Mismatched pens (pens with parts from various years)

[top pen]

Is it generally frowned upon to replace for instance and earlier MKI 51 nib with a MKIII or an earlier 51 silver breather tube with a plastic.

[pajaro]

As a collectible it makes it incorrect for its period of manufacture. As a writing instrument, for the purpose of keeping it in service, it was probably done often. It depends on how you regard it. I have sometimes had to make incorrect but functional repairs, and I was sometimes delighted to find any part to make a pen working again, like replacing an O-ring hood with an ordinary hood without the O-ring. Depended on the color: some colors being harder to find than others. Sometimes replacement hoods and barrels came from Ariel Kullock, and I was thankful he made them. Scarcity of replacement parts can make you improvise.

[grainweevil]

I assume Parker repair folks wouldn't have given it a second thought, making doing so oneself merely following authentic practices. And, well, it's not as though 51s are rare.

Mind you, don't listen to me, I put 61 nibs in 51s and even a Hero clip on a 51 cap. I should be taken out and drowned in a vat of Quink for crimes against authenticity. (But rest assured, no pens of such dire infamy have been sold or offered for sale.)

[Kaputnik]

I won't frown on it, at least, but then, I mostly care about what a pen is like to write with. "Pure" collectors might have a different perspective.

[FredRydr]

It's the ol' collectors versus users approach to vintage fountain pens. I prefer to upgrade vintage pens with later improved versions of their feeds to improve ink flow. Sheaffer Balance Premiers and Montblanc celluloid 14xs are examples where those companies' respective final feed designs were the best, before the models ended. Despite the purported frowns, I smile because my writing experience is improved. (Oh, I've swapped flat feeds back into old Meisterstucks before their sale.) I've experienced this conflict with antique automobiles, where purists express their offense where I'd replaced original rod and clevis brakes with hydraulics to make old motorcars safer and more fun.

If a pen is particularly valuable, try to make upgrades reversible in the event of resale.

[KBeezie]

Functionality and enjoyment wise, not so much of an issue, though I like having all the parts being somewhat true to each other of the correct model/era since (ie: the way it was originally intended).

But if I had that huge a problem with it, I wouldn't be using a 1964 Pilot Super 250 , with a 1968 14K "Falcon" nib because I highly doubt it originally came with that nib.

Far as the internals though... I replace nearly all of them with teflon tubing that I got as part of a vacumatic repair kit. I don't particularly see that as a problematic mismatch, as I've done it on Eversharp Skyline as well.


It's not much different functionality wise what I did to a "1st Year" snorkel.

I have 3 snorkels, an old desk pen which the inside of the section crumbled, that originally had a 14K EF nib on it, then a green valiant with a 14K Medium, then ended up with a grey statesman.

The statesman with the PdAg nib has a 14K solid gold snorkel tube which is very desirable to me, but I'm not a fan of the appearance of the PdAg medium despite it writing very well, it doesn't match with the gold tube and gold trims. So I sought to swap the nib with a 14K one. The problem is, the "fist year" models had different nib unit collars which are also a thin band, so I not only was keeping the nib collar and feed, but I had to unscrew the nib of both units themselves, and swap, which as a result required me to re-align the snorkel tubes. Then the 14K Medium ended up being spare because the PdAg nib went onto the green snorkel (which is now listed for sale, even though it required taking the tube from the old desk pen to make it work very well, and was a bit of extra work).

So I started with :

Black Snorkel Desk Pen, 14K EF (white dot but without a cap, can't really call it a Valiant or a Sentinel)

Green Snorkel Valiant, 14K M

Grey Snorkel Statesman, PdAg M

and Ending up with :

Black Snorkel Deskpen in pieces (14K M nib unit set aside for storage/spare)

Green Snorkel Statesman with a PdAg M

Grey Snorkel Valiant with a 14K EF

And to go one step further, I put a PVC sac into the Grey one (between the sac and 14K tube, makes it ideal for some previously ill advised inks such as iroshizuku), and latex into the Green one.

So my prized grey Sheaffer Snorkel Valiant set with the pencil (with the "Medium" sticker), is hardly originally a "valiant". But I doubt most would be able to tell if I didn't mention it because the sac protector, nib unit collar, and tube is still original to a "first year".

