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Thread: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    Mine finally came today! The first pic seems to have compressed the pen a bit but the rest are accurate...
    IMG_2349.jpg
    IMG_2353.jpg
    IMG_2352.jpg
    Will
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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    Nice to see the actual pen in use. I like your side by side mini review.
    Interesting to see the plastic barrel threads. Are the female cap threads in the metal, or in a plastic inner liner?

    Bob

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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    Quote Originally Posted by Seattleite View Post
    Nice to see the actual pen in use. I like your side by side mini review.
    Interesting to see the plastic barrel threads. Are the female cap threads in the metal, or in a plastic inner liner?

    Bob
    They are metal, which makes for (in my opinion) a somewhat unpleasant capping experience. They are also what prevents the cap from posting firmly.
    Other things about the cap:
    -it heavy on its own and makes the capped pen top-heavy (far from the balance of the original)
    -it comes off in 1 full turn, which seems excessive (the Pelikan 400 is a half-turn)
    Last edited by fountainpenkid; February 25th, 2021 at 07:46 AM.
    Will
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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    Looking at them side by side I like the the section more than the original and much prefer the fact that it's a C/C filler. The nib looks like it has a lot more tipping too.
    Regards, Chrissy | My Blog: inkyfountainpens

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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    Quote Originally Posted by Chrissy View Post
    Looking at them side by side I like the the section more than the original and much prefer the fact that it's a C/C filler. The nib looks like it has a lot more tipping too.
    I have found the new section more comfortable, if less nimble feeling. Aesthetically too it has grown on me...I like that they exposed the nib a little. Its unfortunate the pen lacks the refinement associated with the 51. I wish they had put the effort in and charged 25% more....
    Will
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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    For me, the special feature of the Parker 51 is its history, it is unique.

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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    Received email from EndlessPens announcing preorder of the new Parker 51 for $53.27 (steel nib) and $146.87 (gold nib). I am trying very hard to not open my wallet...

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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    Quote Originally Posted by RobJohnson View Post
    For me, the special feature of the Parker 51 is its history, it is unique.
    Yes. In some ways I think their departure from the original design is an acknowledgement of that: the ink-begets-pen context that spurred the original "51" no longer exists; people no longer use fountain pens for their practicality. Hence the full-turn screw cap, which I think is just a cost-saving measure, hence the brushed rather than frosted finish on the cap and section band, hence the extra weight in the badly-designed cap, hence the simply-cut hood. I'll have to do a 21-minute road trip though...if the pen remains comfortable posted and steady-flowing, I can't knock it too much. Like others have said, branding it as a "51" was bound to be a double-edged sword...
    Last edited by fountainpenkid; February 27th, 2021 at 09:45 AM.
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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    ... or you can save $30 and buy the Wing Sung 601. I've handled them at our pen ink club, where we have a member that has purchased several. They're quite nicely made, and follow the form of the original pens. Given its appearance, the new "Parker" pen has to be made in China. What then is the difference?

    Forgive me, I know that comes across as snarky, but I have developed jaded view of many modern pens having had to repair, or being asked to repair, many of them.
    Last edited by Ron Z; February 27th, 2021 at 01:14 PM.

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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Z View Post
    Forgive me, I know that comes across as snarky, but I have developed jaded view of many modern pens having had to repair, or being asked to repair, many of them.
    Ron, it isn't snarky, it is grasping the reality. For so many years many in the West looked down on the growing stream of inexpensive Chinese pens, but it slowly dawned that just like other places, there was an array of prices and quality choices to choose from. It rankles me to no end that people have chosen to resurrect well-known pens or brands of the past, only to have less-than-stellar Chinese manufacturing but charging high prices. For instance, I look at those poorly made 'new' Conklins and think "I can get a much better Chinese pen for a lot less money".

    In many cases, these marketing moves are a real insult to the original, in terms of value and quality, and that is what upsets me. Your comments are spot on.
    Last edited by Jon Szanto; February 27th, 2021 at 03:10 PM.
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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    Quote Originally Posted by carlos.q View Post
    Received email from EndlessPens announcing preorder of the new Parker 51 for $53.27 (steel nib) and $146.87 (gold nib). I am trying very hard to not open my wallet...
    Thanks to your reminder about the Endless Pens email, I couldn't resist opening my wallet and getting the Deluxe Plum. Fingers crossed that it doesn't let me down.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    Quote Originally Posted by fountainpenkid View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Seattleite View Post
    Nice to see the actual pen in use. I like your side by side mini review.
    Interesting to see the plastic barrel threads. Are the female cap threads in the metal, or in a plastic inner liner?

