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Thread: Waterman Extra Fine Pens

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    Default Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    Hi everybody. I am looking for advice regarding a couple of Waterman fountain pens with
    extra-fine nibs. I have two fine-point fountain pens (a Cross and a Sheaffer) that write
    beautifully with any ink. I also have a couple of extra-fine Watermans (a Carene and a Preface II)
    that only write well with certain water-based, shellac-free inks. Other inks e.g. Pelikan Black, just don't
    flow easily from those extra-fine nibs. I'd like to know if this a bug or a feature of extra-fine Watermans?

    The Waterman repair people have understandably asked me to send them the pens for examination, but
    I'd rather not bother them if this is just a case of Waterman extra-fines performing as they're supposed to.

    I should add that I clean the pens regularly, and that they have never been damaged,

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    Default Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    Just my experience in general: certain nibs pair extraordinarily well with particular inks and are poor writers with others; regardless of the nib width. Now, F and EF varieties let you know sooner than wider options as their sweet spot is narrow. If the ink is not flowing well for the nib in question, your writing experience heads down the toilet quick.

    Haven said this, often times you can have your nib tuned to write better with drier/wetter inks, depending on your taste.

    For example, I have a Man 100 adjusted for a generous flow, so to speak, in a B nib that writes like a 2B. It needs a dry ink such as the Pelikan 4001. If I use a wet one...it will empty the converter quicker than I can write my name hahahahaha
    Last edited by r1p; December 29th, 2018 at 03:53 PM.

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    Default Re: Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    First of all please consider that fountain pens will work well only with shellac free inks. If you use a shellac based ink you will surely clog the feed.
    Pelikan 4001 black is known as a "dry" ink which is suitable for "wet" nibs such as vintage Pelikans (and many others). Evidently it is not the best ink for your Waterman EF nib.
    For an EF Waterman pen you should probably use a "wet" ink such as Waterman (or most Sailor or Iroshuzuku inks).
    Whatever you do please try different inks in your pens before you consider tinkering (personally or professionally) with their nibs.

    ...and welcome to FPGeeks!

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    Default Re: Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    I have Pelikan 4001 Brilliant Black and have found it to work better in pens that tend to have high flow, and it has tamed a few gushers.

    I don't have any Waterman pen experience except that my wife's Hemisphere (F) writes and flows amazingly with Serenity Blue.

    I've found Quink Permanent Black flows a bit more generously in drier pens with extra fine or posting nibs, like two of my Esterbrooks, while Iroshizuku Take-sumi flows even more so and makes somewhat frustratingly dry pens quite a bit nicer to use.

    Hope this is helpful.

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    Default Re: Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    I have a Waterman Carene and several other Waterman pens with extra fine nibs. These pens write well with any ink, including Pelikan 4001 inks. The EF Carene nib unit was bought from nibs.com, and they do tune the nibs. I don't think you should be having these issues, but the tuning of the nibs might be the cause, dry as opposed to wet. Consider too flossing the nibs..

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    Default Re: Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    Thank you all very much for the advice / ink theory crash course. I tried an inexpensive, wetter ink made
    by Arts Alternatives, and it flowed very smoothly from the Watermans. That was encouraging. I'll try a few
    more to see how they do. If I can find a large enough selection of inks that flow well, I'll consider the Waterman
    EF problem solved. Otherwise I will send them off to Waterman for tuning, flossing etc.

    Thank you again for your help.
    Steven

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    Default Re: Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    Quote Originally Posted by Steven View Post
    Thank you all very much for the advice / ink theory crash course. I tried an inexpensive, wetter ink made
    by Arts Alternatives, and it flowed very smoothly from the Watermans. That was encouraging. I'll try a few
    more to see how they do. If I can find a large enough selection of inks that flow well, I'll consider the Waterman
    EF problem solved. Otherwise I will send them off to Waterman for tuning, flossing etc.

    Thank you again for your help.
    Steven
    The amusing thing is that Waterman's Serenity blue is considered THE standard testing ink - if a pen won't write smoothly with it, then it's in need of tweaking or repair. So you might want to try it - it's cheap and an excellent ink. Pel Black otoh is notably dry. If you really want to use it, you can add a little glycerine or photoflow.

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    Default Re: Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    I almost always find that Parker Quink works in any pen that I have that writes dry . I have some that is 10 years old but mostly I look for the 1940-1950 stuff on ebay . I have Micro Film Black , Green, Violet , Blue Black , Red and Brown and it is all wonderful ink and usually can be had reasonably priced . I bought a dozen or so bottles from the 40's recently for 7.95 each + shipping from one ebay seller , all in original vintage boxes in immaculate condition .