In the end I have a Grey Snorkel that is aesthetically pleasing that I am enjoying with my favorite ink (Iroshizuku Syo-ro) without worry of rupturing a latex sac, with one of my preferred nib sizes, with a filling tube that will never rust/corrode.

[Chuck Naill]

I am all about originality, but if it keeps a pen/pencil in use, do what you have to do.

[KBeezie]

I am all about originality, but if it keeps a pen/pencil in use, do what you have to do.

Though I will add this... If you already have the original parts, probably a good idea to make sure you keep them even if you do end up swapping them out for your own personal enjoyment.

[grainweevil]

If a pen is particularly valuable, try to make upgrades reversible in the event of resale.

I think that's an excellent rule of thumb. Across the board too. A ramble, not to say rant on the matter follows; reading it is not compulsory.

I acquired a job lot of lower end pens a few years ago all for the sake of one I thought looked interesting (I expect many of you know how that goes). Anyway the fellow who'd had them before at some point, and evidently fancied him (or her) self a pen repairing whizz, had done some truly barbaric things to many of the ballast pens in the lot. Things had been cut off, hacked about, glued together. All sorts. Plastic swarf abounded as evidence of their reign of junior hacksaw terror. The worst of it was, in nearly every case, a correct part or two, or a slightly more sympathetic workaround could have saved the pen completely. Unfortunately the solution of choice was simply to do whatever it took to facilitate fitting equally-butchered Chinese converters to the poor suffering pens. Your teeth do tend to grind when you find someone has hacked off the cartridge nipple on an otherwise usable Sheaffer school pen just for want of the cost of a Sheaffer cartridge. (If you're tempted to try it, no, it didn't work.) Don't get me started on the syringe filler that might have easily become a functional bulb filler if only someone hadn't cut off a few bits of barrel and tail cap here and there and then glued it all together. Off centre. (No, that one didn't work either. Not even by gluing in the converter, apparently.) It was not a good purchase on my part, that's for sure, but I did learn an awful lot about what not to do.

[KBeezie]

If a pen is particularly valuable, try to make upgrades reversible in the event of resale.

I think that's an excellent rule of thumb. Across the board too. A ramble, not to say rant on the matter follows; reading it is not compulsory.

I acquired a job lot of lower end pens a few years ago all for the sake of one I thought looked interesting (I expect many of you know how that goes). Anyway the fellow who'd had them before at some point, and evidently fancied him (or her) self a pen repairing whizz, had done some truly barbaric things to many of the ballast pens in the lot. Things had been cut off, hacked about, glued together. All sorts. Plastic swarf abounded as evidence of their reign of junior hacksaw terror. The worst of it was, in nearly every case, a correct part or two, or a slightly more sympathetic workaround could have saved the pen completely. Unfortunately the solution of choice was simply to do whatever it took to facilitate fitting equally-butchered Chinese converters to the poor suffering pens. Your teeth do tend to grind when you find someone has hacked off the cartridge nipple on an otherwise usable Sheaffer school pen just for want of the cost of a Sheaffer cartridge. (If you're tempted to try it, no, it didn't work.) Don't get me started on the syringe filler that might have easily become a functional bulb filler if only someone hadn't cut off a few bits of barrel and tail cap here and there and then glued it all together. Off centre. (No, that one didn't work either. Not even by gluing in the converter, apparently.) It was not a good purchase on my part, that's for sure, but I did learn an awful lot about what not to do.

Reminds me of the horror of seeing a Parker Vacumatic with the bottom of the barrel epoxy filled so it could be used as an eye dropper pen instead of properly restoring the filler.

[grainweevil]

Reminds me of the horror of seeing a Parker Vacumatic with the bottom of the barrel epoxy filled so it could be used as an eye dropper pen instead of properly restoring the filler.

Oh no, ouch. The pain. I wasn't even going to mention the Parker Challenger that had the melting and the gluing and the nagging feeling another pen may have been sacrificed in order to do it... It's too awful.

[guyy]

Manufacturers mixed and matched nibs and pens, and not only with pens sent in for repairs. Early MB 149s sometimes came with 139 nibs, Parker 51 nib dates didn’t always match the barrel date, and so on. Manufacturers used up existing stocks of materials, creating “transitional“ models.