    Bob
    They are metal, which makes for (in my opinion) a somewhat unpleasant capping experience. They are also what prevents the cap from posting firmly.
    Other things about the cap:
    -it heavy on its own and makes the capped pen top-heavy (far from the balance of the original)
    -it comes off in 1 full turn, which seems excessive (the Pelikan 400 is a half-turn)
    I would think that there is a durability issue, as well. Excess rotation is likely due to a single cut thread, as opposed to the triple stacked steep pitch threads that most pens use. Here is a little piece of fountain pen trivia with a bit of irony about this. Parker's first metal capped pen, the 1930s' Duotone, used metal single cut threads in the cap and plastic on the barrel, as did the contemporary first Sheaffer's Crest, and the quite scarce Waterman's metal thread capped Hundred Year. All suffered from plastic threads wearing out, and from posting damage from sharp metal threads shoved on to the soft barrel material. All were quickly replaced by either a clutch style cap, or, in the case of Sheaffer's, a metal threaded collar on the barrel. This all happened in the late 30's/early 40's. Perhaps the folks at Parker aren't aware the the 51 was a step forward as the first metal capped Parker product to replace the threads with one of the most functional clutches ever used on a pen. Oh well.

    Bob

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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    Quote Originally Posted by Seattleite View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by fountainpenkid View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Seattleite View Post
    Nice to see the actual pen in use. I like your side by side mini review.
    Interesting to see the plastic barrel threads. Are the female cap threads in the metal, or in a plastic inner liner?

    Bob
    They are metal, which makes for (in my opinion) a somewhat unpleasant capping experience. They are also what prevents the cap from posting firmly.
    Other things about the cap:
    -it heavy on its own and makes the capped pen top-heavy (far from the balance of the original)
    -it comes off in 1 full turn, which seems excessive (the Pelikan 400 is a half-turn)
    I would think that there is a durability issue, as well. Excess rotation is likely due to a single cut thread, as opposed to the triple stacked steep pitch threads that most pens use. Here is a little piece of fountain pen trivia with a bit of irony about this. Parker's first metal capped pen, the 1930s' Duotone, used metal single cut threads in the cap and plastic on the barrel, as did the contemporary first Sheaffer's Crest, and the quite scarce Waterman's metal thread capped Hundred Year. All suffered from plastic threads wearing out, and from posting damage from sharp metal threads shoved on to the soft barrel material. All were quickly replaced by either a clutch style cap, or, in the case of Sheaffer's, a metal threaded collar on the barrel. This all happened in the late 30's/early 40's. Perhaps the folks at Parker aren't aware the the 51 was a step forward as the first metal capped Parker product to replace the threads with one of the most functional clutches ever used on a pen. Oh well.

    Bob
    I don't think it's a single-cut thread, at least. The cap can orient different ways...
    Will
    If my p.m box is full, feel free to email me at dabantur@gmail.com.

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    Default About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    Quote Originally Posted by fountainpenkid View Post
    Mine finally came today! The first pic seems to have compressed the pen a bit but the rest are accurate...
    IMG_2349.jpg
    IMG_2353.jpg
    IMG_2352.jpg
    Anyway you could show a picture of the two pens posted side by side? Also you said posting sucks. Is that due to length? Or because the new one will not post deeply or stay on?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Last edited by Linkinyeah; February 27th, 2021 at 07:49 PM.

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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    Quote Originally Posted by Linkinyeah View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by fountainpenkid View Post
    Mine finally came today! The first pic seems to have compressed the pen a bit but the rest are accurate...
    Anyway you could show a picture of the two pens posted side by side? Also you said posting sucks. Is that due to length? Or because the new one will not post deeply or stay on?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    They are exactly--or very very close to--the same length posted, surprisingly. This is because while the new pen has a shorter section and is shorter uncapped, it posts considerably less deeply because the cap threads get in the way. I wrote "posting sucks" because the cap is never totally secure on the back of the pen--it must be pressed onto the barrel with a slightly unsettling amount force, and can be wobbled around even once it feels secure. The act of writing doesn't activate the wobble, luckily, but it's still there and readily perceivable during the action.
    Will
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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    Quote Originally Posted by fountainpenkid View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Seattleite View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by fountainpenkid View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Seattleite View Post
    Nice to see the actual pen in use. I like your side by side mini review.
    Interesting to see the plastic barrel threads. Are the female cap threads in the metal, or in a plastic inner liner?

