service?

[sharmon202]

Something tells me this isn't the full story.

Then feel free to pose a question.

I know you well enough that you got this accurate. That person has no EQ, was insulting to you all. I hope she at least got talked to about the effect of her ignorance.

[SIR]

Anyone here a manager in a non-restaurant and try to get people to actually put in 8 hours a day? They think the cell phone is, more important than working.

Actually, in my current place the majority of my colleagues are well disciplined, but that may be due to them having ample downtime to indulge their one-dimensional cravings. Digital shutoff is definitely a big problem, but not just professionally - socially and privately too.

[Pterodactylus]

Something tells me this isn't the full story.

Then feel free to pose a question.

I know you well enough that you got this accurate. That person has no EQ, was insulting to you all. I hope she at least got talked to about the effect of her ignorance.

Interesting, judgement about the EQ of somebody just because you read some lines in a forum.
Sounds like a well reasoned statement.....

For me in the first hand it only sounds like a person which obviously talks too much in the wrong situations.
A person which might have some bias against another group of people.
Maybe not even a whole group, but against specific individuals of that group.
And maybe this judgement was made based on the personal experiences this person made within the previous prison regime job.

And additionally you know communication theory: a sent Message might be completely different received by somebody else.

All possible...... who knows....

[SIR]

And then, there is the accepted norm that one is generally allowed to criticise/mock one's own group...

[Pterodactylus]

No matter what service I get I still tip well...

Why would you do that? It gives that person feedback that everything was great when it was not.
I think the tipping practice is a good one. If not, employees would do whatever kind of quality job they wanted with no incentive to do better. TIPS - To Insure Proper Service.

Anyone here a manager in a non restaurant and try to get people to actually put in 8 hours a day? They think the cell phone is ,more important than working. Don't want that in the restaurant business.

Tips are ok, not that somebody get the wrong impression.
Tips are also common in Europe, 5-10% are common when you liked the service.

What is not ok is that people are not fair paid for their work by the employer.
Everybody should be able to live properly when doing a good job and not being dependent on handouts, which might come or not come.
So I completely disagree, the tipping practice in the US does not ensure proper service, it is a really unfair practice to allow employer to pay so low that the employees are depending on handouts.

Proper work should be proper paid, and people should not depend on the good will of the guests.

The employer pays the employees to work for him.
He offers a service to the guests, they have a contract with him and not the employees.
They are auxiliary persons of the employer.
So the employees sell their work time to the employer, they have to be paid from him and not the customers of the employer.

And to claim that paying nuts is the proper way of employers to ensure quality work of the employees is imho really stupid.
This is just exploitation on the backs of the employees.

[adhoc]

Obviously I'm missing something here...I'm supposed to root for the person that wants to see the destruction of financial stability of an already financially endangered person because her feelings got hurt?

[Jon Szanto]

Obviously I'm missing something here...

"Financially endangered racist." That's the part you're missing.

Oh, and the part about "destruction of financial stability" is a little over-the-top, considering the server in question could have easily avoided voicing their unasked-for opinion.

[adhoc]

You only know one side of the story. This is a fact you seem to be very quick to forget.

It’s not over the top, it’s exactly what it is, and your second sentence is in no way connected to the first.

Actually your signature makes your argument absurdly comical.

[Jon Szanto]

You only know one side of the story. This is a fact you seem to be very quick to forget.

It’s not over the top, it’s exactly what it is, and your second sentence is in no way connected to the first.

Actually your signature makes your argument absurdly comical.

Of course I only have heard from one side. Here's the deal: I know and trust the person who posted this. I do trust that the recounting of the story is accurate. I base my statements on that instead of questioning any of it with no actual reason to. When a friend I trust tells me something, I believe them.

[adhoc]

All I’ve seen from said person thus far has been emotionally fuelled hysteria with very little reason or rationality, so pardon me if I doubt that very much.

Regardless, destroying ones’ livelihood over his or her opinion is anyway morally bankrupt.

[Jon Szanto]

All I’ve seen from said person thus far has been emotionally fuelled hysteria with very little reason or rationality, so pardon me if I doubt that very much.

Regardless, destroying ones’ livelihood over his or her opinion is anyway morally bankrupt.

