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Thread: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

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    Senior Member Kulprit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    This is one reason why I got myself an empty Lamy bottle, and why Iím trying to kill off a bottle of (ugly) Montblanc Royal Blue. These are great bottles for decanting from poor bottles.

    I have a bottle of vintage Skrip but itíll be years before I empty that one. I also intended to use my Iroshizuku bottles for this but Iíve been so busy trying to use up my MB RB that Iíve been neglecting my Iro.


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    Senior Member calamus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    The Pilot bottles have that little reservoir that you fill by turning the bottle upside down (with the lid screwed on tightly -- duh) and then righting them. I love that feature.
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    Senior Member dfo's Avatar
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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    The Waterman ink bottle is one of the best on the market. I like the faceted sides more than the Pelikan 4001 bottle. I find Herbin bottles to be pretty meh along with Pelikan Edelstein and Pilot Iroshizuku bottles.

    Besides the lack of variety with Waterman inks, they are some of the best behaved inks on the market.
    "Love is the final fight."

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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    Here's where having a variety of pens helps. Snorkels are good for sucking out the elusive last bits of ink. A capillary filling Parker 61 is even easier if you have to tilt the bottle as you do with Herbin inks.

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    Senior Member calamus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    Quote Originally Posted by dfo View Post
    The Waterman ink bottle is one of the best on the market. I like the faceted sides more than the Pelikan 4001 bottle. I find Herbin bottles to be pretty meh along with Pelikan Edelstein and Pilot Iroshizuku bottles.

    Besides the lack of variety with Waterman inks, they are some of the best behaved inks on the market.
    Ah, but you can mix Waterman inks and get some nice colors. Richard Binder came up with a "Vintage Blue" that's gorgeous, a sort of sapphire blue. It's four parts serenity blue to one part tender purple, I believe. Ask junglejim, he knows for sure.

    Edit, 5 days later: I checked with him. Yep, 4:1 it is.
    Last edited by calamus; June 20th, 2019 at 04:15 PM.
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    Senior Member welch's Avatar
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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    Quote Originally Posted by arrow View Post
    How bad is it to pour the remains of an old ink bottle into a new one? I have done it with my black and blue Parker and Pelikan inks. They never get too old, but the lid have been open a few times.
    That's the way to do it. I was down to the last scraps of Parker Penman Sapphire and Monteverde Horizon Blue. Combined them until the combination was down to the bottom, and added he remains of Asa-Gao.

    Of course, as Chrissy mentions, don't pass "stuff" from one bottle to the next.

  8. #27
    Senior Member calamus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    I'm fairly new to blending inks, but from what I've read, some inks will react chemically with others. I believe Richard Binder wrote about it. Also, here on FPG, SIR, who is quite an accomplished ink blender, suggested (I think that's who said it, IIRC) mixing a small amount of two inks together and letting them sit for a few days to see if they do anything weird, if they're inks that you don't already know can be blended safely. If there's no reaction, then you can go ahead and mix them together and use them.
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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    Quote Originally Posted by calamus View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by dfo View Post
    The Waterman ink bottle is one of the best on the market. I like the faceted sides more than the Pelikan 4001 bottle. I find Herbin bottles to be pretty meh along with Pelikan Edelstein and Pilot Iroshizuku bottles.

    Besides the lack of variety with Waterman inks, they are some of the best behaved inks on the market.
    Ah, but you can mix Waterman inks and get some nice colors. Richard Binder came up with a "Vintage Blue" that's gorgeous, a sort of sapphire blue. It's four parts serenity blue to one part tender purple, I believe. Ask junglejim, he knows for sure.

    Edit, 5 days later: I checked with him. Yep, 4:1 it is.

    Actually, Mr. Binder's recipe is known as "Binder Blurple", a blue/purple colored ink that he blended many years ago to copy the color of Private Reserve Tanzanite. He wanted something that was safe for vintage pens (sac) and didn't have the Ex-lax properties and heavy saturation that PR Tanzanite was known for. The recipe for Binder Blurple is 1:1 Waterman Serenity Blue and Waterman Tender Purple.

    Personally, I am NOT a fan of any blurple colored inks so I adjusted the "Blurple" ratios to produce a really nice Blue that I was happy with, and named it "Binder Vintage Blue" in his honor, and it's still safe for vintage pens! It's currently loaded in a Swan SM1 lever filler from the early 1930's.

    There is also a custom blended "Binder Vintage Blue-Black", which is 4 parts Waterman Serenity Blue to 1 part Waterman Intense Black. Another safe ink for vintage pens that doesn't have the nasty teal color (Another color palette that I am not fond of.) It's not a special color, just functional, like many other Blue-Blacks currently on the market today.