I don’t care as long as the parts substituted are as good as the “period correct” parts.

[Chuck Naill]

Manufacturers mixed and matched nibs and pens, and not only with pens sent in for repairs. Early MB 149s sometimes came with 139 nibs, Parker 51 nib dates didn’t always match the barrel date, and so on. Manufacturers used up existing stocks of materials, creating “transitional“ models.

I don’t care as long as the parts substituted are as good as the “period correct” parts.

Doesn't matter if the manufacture did it as it remains genuinely Parker or MB. When pen sellers are trying to make a buck by mixing and matching, it is no longer original. Some modifications are necessary to keep a pen in service for which I have no issue. Just don't tell me something is original. Tell me the part was consistent with what the maker did.

[FredRydr]

...Just don't tell me something is original. Tell me the part was consistent with what the maker did.

The latter is original, unless you are distinguishing between restored (not original) and unrestored (original).

[grainweevil]

Ah, I see the slippery slope of semantics opening before us. Hope everyone plays nicely.

Meanwhile... I wonder whether top pen is content with a satisfactory answer to the initial pondering?

[aremesal]

I am all about originality, but if it keeps a pen/pencil in use, do what you have to do.

As I have pens for using them, not (just) for collecting purposes, I agree with you: better frankensteined that collecting dust.

But as FredRydr said, better if it's reversible.

Right now I have a P45 Aeromatic 1964. Love the metal barrel and the nib, but the section has an almost invisible leak. So it sits in my desktop with a section from a plastic, more modern P45. As the modern section didn't go well with the first edition aeromatic barrel (the converter protudes a couple extra milimeters) I use it with TWO separator rings. It looks good, and I can use it everday. It's a frankenstein pen, but easily reversible and thanks to that I can use it instead of keeping it in a drawer.

[Chuck Naill]

Ah, I see the slippery slope of semantics opening before us. Hope everyone plays nicely.

Meanwhile... I wonder whether top pen is content with a satisfactory answer to the initial pondering?

It is true...LOL!! I got a Parker 51 that was "restored". The parts used to restore were not correct and part of the diaphragm were floating around in the ink reservoir. I had it re-restored correctly by Parker51. Therefore for me, restored and original don't match.

[guyy]

Doesn't matter if the manufacture did it as it remains genuinely Parker or MB. When pen sellers are trying to make a buck by mixing and matching, it is no longer original. Some modifications are necessary to keep a pen in service for which I have no issue. Just don't tell me something is original. Tell me the part was consistent with what the maker did.

That’s the part where i don’t care at all. There’s no difference to me whether the matrimonial ceremony was conducted by someone with a contractual relation to a penmaking firm or someone who does not.

What’s more, in some cases, i’d prefer the period correct parts joined together by a hobbyist or independent repairer than a frankenpen cobbled together by a manufacturer.

[christof]

...Just don't tell me something is original. Tell me the part was consistent with what the maker did.

The latter is original, unless you are distinguishing between restored (not original) and unrestored (original).

...and what, if the manufacturer did exactly that - like Pelikan did with the model 100 in the last years of production?
between 1940 and ca. 1944 they tinkered pens from all leftover parts they could find...exactly what dubious pen restorer are doing nowadays. In this case it's impossible to distinguish between "original" and "restored" pens.
That's why I only call original what theoretically can be original, this of course from a collectors point of view only.
C.

[FredRydr]

...i’d prefer the period correct parts joined together by a hobbyist or independent repairer than a frankenpen cobbled together by a manufacturer.

Is that because the former is more "defendable" to challenges from purists than the latter? But take note of Christof's point about the Pelikan 100, which he thoroughly enjoys collecting and showing. And see the thread about my Sheaffer Masterpiece and the response from a friend who is also an ultra-purist. (Please don't revive that thread.) It sucks the enjoyment right out of owning a lovely pen, even if cobbled together by a manufacturer. I've had enough experience with nitpickers when having restored cars judged at car shows. It's more fun to simply accept the oddities that show up from time to time. Vintage Morgan owners know that lesson quite well.