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Thread: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    The fountain pen is no longer an everyday, useful and necessary object. It has evolved into what is in effect hand jewellery, as electronic communication replaces it. All of the thought and research that went into Conid was a long time after it had become obvious the FP was on its way out. By deep thought, analysis and the use of modern materials, the Conid design solves most of the problems of carrying around a substantial vial of ink, in a form ready for it to be used for writing, on demand. I appreciate the Conid, for what it is, a piece of engineering art that reflects a lot of human thought and experimental efforts. Because I have been a designer, and know about the balancing of contradictory factors, these pens stand to me as representations of the pinnacle of human existence. We are at a stage where we can put our powers and desires into things that are not necessary, just to show we can do it. People just don't do that kind of thing when we are grubbing around in the dirt for subsistence. To me, every man made object contains the accumulated thoughts and knowledge of many people, working together and separately. The point of the pen is where our inner thoughts meet reality and can be communicated to others, and it more than any other instrument lead the way to where we are socially and technologically now. So as a symbol of achievement the Conid has an important philosophical place. The Conid is exactly what all thinking people in 1910 needed. I can see exactly why they are worth their price and why someone would consider paying it.

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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    I still remember this thread on FPN where the Conid is more than just a luxury.

    I still don't own one (and I'm not sure I ever will) but I'm happy they exist.

    I don't understand why people keep talking about the Pilot 823. Ok, they both use rods internally, but for me they're different in terms of design, aesthetic, filling mechanism, nibs etc.

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    Default The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    ó accidental duplicate

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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    I have the Conid Antwerppen - Regular.
    It is probably my favourite pen, while it has ďonlyĒ a steel nib. I like the ingenuity of the filling mechanism that holds a tremendous amount of ink, there is the obvious high precision construction, and the nib is tuned perfectly.
    I do have other nice pens from the usual suspects, Montblanc, Aurora, Visconti, Sailor... I like them all but at least for me the Conid feels just right.
    Would love to add an ebonite with gold nib one day.

    Btw, Onoto was mentioned. I donít think it is the same principle since if I am not mistaken the Onoto fills on the downwards stroke, the Conid fills on the upwards stroke.

    Btw 2, out of curiosity I bought a Penbbs 355 to compare. I like Penbbs in general bit frankly donít buy the 355 as a cheap Conid. Operating its mechanism is horrid.

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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    Quote Originally Posted by BulkyFiller View Post
    Btw, Onoto was mentioned. I donít think it is the same principle since if I am not mistaken the Onoto fills on the downwards stroke, the Conid fills on the upwards stroke.
    You're not mistaken.


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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    Quote Originally Posted by catbert View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by BulkyFiller View Post
    Btw, Onoto was mentioned. I donít think it is the same principle since if I am not mistaken the Onoto fills on the downwards stroke, the Conid fills on the upwards stroke.
    You're not mistaken.

    (video =snip)
    I admire the Onoto design. I have one from pre 1910 era, which makes it one of the first examples to use the mechanism. I have not been able to use it because it needs repacking, but I have had a chance to look at all the hand made pieces that make it up. If you look closely you will see the maker hand cut the tiniest of screws to hold the plunger mechanism together. The curve at the end of the barrel exactly calculated and turned to allow the ink to flow past the plunger at just the right point. The plunger held in place by packing just pressure resistant enough to have ink flow in at just under an atmosphere pressure. It is an idea that has been used by Visconti and even taken a little further by them, as shown in this video.


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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrawler View Post
    The fountain pen is no longer an everyday, useful and necessary object. It has evolved into what is in effect hand jewellery, as electronic communication replaces it. All of the thought and research that went into Conid was a long time after it had become obvious the FP was on its way out. By deep thought, analysis and the use of modern materials, the Conid design solves most of the problems of carrying around a substantial vial of ink, in a form ready for it to be used for writing, on demand. I appreciate the Conid, for what it is, a piece of engineering art that reflects a lot of human thought and experimental efforts. Because I have been a designer, and know about the balancing of contradictory factors, these pens stand to me as representations of the pinnacle of human existence. We are at a stage where we can put our powers and desires into things that are not necessary, just to show we can do it. People just don't do that kind of thing when we are grubbing around in the dirt for subsistence. To me, every man made object contains the accumulated thoughts and knowledge of many people, working together and separately. The point of the pen is where our inner thoughts meet reality and can be communicated to others, and it more than any other instrument lead the way to where we are socially and technologically now. So as a symbol of achievement the Conid has an important philosophical place. The Conid is exactly what all thinking people in 1910 needed. I can see exactly why they are worth their price and why someone would consider paying it.
    I have to say my fountain pens are useful and necessary everyday items, and most are as undecorative as possible. With you on the rest, though.

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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    Quote Originally Posted by catbert View Post

    I have to say my fountain pens are useful and necessary everyday items, and most are as undecorative as possible. With you on the rest, though.
    To you perhaps, but they are becoming so uncommon in every day life that now even the plainest fountain pen can elicit interest and attention.

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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrawler View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by catbert View Post

    I have to say my fountain pens are useful and necessary everyday items, and most are as undecorative as possible. With you on the rest, though.
    To you perhaps, but they are becoming so uncommon in every day life that now even the plainest fountain pen can elicit interest and attention.
    Hooded nibs are a good way to avoid unwanted attention.