    Sorry for getting off-topic, Fred. To get back on-topic, I really enjoy the Pilot Iroshizuku 50ml bottles. They are beautiful, and useful with the wide opening and little cut-out at the bottom of the glass bottle. It's quite a sight when filtered sunlight comes in from my west facing window and hits the ink in its bottle. To get the last dregs I just use a syringe with a blunt tip needle and suck it into a plastic ink sample vial. The empty Waterman bottles are also very well thought out and can be bought cheaper than the empty Pilot bottles at your favorite ink retailer.

    All the Best.
    Last edited by junglejim; June 22nd, 2019 at 12:51 PM. Reason: spelling, as usual, lol
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    Senior Member calamus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    I too love the Iroshizuku bottles for their beauty. Even the little 15 ml bottles are quite attractive, but the 50 ml are gorgeous.

    Oh, and thanks for the explanation about the origin of the "Binder Vintage Blue." I have an English Parker Duofold and an Esterbrook SJ inked up with them at the moment.
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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    Levenger bottles are among the best in getting that last little bit of ink.

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  12. #31
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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    I like Montblanc bottles, so bought an old Montblanc shoe type bottle off ebay, with some ink in the bottom. It had no box so I didn't know which blue-black ink version it was, and considered throwing it away.

    However, after trying it on a cotton swab it was just left in the bottle for the time being. On going back to it I could see sludge in the bottom of the side inkwell where you fill your pen from. I could carefully tip the ink down to the other side of the bottle and clean off that sludge. However, I did this several times and there was always more.

    Eventually I wetted a coffee filter paper, poured the ink into that and let it drip through into a jug. There was still some sludge left in the filter paper at the end.

    I'm assuming that was all "debris" from the ink having being used in a pen over the years. I was surprised how much there was.

    Unless this Montblanc blue-black ink was an IG version and that was the IG portion of it??

    It never forms any sort of a "film" on the surface, so looks OK
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    Senior Member FredRydr's Avatar
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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    Quote Originally Posted by Chrissy View Post
    ...Unless this Montblanc blue-black ink was an IG version and that was the IG portion of it?? ....
    If you bought the old-style Montblanc blue/black in the rounded-end bottle, it is iron gall. It remains one of my favorites and is always in a 146 for signing documents and checks (and correspondence).

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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    Quote Originally Posted by arrow View Post
    Proof the Pelikan bottle existed. I can't remeber if it was exatly the same, but at least very close.

    I have a bottle of Pelikan black in that same form factor, older than the one pictured (I purchased it in the 1980s IIRC) by the cap styling... I think it was an anniversary issue? At any rate, it's either identical to, or just as bad as the Herebin bottles!
    David-

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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    The last bit of ink you waste accounts for pennies. I'm sure the amount of time wasted complaing about it cost you more money.

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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    Fair enough.

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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    Quote Originally Posted by NDAzone View Post
    The last bit of ink you waste accounts for pennies. I'm sure the amount of time wasted complaing about it cost you more money.
    Chill. You confuse complaining with general hobby bullshitting chat about minutia.

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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    Quote Originally Posted by calamus View Post
    I'm fairly new to blending inks, but from what I've read, some inks will react chemically with others. I believe Richard Binder wrote about it. Also, here on FPG, SIR, who is quite an accomplished ink blender, suggested (I think that's who said it, IIRC) mixing a small amount of two inks together and letting them sit for a few days to see if they do anything weird, if they're inks that you don't already know can be blended safely. If there's no reaction, then you can go ahead and mix them together and use them.

    I recently added a blue ink (can't remember which) to a 50 year old Pilot double spare cartridge that was still half filled with the original red.... the resulting dark purple looked nice, but flowed terribly and created a clotted ball of gunk around the tip of the nib when writing. I flushed that pen right away, before the feed could get plugged up!
    David-

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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    Quote Originally Posted by FredRydr View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Chrissy View Post
    ...Unless this Montblanc blue-black ink was an IG version and that was the IG portion of it?? ....
    If you bought the old-style Montblanc blue/black in the rounded-end bottle, it is iron gall. It remains one of my favorites and is always in a 146 for signing documents and checks (and correspondence).
    I was thinking of getting my hands on this ink. How long do you keep this ink in your pen before flushing?


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    Senior Member FredRydr's Avatar
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    Default Re: Herbin v. Waterman & Pelikan bottles

    Quote Originally Posted by Butthurticus-VIII View Post
    I was thinking of getting my hands on this ink. How long do you keep this ink in your pen before flushing?
    In this or any of my pens, they're flushed every second or third fill when not changing to a different ink. I never seem to suffer the problems some have written about iron gall inks. I use three,* and usually it's old Montblanc blue/black and seldom Diamine Registrar's or ESSRI.



    *I just discovered the Diamine Registrar's ink has decomposed in the full bottle, so I'm down to two.
    Last edited by FredRydr; August 26th, 2019 at 09:10 AM.

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