Of course the size of the line variation matters. The larger variation can be achieved while still writing in a pleasant way (not putting undue stress both to the nib and to the hand), the higher the quality of the nib in terms of flex writing.
Maybe not to you, but to most people it does. Are you not okay with others having different preferences than yours?
And I have no idea what you're talking about bringing 'cock' into the discussion. This is about flex writing using flex nibs. What does it have to do with chickens?
lsmith42 (June 9th, 2018)
Yeah, yeah, size matters, and you do not understand what I’m talking about
I´ve no problem with different preferences.
And what are exactly the differences?
Iˋm a flex addict, enjoying flex nibs, vintage and modern.
I don´t care about how old a nib is, what count is the performance it offers (and most of my pens are vintage ones)
But please answer my question, what is missing/lack in my sample compared to yours?
Because I don’t know it
... or is it just because it was done with a modern nib.....
and your world picture would get a scratch admitting that full flex is also possible with modern nibs?
....or because you are selling vintage flex nibs and this would endanger your selling positions?...
you are selling vintage pens right?
This really reminds me on a discussion I had with Mauricio (who also live from selling vintage flex pens) years ago on the evil other side.
And he also argued the same way as you do against modern flex, and lacked arguments after writing samples were provided....... strange things happens aren’t they? .....
Last edited by Pterodactylus; June 9th, 2018 at 01:06 AM.
Ah yes, I remember that guy. Any conversation about flexibility was trolled by him acting all high and mighty but really coming across as a monumental dick, or it was trolled by the author of "How fine can I split this hair: My guide to flexible fountain pens".
But I digress.
Grabbed a couple of pens and very quickly and roughly wrote what you see in the pictures. Sorry for lack of clarity in focus - cell phone camera, desk lamp, no skills, you know how it is.
Anyway, one, either or both of these is written by a modern flexible nib - OR - one, either or both, is written using a vintage flexible nib.
Apart from lucky guesses the challenge here is to determine what has been used where, and to back that determination with solid reasoning.
Ptero, I largely agree with you regarding the need (or not) of a measure of flexibility. As I've said on numerous occasions, those of us in places where you cannot ever try first have to have some way of making a distant judgement on a purchase. The measure would help, but it doesn't have to be perfect!
Pterodactylus (June 9th, 2018)
When I was back there in seminary school, there was a person there who put forth the proposition that you can measure flex with a scale - measure flex with a scale - measure flex with a scale...
YOU CANNOT MEASURE FLEX WITH A SCALE!!!
Depends what you mean by scale. I was thinking of something similar to a Likert scale.
This is one of those discussions that makes me feel very glad that I'm so clueless
I haven't developed a "need" for flex yet, which makes my pen purchasing a whole lot simpler. That said, I can understand the need to understand how responsive a nib might be before you've handed over some serious coinage for it.
Maybe it would help if everyone agrees what properties do/don't matter, before trying to figure out how to rank it. From what I'm reading, it seems there's more to it than achievable line width and pressure required... but I don't know enough to guess what the other properties are.
Really there are only three factors to consider:
1. How easily the nib flexes - less pressure vs more pressure = less control vs more control (in general).
2. How much line variation is achievable without springing the nib.
3. How quickly does the flexed nib return to its default state.
For example, a given nib may flex easily and recover quickly and yet only have a small amount of line variation. Some Waterman "pink" nibs are like this, and they are often the grail flex nib for some people.
Any combination of these factors may be desirable. One of my dip nibs for instance requires hardly any pressure to achieve a line variation 30x wider (yes, that's thirty) if not more than its starting width, and snaps back instantly any pressure is released. Hard to find that in a fountain pen quite frankly.
My favourite flexible fountain pen nib would allow me to write hairlines and small swells, and have sufficient rigidity so that it is easier to control. There's lots of them around if you are in a place that has a thriving pen market.
azkid (June 9th, 2018), fountainpenkid (June 11th, 2018), Pterodactylus (June 9th, 2018)
AzJon (June 9th, 2018), Jon Szanto (June 9th, 2018), penwash (June 11th, 2018), SIR (June 11th, 2018)
I think if you are technically minded, the scale would help relate to flexibility and makes sense, at least on paper. It is just how one's brain is wired to perceive the data. More grams/mm = less flexibility than fewer grams/mm. It is easy enough to understand. Then you would have to settle on what is you flexibility standard. Anything more or less than your standard would help relate that pens flexibility. I like it but some people will not relate to the data.
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