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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    Doesn't the 823 require you to unscrew the end cap about 1/8" to be able to write with it? That seems so weird to me that I've never wanted to own one, despite hearing many people rave about them.
    Quid rides? Mutato nomine de te fabula narratur. ó Horace
    (What are you laughing at? Just change the name and the jokeís on you.)

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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    Conids are the same; it opens the channel between the primary and secondary reservoirs. Their CAISO mechanism is designed to remove that requirement.

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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    Quote Originally Posted by calamus View Post
    Doesn't the 823 require you to unscrew the end cap about 1/8" to be able to write with it? That seems so weird to me that I've never wanted to own one, despite hearing many people rave about them.
    Only if you are writing for a long while. You can get a paragraph or two out with just the ink in the section and feed, The TWBI Vac 700 is the same I believe.

    If you love everything about the 823 (and there is, imo, a lot to like about this pen) but are not keen on the vac fil or shut off valve your remedy is to just get the 743 which is essentially the C/C version of the pen. Same nib and feed and section, just different filling mechanism. Great Great pen. Those Pilot #15 nibs are magic. The 743 is also great in the hand, great balance and ergonomics and comes in some fantastic nib options. Of course it only comes in Black (fist shake at Pilot) and a near black Burgundy.

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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    I have gathered that the why of the bulk filler is that it carries a large ink reservoir, has a shut off valve for safety and is an elegant solution.

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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    A benefit of the design, materials and tolerances is that I have no qualms disassembling the bulkfiller mechanism again and again. Virtually all other pens are manufactured without anticipating it will be routinely disassembled, which I usually opt to avoid where unnecessary, relying instead on "advanced flushing." With the Conid, Francis and Werner have made it a pleasure to tear down and clean between inks, even if unnecessary. It's the concept of the Pelikan nib unit applied to an entire pen.

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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    I've owned 5 Pilot 823'a and currently own 3 Conid's. I love both. The one huge advantage of the Conid is being able to thoroughly disassemble the pen with ease for cleaning and replacement of seals. Plus, you can swap nibs all day long, which I do frequently.

    Dave

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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    Quote Originally Posted by silverlifter View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_of_Clouds View Post
    compare Conid to Pilot's Custom 823
    For one, the Conid barrels aren't prone to cracking...
    Not to come to the defence of the 823, because this is actually one of the few Pilot pens I don't like (due to the balance of the pen being atrocious to my hand), but I think this would be a vulnerability in most plastic pens. For people who have problems with barrels cracking, a thicker plastic, a metal pen, a pop cap or a click mechanism might be better for them. My intuition is that people are trying to get a really good seal when they cap the pen, since they are afraid of the nib drying, and overdo it. I have about a dozen Pilot pens and for most of them there isn't much of a gradual increase of friction as you close the pen, it's very sudden the point at which it is fully closed (as opposed to, say, a pen with a spring behind the inner cap which offers resistance just before it is fully closed) and can't be turned anymore. Unlike the lid of a jar of jam, you can damage it. But like fine pottery, it's not designed to handle abuse, it's designed to be used delicately and sensitively. We're talking about a Japanese product here, this is a culture of people who do not tear open gift wrap, but instead methodically and gently unravel it so that the wrapping paper is undamaged.

    For my comments on the Conid, I don't have one but it looks really cool. At 18g for the regular, I think that's a bit lighter than the 823? Comparable to the Pilot Decimo, which is a tolerable weight. But I still worry the balance of the pen would be hard on me, as I hold my pens at the section and have thin, somewhat boney hands, so I hate when the weight of the pen rests primarily on the crook between thumb and index finger. Especially bad when I rest the pen at the bottom of my index finger, since that requires the fingers to hold the pen in place and a back-weighted pen is unsuitable for this position. I do think the mechanism in the Conid looks superior to the 823 when it comes to cleaning. The 823 can be a little annoying even when you unscrew the section from the body.

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    Default Re: The Conid's "Bulkfiller" - Why?

    I have become a big fan of Pelikan over time because of my utter frustration and dislike for C/C pens, and most sac filler mechanisms. I have had no interest in an 823, not my style, I just don't feel it. However, with Conid (the Minimalistica), I found more of the ease of use and ink capacity that I love about Pelikan, but a bare bones and tough workhorse that I use everyday. I write a lot, be it in a lab, in classes, or just to journal. I use a lot of ink. And no, I don't think Pelikan makes a bad workhorse pen, they are wonderful and sturdy. However, I run out of ink in under a 5 day workweek with most Pelikan pens. Even with a fine nibbed one. I have an XXF nib on my Conid and it gets me through a full week, but usually less than two, on one fill. This means for me, when I am busy, I don't have to worry about running out of ink or refilling every weekend. I break out my Pelikans as my fun pens and I carry Opus 88s and Lamy 2000s as backup pens. With usually lots in rotation, I rarely feel the worry that I will run dry when I forget to fill a pen. I suppose this is all just my own way of saying, I love my Conid as a daily driver, but it is not my favorite pen ever. That probably is a hard question to answer anyways since I have a lot of pens I enjoy.

    Conid has in my opinion a second to none filling system. I will someday purchase another too I believe. This one carries a bit of scuffing and really has a loved look to it. One of the demonstrators that I believe ages well. I have nothing bad to say about these pens. I think that you get even more than you pay for with them.

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