mail with smeared or runny text, I can only imagine what happens to my fountain-pen-scribed addresses when exposed to the elements!


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