Holy Grail of Fountain Pens

[calamus]

Be interesting to see in six months if that grail pen is still the one for your doctor.

I saw him today, only a couple weeks later, never mind six months, and asked him how his Visconti was doing. He broke into a big smile and told me he just got a new pen, and showed me his Pelikan M805!

[amk]

Reading some of these responses I began thinking along these lines;

the 'grail pen' is a Quest narrative. One pen to rule them all. It has either a happy or a tragic ending - you find the pen! at a flea market! for vastly less than it's worth! - or you never find it, or even worse, you find it and the Postal service manages to lose it.... It's very western, very Hollywood, very linear.

Then there's the happy Zen approach to pendom which is to float gently and when you see a pen, try it out, and when an interesting pen appears within your grasp, why not buy it? Makes a rubbish film, but it can also yield some marvellous moments.

I think there's room in the community for pen collectors and users of both types... but perhaps doing a little Zen can be a good corrective for those of us who sometimes feel we're getting a tad obsessive about a particular pen!

[Wuddus]

Reading some of these responses I began thinking along these lines;

the 'grail pen' is a Quest narrative. One pen to rule them all. It has either a happy or a tragic ending - you find the pen! at a flea market! for vastly less than it's worth! - or you never find it, or even worse, you find it and the Postal service manages to lose it.... It's very western, very Hollywood, very linear.

There is a worse outcome. You finally track down the item you were looking for after years of searching - and don't like it. Sadly, I have had this in other hobbies.

To (mis)quote House MD "Sometimes a unicorn is just a donkey with a sink plunger on its face"

[Jon Szanto]

There is a worse outcome. You finally track down the item you were looking for after years of searching - and don't like it. Sadly, I have had this in other hobbies.

That is merely a wrong approach in the first place: a pen I hunt has no guarantee that it will be some particular thing, any more than meeting a person I've wanted to meet for a long time guarantees a premium relationship. Things will be what they will be.

Disappointment is tied to expectation, and expectations can be calibrated. Nothing about the finding of a desired pen tarnishing the enjoyment of the search and eventual attainment for me.

[calamus]

INT - JOE'S HOME - DAY

Kathy slams the door in Joe's face, then flings it open a moment later
and comes storming back into the room.

KATHY
And one more thing, you son of a bitch. You
remember that marbled red and black Mabie
Todd Swan you were looking for for so long?
And finally found in that antique store, but
then the guy said it was sold and he was just
holding it for the customer?

JOE
Yeah? What about it?

KATHY
Well, I was that customer. I got it for you, you
bastard. It was going to be your birthday
present.

Kathy whips out the pen, shows it to Joe, then breaks it in half.

JOE
Nooooooooo!

Kathy throws the pieces down and stomps on them, and then grinds the
bits into the floor, leaving an inky mess.

[Jon Szanto]

INT - JOE'S HOME - DAY

[SIR]

Be interesting to see in six months if that grail pen is still the one for your doctor.

I saw him today, only a couple weeks later, never mind six months, and asked him how his Visconti was doing. He broke into a big smile and told me he just got a new pen, and showed me his Pelikan M805!

Next time, ask him how he's doing with his 'addiction' ;P

People so often (especially young people) make the grail concept all about the money. I see kids on reddit calling a $60.00 TWSBI pen a grail pen simply because they don't happen to have the money in their pocket at the moment. I get that we are all in different financial situations, at differing times of life and all that.

Ex-fucking-zactly ... we could all go buy something beyond our means and quietly wait for the storm to pass and, whether you can justify the expense or not, is not relevant - after the fact!

Grail, unfortunately, is implicit of a certain psychological ploy - we know where it comes from and what sect was responsible, but yet we enjoy the innuendo and deceive ourselves into accepting it.

Concerning the Holy Grail in Le Morte D'Arthur, only one of the three knights who achieved the quest returned to tell the tale.

And the Pope and his puppet-masters laughed all the way to the bank and the whorehouse with all the nobles' charitable donations.

[calamus]

And the Pope and his puppet-masters laughed all the way to the bank and the whorehouse with all the nobles' charitable donations.

