Results 1 to 17 of 17

Thread: Question: straightening tines...

  1. #1
    Senior Member Detman101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Location
    n/a
    Posts
    248
    Thanks
    422
    Thanked 107 Times in 57 Posts
    Rep Power
    1

    Exclamation RESOLVED: straightening tines...

    On one of the nibs I'm practicing on, I reduced the legs of the tines slightly when I reduced the tip to an "EF" size.

    This has somehow caused the legs of the tines to have a "bowed" effect. I am not certain how to gently get rid of this effect without snapping the tips of the tines off.

    Do you have any recommendations?
    I considered lifting each tine separately and gently bending the tip of it out ever so slightly, then after each is done...cross the legs of the nib to bring the overall gap between the tines down to normal.

    I only seek to perform this to reduce the flow of ink in the nib...it's soooooooo juicy it's crazy!

    TIA

    Sent from my LG-M210 using Tapatalk
    Last edited by Detman101; September 8th, 2020 at 03:44 PM. Reason: Problem solved!

  2. #2
    Senior Member Detman101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Location
    n/a
    Posts
    248
    Thanks
    422
    Thanked 107 Times in 57 Posts
    Rep Power
    1

    Wink Re: Question: straightening tines...

    And here is a badly drawn example of what it looks like...haha


    Sent from my LG-M210 using Tapatalk
    Last edited by Detman101; September 7th, 2020 at 10:47 AM.

  3. #3
    FPG Donor ♕ Chrissy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    6,812
    Thanks
    3,418
    Thanked 5,878 Times in 2,376 Posts
    Rep Power
    15

    Default Re: Question: straightening tines...

    Can you say exactly what you did to "reduce the legs of the tines slightly" when you reduced the tip to an EF size?

    For example: if I wanted to make a nib finer than it was, I would only be operating along the outer edges of the tines. That would make the nib narrower without interfering with anything else. There's no way that running a nib smoothing board or a smoothing stone along the outer edge of each tine several times, would produce any problem in the centre of the nib like your diagram suggests.

    If instead you've done some sort of smoothing to the inner edges of the tines, for example using something abrasive on the inner edges of the tines or heavy work with a brass shim, then you could possibly get a bow legged effect like you describe in your diagram. I can't think of any fix for that unless you remove the same amount of material from the inside edges of the tipping then push the tines back together.

    The more work you do on a nib, the more likely it is that you might make it more brittle, then you might snap the tines off when trying to bend them back over each other.

    Have you watched a few nib tuning videos or read the repair book on the subject?

    Last edited by Chrissy; September 7th, 2020 at 02:45 PM.
    Regards, Chrissy | My Blog: inkyfountainpens

  4. The Following User Says Thank You to Chrissy For This Useful Post:

    Detman101 (September 7th, 2020)

  5. #4
    Senior Member Detman101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Location
    n/a
    Posts
    248
    Thanks
    422
    Thanked 107 Times in 57 Posts
    Rep Power
    1

    Default Re: Question: straightening tines...

    Quote Originally Posted by Chrissy View Post
    Can you say exactly what you did to "reduce the legs of the tines slightly" when you reduced the tip to an EF size?

    For example: if I wanted to make a nib finer than it was, I would only be operating along the outer edges of the tines. That would make the nib narrower without interfering with anything else. There's no way that running a nib smoothing board or a smoothing stone along the outer edge of each tine several times, would produce any problem in the centre of the nib like your diagram suggests.

    If instead you've done some sort of smoothing to the inner edges of the tines, for example using something abrasive on the inner edges of the tines or heavy work with a brass shim, then you could possibly get a bow legged effect like you describe in your diagram. I can't think of any fix for that unless you remove the same amount of material from the inside edges of the tipping then push the tines back together.

    The more work you do on a nib, the more likely it is that you might make it more brittle, then you might snap the tines off when trying to bend them back over each other.

    Have you watched a few nib tuning videos or read the repair book on the subject?

    Heya Chrissy,

    Yes, I've watched nib-tuning videos and also have read on the subject. Not to the point of collegiate study, but the basic techniques. I'm no master on any of this so far...hehe.
    I only applied work to the outer edges of the tines with sandpaper (by hand) to sharpen the nib. I correctly created my sharpening stick of a dowel laden with the 2000 grit sandpaper and ran it down the sides of the nib repeatedly while checking with the loupe. When looking through a loupe it appears as my drawing shows, the tips of the tines angle in..causing there to be more of a gap in the center between the tines.
    And while they seem sturdy enough, I don't want to risk the waste of this work by snapping off the tines by rushing in when there is a better way.

  6. #5
    FPG Donor ♕ Chrissy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    6,812
    Thanks
    3,418
    Thanked 5,878 Times in 2,376 Posts
    Rep Power
    15

    Default Re: Question: straightening tines...