    If your pen writes nicely with any ink you have that you really like I would not worry about having it adjusted for any others , if not , then go for it . I usually do not switch inks once I find one that works like I want it to in a particular pen bur I have lots of pens and do not need them to work with multiple inks .

    Eddie

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    Steven (January 22nd, 2019)

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    Default Re: Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    I have been trying other inks, though I haven't gotten around to Serenity Blue or the Parker Quink.
    But here's a twist: I've always used bottled ink, but this morning, out of curiosity and desperation,
    I put Waterman black cartridges in the two XFs, and they both wrote quite nicely. Could the flow problem
    have been caused by faulty converters? Or something in the general converter-to-nib mechanism? I will
    write with the XFs for a few more days, and see how they do when the cartridges are somewhat depleted.
    I would like to be able to conclude that fault lies not in my ink, but in my converters. It just offended my
    sense of propriety that a Waterman pen, however fine the nib, not write well with Waterman black.

    I was not aware that Serenity Blue was the ink of choice for testing. Is it just wet enough to flow well
    from any nib, and just dry enough to not run? That is good to know. I will be sure to try the Serenity
    Blue before I throw in the towel and send the XFs somewhere for adjustment.

    I will also try the Parker Quink. I used it many years ago with one of my first pens (a Parker), and don't
    remember any having any problems.

    Thank you as always for the advice.
    Steven

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    Default Re: Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    If you have a faulty converter, it will usually have lost the vacuum to suck up ink and hold it. Ink in the converter would flow out, and you couldn't suck up ink. I often use a small toothpick through the converter mouth with a tiny bead of silicone jelly-like lubricant that I deposit on the inside of the tube near the piston. I work the piston back and forth a few times to spread the silicone lube. I think this helps a converter last longer, but I couldn't prove it.

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    Default Re: Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    It turns out that the Waterman EFs did not perform better with cartridges.
    Just as with converters, they started to run drily after the ink reservoir dropped
    by about 1/3. So after three weeks of testing, I can conclude that (as you've all
    been telling me) that I should either switch to wetter inks or have the nibs tuned
    to drier ones.

    Most of you who have weighed in seem to feel that wetter ink is the preferable
    remedy. I have no rational objection, just a grouchy conviction that a new Waterman
    pen should be optimized for Waterman ink. Maybe that's not possible, given the large
    differences in flow between their mediums and extra-fines.

    Okay, so I will try the Quink first. Thank you all again. On the bright side, three weeks
    of testing has left me with enough ink for a couple of years.

    Steven

    P.S. Have any of you had a Waterman nib tuned? Were you happy with the outcome?

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    Default Re: Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    I bought two extra fine nibs for two carenes from nibs.com. I told them what ink I used and they tuned the nibs. $129 each, purchase price. These two nibs write perfectly with Montblanc, Pelikan 4001 or Sheaffer blue black inks. I felt they knew what they were doing.

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    Default Re: Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    Quote Originally Posted by Steven View Post
    P.S. Have any of you had a Waterman nib tuned? Were you happy with the outcome?
    I had Dan Smith take a stab at one of my Experts and Iíve been very pleased with the results. It was already smooth but a little dry for my tastes. Now itís even smoother and the flow is perfect.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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    Default Re: Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    I have never had a nib tuned. If I leave the Waterman EF nibs as they are,
    I can solve the flow problem by switching to wetter inks, and still preserve
    the extra-fine line.

    If, on the other hand, I had the nib tuned to increase the flow, the pen would
    lay down a slightly thicker line, but I would be able to use the drier inks.

    Is this correct?

    Thanks,

    Steven

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    Default Re: Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    Thank you for that recommendation. A fountain pen nerd friend of mine speaks
    highly of them also. (She dropped her Pilot straight down on on its nib.) I can't
    find a satisfactory ink some time soon, I'll try having the Waterman XFs tuned.

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    Default Re: Waterman Extra Fine Pens

    Parker Quink seems to elicit a wide range of opinions. User 1 finds it dry, but
    User 2 feels quite strongly that it is wetter than Waterman or Pelikan Black.
    I guess it is somewhat subjective, and depends on writing style, paper quality
    and pen type.

    I have ordered some. If doesn't help the Waterman XFs, I can still use it in
    the Sheaffer and Cross XFs. Their XF nibs are more like Waterman fines.
    Thicker lines, but trouble-free.

    Thank you again for the recommendation.

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