I don't care if you doubt it. If the complaint of one customer, who has been treated poorly by an ill-mannered server, is enough to "destroy one's livelihood" (talk about emotionally fueled hysteria...) then I have every reason to believe that server has other issues in the workplace.

[adhoc]

Livelihood, by the definition of Oxford dictionary, was used properly in this context (“means of support”). I didn’t say permanently, but definitely temporarily. She was baffled why she wasn’t fired after her complaint. So yes, I was completely factual.

In case you have trouble understanding English, I speak 6 languages and we can try another one.

[Jon Szanto]

"Destroying one's livelihood" is quite different from "losing a job". I also don't associate "destruction" with "temporary". Play fast and loose with any language you like.

[adhoc]

I would argue you are factually incorrect, but whatever. She could have gotten back at her the same way she felt offended; with an insult. Not requesting the "removal" of her "means of support", to avoid using words that are too complex.

[Jon Szanto]

I would argue...

So we've noticed.

[Wuddus]

Low paid staff are sackable too. Racist or xenophobic rants to a customer about their country of birth would certainly warrant that if they were in my employ, even if they weren't an 11 year old kid. I don't care how many mouths they've got go feed at home, or how many vet bills they've got or how big their loans are. I'm not paying them to vent their social grievances at my customers. Out! Now!

As to tipping, if the food is fine, but the service is poor, no tip.
If the food is not fine, fix it, or I ain't paying.
If the food is good, and the service is good, expect up to 15% extra

[AzJon]

No matter what service I get I still tip well...

Why would you do that? It gives that person feedback that everything was great when it was not.
I think the tipping practice is a good one. If not, employees would do whatever kind of quality job they wanted with no incentive to do better. TIPS - To Insure Proper Service.

Anyone here a manager in a non restaurant and try to get people to actually put in 8 hours a day? They think the cell phone is ,more important than working. Don't want that in the restaurant business.

A couple things, first off TIPS as an acronym is not only false, but nonsense. If you wanted to insure prompt service, wouldn't you tip first? Also, if every table is tipping, doesn't that make blanket service the status quo? Can you spy on your neighbor and out-tip them in a bid war for attention?

Beyond that, studies show (too lazy to find them, but I will if desired) that tipping has no impact on service in any meaningful way. It *does* allow someone with an ego trip to feel like they are getting revenge on bad service as some form of punishment. The "incentive to do better" is to not get fired and lose their job. I've worked in many restaurants in the States and abroad (Germany) and the bar I worked at in Germany gave excellent service, despite tipping not being a thing. You sucked at your job: you were fired.

When I go out, I am nice to waitstaff, I voice my wants clearly (including if I would prefer to largely be left alone), and tip well at the end of service regardless. If the service sucked, I just don't go back or maybe give them a second chance on a different night. Otherwise, if service was genuinely good, I will tip above 20%. If I'm a regular somewhere I will tip from 20%-30%. Occasional generosity will make them remember who you are next time you come in. Caveat: you had better be a nice person, because tipping well means they remember you, not that they like you.

Being nice and becoming a regular face (even if just once a month) will get you more favors than tipping well, regardless the expected dining experience.

[VertOlive]

adhoc, Pterodactylus, my friends, you know me so well; it's almost as if you were right there by my side.

Thank you for telling my side of the story. I love you guys!!!

[Pterodactylus]

adhoc, Pterodactylus, my friends, you know me so well; it's almost as if you were right there by my side.

Thank you for telling my side of the story. I love you guys!!!

Just for the records, and my final words on this topic.
I am sorry for the bad experience you made and as said in my first reply, you had reason to complain.
Such topics should never be touched by staff, this is highly inappropriate, in general and especially if children are there.



But this does not mean that the following discussion was useless ....

[adhoc]

Low paid staff are sackable too. Racist or xenophobic rants to a customer about their country of birth would certainly warrant that if they were in my employ, even if they weren't an 11 year old kid. I don't care how many mouths they've got go feed at home, or how many vet bills they've got or how big their loans are. I'm not paying them to vent their social grievances at my customers. Out! Now!

As to tipping, if the food is fine, but the service is poor, no tip.
If the food is not fine, fix it, or I ain't paying.
If the food is good, and the service is good, expect up to 15% extra

People are people, dealing with people is difficult. Life is shit. We all have to deal with this. We all have bad days. There is no need to sack someone for one slip. Give a warning, and sack if you have to continue giving warnings.