    I can confirm that I have crossed one tine over the other tine in order to line them up, but that is usually when they aren't in line looking at them tips end on.
    I've never had a nib that looks like your diagram, so it's not a problem I've ever needed to correct even though I've taken a Montblanc B nib in a Bohème down to an Architect point.
    Once there was a Waterman nib that looked a little like the tines were both "swept over to one side". With that one I carefully used a very thin brass shim to pull the far tine away from the other one, then pushed the other tine into the slight space that I made. These have all been gold nibs that may or may not be less likely to break. I don't know.
    I've never used 2000 grit sandpaper on a nib. I've started on the smooth edge of a stone if I've needed to lose a lot of material, but mostly only use a nib smoothing board.
    You need to work out exactly what the problem is that needs to be solved then try whatever manipulation might work.
    Regards, Chrissy | My Blog: inkyfountainpens

  7. The Following User Says Thank You to Chrissy For This Useful Post:

    Detman101 (September 8th, 2020)

  8. #6
    Member eachan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Location
    Highlands of Scotland
    Posts
    48
    Thanks
    115
    Thanked 35 Times in 19 Posts
    Rep Power
    0

    Default Re: Question: straightening tines...

    Not an easy repair! Chrissy's brass shim is a good idea. You need to insert something thin but strong between the tines, then press each tine back into shape.

  9. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to eachan For This Useful Post:

    Chrissy (September 8th, 2020), Detman101 (September 8th, 2020)

  10. #7
    Senior Member Detman101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Location
    n/a
    Posts
    248
    Thanks
    422
    Thanked 107 Times in 57 Posts
    Rep Power
    1

    Default Re: Question: straightening tines...

    Thank you both @chrissy and @eachan.
    I have the brass shims in hand from gouletpens.
    I'll give it a go tonight and post results...

  11. #8
    FPG Donor ♕ Chrissy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    6,812
    Thanks
    3,418
    Thanked 5,878 Times in 2,376 Posts
    Rep Power
    15

    Default Re: Question: straightening tines...

    Quote Originally Posted by Detman101 View Post
    Thank you both @chrissy and @eachan.
    I have the brass shims in hand from gouletpens.
    I'll give it a go tonight and post results...
    Please use the thinnest one you can.
    Regards, Chrissy | My Blog: inkyfountainpens

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to Chrissy For This Useful Post:

    Detman101 (September 8th, 2020)

  13. #9
    Senior Member azkid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    Colorado, USA
    Posts
    1,921
    Thanks
    3,420
    Thanked 1,506 Times in 751 Posts
    Rep Power
    4

    Default Re: Question: straightening tines...

    Maybe the nib has some residual stress and removing material from the edge unbalanced the internal forces acting on the tip and tines. Idk. I'm not a metallurgist.

    Anyway, I would very, very gently, and gradually, bend the tines with a brass shim as Chrissy suggested.

    I have had a few nibs with this sort of problem and I've been able to correct it to a reasonably satisfactory degree this way.

    But I'm not a pro and maybe there are better, safer ways.

    I believe pros use a nib form and burnish (I think?) to remove certain vertical bends but I don't know if that would work for this problem.

    I would be wary of work hardening the material, by manipulating it too much. Again, not a metallurgist.

  14. The Following User Says Thank You to azkid For This Useful Post:

    Detman101 (September 8th, 2020)

  15. #10
    Senior Member Detman101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Location
    n/a
    Posts
    248
    Thanks
    422
    Thanked 107 Times in 57 Posts
    Rep Power
    1

    Default Re: Question: straightening tines...

    Quote Originally Posted by azkid View Post
    Maybe the nib has some residual stress and removing material from the edge unbalanced the internal forces acting on the tip and tines. Idk. I'm not a metallurgist.

    Anyway, I would very, very gently, and gradually, bend the tines with a brass shim as Chrissy suggested.

    I have had a few nibs with this sort of problem and I've been able to correct it to a reasonably satisfactory degree this way.

    But I'm not a pro and maybe there are better, safer ways.

    I believe pros use a nib form and burnish (I think?) to remove certain vertical bends but I don't know if that would work for this problem.

    I would be wary of work hardening the material, by manipulating it too much. Again, not a metallurgist.
    Well, I ordered a backup replacement nib just in case this one bites the dust when I try the Brass-shim-manipulation.
    If it fails I'll be stuck with this painful-to-use stock noodlers-ahab nib.
    Hmmm...maybe I'll leave it in it's wet state and just swap to drier inks...the Macassar and Delamere-Green should run this wet nib drier.
    I'll try that before I brass-shim it and see if that lowers its juicyness...

  16. #11
    Senior Member Detman101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Location
    n/a
    Posts
    248
    Thanks
    422
    Thanked 107 Times in 57 Posts
    Rep Power
    1

    Default Re: Question: straightening tines...