Act of Reparation to the Sacred Heart of Jesus

Most sweet Jesus, whose overflowing charity for men is requited by so much forgetfulness, negligence and contempt, behold us prostrate before you, eager to repair by a special act of homage the cruel indifference and injuries to which your loving Heart is everywhere subject.

Mindful, alas! that we ourselves have had a share in such great indignities, which we now deplore from the depths of our hearts, we humbly ask your pardon and declare our readiness to atone by voluntary expiation, not only for our own personal offenses, but also for the sins of those, who, straying far from the path of salvation, refuse in their obstinate infidelity to follow you, their Shepherd and Leader, or, renouncing the promises of their baptism, have cast off the sweet yoke of your law.

We are now resolved to expiate each and every deplorable outrage committed against you; we are now determined to make amends for the manifold offenses against Christian modesty in unbecoming dress and behavior, for all the foul seductions laid to ensnare the feet of the innocent, for the frequent violations of Sundays and holy-days, and the shocking blasphemies uttered against you and your Saints. We wish also to make amends for the insults to which your Vicar on earth and your priests are subjected, for the profanation, by conscious neglect or terrible acts of sacrilege, of the very Sacrament of your divine love, and lastly for the public crimes of nations who resist the rights and teaching authority of the Church which you have founded.

Would that we were able to wash away such abominations with our blood. We now offer, in reparation for these violations of your divine honor, the satisfaction you once made to your Eternal Father on the cross and which you continue to renew daily on our altars; we offer it in union with the acts of atonement of your Virgin Mother and all the Saints and of the pious faithful on earth; and we sincerely promise to make recompense, as far as we can with the help of your grace, for all neglect of your great love and for the sins we and others have committed in the past. Henceforth, we will live a life of unswerving faith, of purity of conduct, of perfect observance of the precepts of the Gospel and especially that of charity. We promise to the best of our power to prevent others from offending you and to bring as many as possible to follow you.

O loving Jesus, through the intercession of the Blessed Virgin Mother, our model in reparation, deign to receive the voluntary offering we make of this act of expiation; and by the crowning gift of perseverance keep us faithful unto death in our duty and the allegiance we owe to you, so that we may all one day come to that happy home, where with the Father and the Holy Spirit you live and reign, God, forever and ever. Amen.

[Jon Szanto]

Gentlemen and ladies:

In absence of a true and present administrator of this forum, I'd like to offer a public reminder that it is best we not go down the road of religion / not-religion, at least not here. Quite a few years ago we manage to get a subforum installed titled Politics, Religion and Society. You can find it in the main listing of forums. The benefit is that threads there are not any more moderated than anywhere else, but they do not show up in the "What's New" or the "Activity Stream" (or some such combination). They do, as intended, pretty much fly under the radar.

You are all savvy enough to know that these are tricky waters, so if you want to continue this discussion going in the direction of the past couple posts, could we ask you to kindly take it to that forum. Beyond straying from the honest nature of the OP, the territory is perfect for placement in that other forum. It will avoid contentious issues and show maturity on everyone's part to further the conversation in both parts/forums and directions.

Thanks. Just a request from one of the members-at-large, not an order.

[Empty_of_Clouds]

If a religious sidetrack is germane to the thread then it perhaps should remain in the thread, although I wouldn't presume to suggest that any specific course of action shows greater maturity than another.

[Jon Szanto]

If a religious sidetrack is germane to the thread then it perhaps should remain in the thread, although I wouldn't presume to suggest that any specific course of action shows greater maturity than another.

I would and I did. Lots of past experience and the reason for that subforum.

[Empty_of_Clouds]

That doesn't invalidate my statement. Applying a broad brush is not always the best option, particularly so in a forum that kind of prides itself on non-moderation, self-restraint (with the expected occasional emotive parts), and freedom of expression.

Yes, explosions do happen. However, this forum has been around long enough, the denizens (mostly) experienced enough, to have developed its own homeostatic mechanism.

[Jon Szanto]

David, you just don't get it. Fair enough.

Your forum now. If anyone has any issues, be sure to contact David. Me? I'm tired of it all.

[calamus]

Gentlemen and ladies:

In absence of a true and present administrator of this forum, I'd like to offer a public reminder that it is best we not go down the road of religion / not-religion, at least not here. Quite a few years ago we manage to get a subforum installed titled Politics, Religion and Society. You can find it in the main listing of forums. The benefit is that threads there are not any more moderated than anywhere else, but they do not show up in the "What's New" or the "Activity Stream" (or some such combination). They do, as intended, pretty much fly under the radar.

You are all savvy enough to know that these are tricky waters, so if you want to continue this discussion going in the direction of the past couple posts, could we ask you to kindly take it to that forum. Beyond straying from the honest nature of the OP, the territory is perfect for placement in that other forum. It will avoid contentious issues and show maturity on everyone's part to further the conversation in both parts/forums and directions.

Thanks. Just a request from one of the members-at-large, not an order.

I really didn't know how to respond to SIR's hateful post. Posting an act of reparation for that individual's actions seemed a measured response. I felt I couldn't just ignore SIR's anti-Catholic bigotry. I have no intention of shoving my faith in other people's faces, but I will defend it. And I have no interest in discussing the matter further, in any forum.

[Empty_of_Clouds]

@JonSzanto. Actually I do get it perfectly well. Your arrogance in presuming otherwise is unwarranted and noted. The forum will survive the occasional flare-ups without the need for nannying.

[SIR]

And the Pope and his puppet-masters laughed all the way to the bank and the whorehouse with all the nobles' charitable donations.

the insults to which your Vicar on earth and your priests are subjected

I really didn't know how to respond to SIR's hateful post. Posting an act of reparation for that individual's actions seemed a measured response. I felt I couldn't just ignore SIR's anti-Catholic bigotry.

Really?

I'd like to know your definition of 'bigot'...
Perhaps, you mean like intolerance towards different beliefs? Like the Catholic church has a very well documented history of - both against its own 'congregation' and others; i'm sure you'll be very grateful of my reminding you that the majority of Nazis in Hitler's government were Catholics, not to mention the close relationship the Nazi regime had with the church in Rome both during and after the war.

I'm happy not to discuss this further, but if you are so closed minded to need another to tell you what to think and 'beleive', then that is your choice. I happen to have a piece of paper 'confirming' me as a Catholic, however, the way I choose to think and act is most certainly 'protestant'.

We all have a right to freedom of thought and action, and we all have (if we know what is good for us) the responsibility to think and act with good intentions and with respect to the 'universe' (that's what 'Catholic' means, right?), and we should also be very mindful of not being fooled by others' thoughts and actions - particularly those who make such a great and obvious show of being 'good'.

I had no intention of insulting your faith, you'll find me quite an empathatic and understanding person, but i will not be shied away from expressing my own perception of the objective reality.

[Chrissy]

If a religious sidetrack is germane to the thread then it perhaps should remain in the thread, although I wouldn't presume to suggest that any specific course of action shows greater maturity than another.

It's not germane though, and I don't think the OP ever intended it to be.

[Empty_of_Clouds]

I was making a more general statement.

[Kaputnik]

It's interesting, if rather discouraging, that an innocent reference to Le Morte D'Arthur would lead to such an off the wall digression. What happens if I mention Parzival? Maybe the dynamics of forums dictate that when we run out of things to say on the original topic, we go after each other.

It's also somewhat interesting that grail pens are being seen as ones that already exist, even if very few were ever made, and the chances of finding one are slim. One might also imagine them as pens that could, theoretically, be made to one's own specifications, resulting in the perfect pen for a particular person.

For example, I could imaging getting hold of a Waterman's 52 and some unused vintage celluloid similar to that used in Esterbrook Dollar Pens, preferably a dark red swirl. Find someone with the skills to build a piston filler using that nib with that material for the body.

Well, that's just me, and I might be underwhelmed when presented with the actual result. But the point is, do you chase something that exists because someone has made a thing that appeals to you, or do you imagine what might be, and seek to create it? (Or have it created).

And since that in turn has a potentially wider application, for the purpose of this thread, I'm just talking about pens.

[Deb]

From years of moderating a dialysis forum and working in others , I agree wholeheartedly with Jon Szanto. I have seen a previously very useful forum be destroyed for its original purpose because of the inapprporiate introduction of religion. Keep it to where it's meant to be.

Lets just not do this here.