    Bob
    They are metal, which makes for (in my opinion) a somewhat unpleasant capping experience. They are also what prevents the cap from posting firmly.
    Other things about the cap:
    -it heavy on its own and makes the capped pen top-heavy (far from the balance of the original)
    -it comes off in 1 full turn, which seems excessive (the Pelikan 400 is a half-turn)
    I would think that there is a durability issue, as well. Excess rotation is likely due to a single cut thread, as opposed to the triple stacked steep pitch threads that most pens use. Here is a little piece of fountain pen trivia with a bit of irony about this. Parker's first metal capped pen, the 1930s' Duotone, used metal single cut threads in the cap and plastic on the barrel, as did the contemporary first Sheaffer's Crest, and the quite scarce Waterman's metal thread capped Hundred Year. All suffered from plastic threads wearing out, and from posting damage from sharp metal threads shoved on to the soft barrel material. All were quickly replaced by either a clutch style cap, or, in the case of Sheaffer's, a metal threaded collar on the barrel. This all happened in the late 30's/early 40's. Perhaps the folks at Parker aren't aware the the 51 was a step forward as the first metal capped Parker product to replace the threads with one of the most functional clutches ever used on a pen. Oh well.

    Bob
    I don't think it's a single-cut thread, at least. The cap can orient different ways...
    That is good. Perhaps Parker feels that all of that rotation is required in order to get adequate engagement on those fine threads. Still, the difficult posting may lead some to push the cap on hard enough to start scarring the barrel, in an effort to post securely.

    This pen seems targeted to collectors who somehow know that the "51' was a great icon, without knowing the details that made the "51" great. It is interesting to me that some of the most readily available vintage American pens have been reimagined in recent years, with different levels of authenticity. The Skyline, Esterbrook, and now the 51. Is the new cartridge/converter Snorkel just around the corner?

    Bob

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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    Quote Originally Posted by Seattleite View Post
    This pen seems targeted to collectors who somehow know that the "51' was a great icon, without knowing the details that made the "51" great. It is interesting to me that some of the most readily available vintage American pens have been reimagined in recent years, with different levels of authenticity. The Skyline, Esterbrook, and now the 51. Is the new cartridge/converter Snorkel just around the corner?

    Bob
    I agree Bob.

    The "old" Parker was driven to innovate by mighty competitors and the necessity of profit. As the result we have the great icon Parker 51.

    The "new" Parker, still driven by the necessity of profit, capitalizes on the name of the great icon, created something that just have enough resemblances without having to re-strategize their manufacturing to either
    re-made the "great icon"
    OR
    re-imagine the "great icon" with something equally great.

    As the result, we have a new pen, which seems to have more compromises than innovation.

    And I say the above without malice because I fully accept the possibility that when I get a hold of this new "51", I would be super impressed and all the compromises are "forgiven". I also happen to believe that this possibility is both remote and slim, at least for me.

    On the other hand, I have a WingSung 601. I am very impressed with it because I saw a respectful tribute to the great icon. How? It has more innovation than compromises.
    - Will
    Unique and restored vintage pens: Redeem Pens

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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    I was rinsing out a Parker 51 over a sink at work, an older employee came up behind me and said 'Is that a Parker 51'. Imagine my shame if I had had to say 'No its a Wing Sung' or 'actually it's a modern copy'.

    I know, such a snob.

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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    This new pen definitely feels like lazy, corner-cutting design, one carefully calculated for mass market appeal. Like penwash writes, if they were really interested in using the original as inspiration, they would have innovated--a new purpose for the hooded nib, a new slip-cap mechanism, a new filling system...
    At the same time, it's not a terrible pen. It feels nicer in the hand than a TWSBI, and does possess a vintage-y charm (in a deliberate 'vintage-ified' way), and the nib is smooth and consistent, if a little weak as a shader.
    For me it's a let-down, but not a failure.
    Will
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    Default Re: About that new Parker 51 (2020 edition)

    I was thinking about this thread earlier today, and the Hero 100 came to mind. A "flighter" version was given to me while we lived in Syracuse, and I repaired the barrel threads within the last couple of years. Not sure where it ended up. Nice pen, nice writing, and a good copy of the 51. I let it go because I found it to be too small for my hand, not because of the quality. It's about the same price as the new steel nib "Parker" 51.

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