    (after Super-Juicy FPR nib swap...)
    Nope...this nib is super juicy with this ink too...lol.
    I'm going to have to try the shimming...it seems like that's the only thing that's gonna work.
    Back in a few minutes...wish me luck!

  17. #12
    Senior Member Detman101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Location
    n/a
    Posts
    248
    Thanks
    422
    Thanked 107 Times in 57 Posts
    Rep Power
    1

    Default Re: Question: straightening tines...

    OMG IT WORKED!
    IT WORKED!!

    I stuck the brass shim between the tines and slowly rocked it to each side pushing the tips back into straight positioning.
    It took a while and I had to go slowly and swap sides...but it worked.

    After bending the tips out the tines were slightly splayed. So I crossed over the tines, each under the other until the gap was normal. Then I adjusted the tines height and where they touch.

    And the nib is back good!!
    Pics included from results...everything below the line is after the work on the nib. It's still juicy but not floody when flexing!
    Needlepoint tip survived...I am SOOOOOOOO relieved. I have this nib perfectly at where I want it to be.

    THANK YOU ALL!!!




    Sent from my LG-M210 using Tapatalk

  18. The Following User Says Thank You to Detman101 For This Useful Post:

    azkid (September 8th, 2020)

  19. #13
    Senior Member Detman101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Location
    n/a
    Posts
    248
    Thanks
    422
    Thanked 107 Times in 57 Posts
    Rep Power
    1

    Default Re: Question: straightening tines...

    Hmmm...that's "Delamere Green" ink.
    Why does my phone show everything in shades of brown???

  20. #14
    Senior Member azkid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    Colorado, USA
    Posts
    1,921
    Thanks
    3,420
    Thanked 1,506 Times in 751 Posts
    Rep Power
    4

    Default Re: RESOLVED: straightening tines...

    White balance is a bit warm and ambient light is lacking, both of which can throw things off.

    Anyway, glad it worked!

  21. The Following User Says Thank You to azkid For This Useful Post:

    Detman101 (September 8th, 2020)

  22. #15
    Senior Member Detman101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Location
    n/a
    Posts
    248
    Thanks
    422
    Thanked 107 Times in 57 Posts
    Rep Power
    1

    Default Re: RESOLVED: straightening tines...

    Quote Originally Posted by azkid View Post
    White balance is a bit warm and ambient light is lacking, both of which can throw things off.

    Anyway, glad it worked!
    Translates to "My phone sucks!!" hahahhahahahahaaaa.
    (I'll get a new one eventually...this one is on it's last leg)


    Thank you though!! I'm over the roof now that this nib works right again!
    I think I did a thing...and I know now what caused this nib to "BOW-LEG" the way it did.
    In my experiments with this nib, I tried heat-setting it with fire. I think I left it in the fire too long
    Apparently I softened the metal and that caused the tines to bow-out slightly.
    It has also made it super-soft flexy and it takes almost no pressure to flex. Compared to the hand-cramping hard-nail that the stock Noodlers-Ahab flex nib is...this is such a pleasure to experience!!
    The XXF tip can write as thin as my beard hair if I use the reverse side of the nib or reeeeeeeeally lightly touch the nib to the paper on the normal side.
    It turns out the nib isn't "Super Wet" or "Floody" like I thought initially...it's just "Super Flexy" and since the feed gives you what you ask for...If you flex it, you get ink!
    Different, interesting and slightly...exciting!
    This is new! I'll have to practice with it and see how it performs....

  23. The Following User Says Thank You to Detman101 For This Useful Post:

    azkid (September 8th, 2020)

  24. #16
    Senior Member Detman101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Location
    n/a
    Posts
    248
    Thanks
    422
    Thanked 107 Times in 57 Posts
    Rep Power
    1

    Cool Re: Question: straightening tines...

    Whoowee...Just did this poem quote in full fast flex and I got all the way to "Air" before it needed to burp and get ink!!
    That's AMAZING!!
    Still I Rise.jpg

  25. #17
    FPG Donor ♕ Chrissy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    6,812
    Thanks
    3,418
    Thanked 5,878 Times in 2,376 Posts
    Rep Power
    15

    Default Re: Question: straightening tines...

    Quote Originally Posted by Detman101 View Post
    Hmmm...that's "Delamere Green" ink.
    Why does my phone show everything in shades of brown???
    You're phone is too close to the paper. What you need to do is to take your picture from a bit further away. If you're indoors take it in a sunny spot, say on a windowsill, or ensure you use flash. That way you will have more light getting in between the phone and the paper.

    Then edit the picture and crop it down to zoom into the text before you post it. Even if you can't do very much editing on your phone, you can get free editing software to do this.
    Last edited by Chrissy; September 9th, 2020 at 01:13 AM.
    Regards, Chrissy | My Blog: inkyfountainpens

  26. The Following User Says Thank You to Chrissy For This Useful Post:

    Detman101 (September 9th, 2020)

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •