Button Fill Pens and There difficulty to use?

[top pen]

I've had plenty of these and whist I do see merits over lever fills in regards to longevity and lack of ability to go wrong. In the sense there are no levers to break and they lack the weak point on the barrel where the circlip sits.

However I find in general button fill pens are hard to fill. In the sense some are so stiff you have grip extremely firmly to fill them as the force required to push the button is so great. I sometimes worry that I am a slip away from ploughing into the bottom of the ink bottle. Then there is need to have a higher ink level in a bottle then most other methods. As having the nib resting against the bottom of the bottle isn't an option as the worry of a slip is still there and with no margin space between the nib and bottom of the bottle the risk is far greater.


I've tried repo bars and originals but it's potluck weather a pen is so stiff you have to tense your forearm to get it to draw ink.

[Jon Szanto]

I agree in that, over all, they are more difficult to fill than a lever pen, and I prefer lever pens for this reason. The couple of button fillers that do see more use I tend to use with only one ink, and so filling them isn't such a big deal if it occurs a bit more often, as I don't go through (often) the usual flushing, etc.

It seems that virtually every filling system is a collection of pluses and minuses and you just end up settling on those that work best for you.

[Robert]

My experience with button fillers is very limited (two pens), but I've found it just about impossible to get a decent (+/- full) fill with them. I much prefer lever and piston fillers.

[Waski_the_Squirrel]

I haven't minded the button fillers I have. The biggest complication with them has been that I've found that some button fillers use odd-sized pressure bars that I can't find. I've been able to create substitutes for some. I have not had this trouble with lever fillers.

Parker adds a special wrinkle to the button-filler world because their pressure bars are different from those of other companies.

[penwash]

I like button fillers. While there are a few over the years that exhibit some stiffness, it is not the majority of the ones I restored.

One of the main cause of stiffness is the fit of the button on the collar, we are talking about sub-mm differences here, so at times I have to tweak the "button" so the fit would be just right for the action to be not stiff. For some pens, it does take a while (and it helps if you have a number of spare "buttons" to try finding a better fit).

Now, I have seen some button fillers where the button is not removable, therefore making adjustments very difficult if not impossible, but usually in pens with this design, the button fit is not an issue that would cause stiffness.

[Jon Szanto]

Will, I've certainly had pens where it wasn't the button fit, as you could get it to drop, back and forth (the pressed and unpressed placements) when the pressure bar was not in place. My issue has been with pressure bars that were just pretty stiff, but were original to the pen and I was hesitant to swap out. You have already noted how some of the PBs can be uniquely shaped for a particular pen. Even on a Duofold Jr. It can take a fair push to push the button all the way in, and then having to leave the nib in ink for a good few seconds can be a pain.

Honestly? Some of this might just be aging muslce and loss of muscle mass on my part, too.

[penwash]

Will, I've certainly had pens where it wasn't the button fit, as you could get it to drop, back and forth (the pressed and unpressed placements) when the pressure bar was not in place. My issue has been with pressure bars that were just pretty stiff, but were original to the pen and I was hesitant to swap out. You have already noted how some of the PBs can be uniquely shaped for a particular pen. Even on a Duofold Jr. It can take a fair push to push the button all the way in, and then having to leave the nib in ink for a good few seconds can be a pain.

Honestly? Some of this might just be aging muslce and loss of muscle mass on my part, too.

Jon, I was not being clear, so let me make another attempt

The button being able to flop down the collar without the pressure bar does not mean it will be a good fit *with* the bar in place.
The "tail" of the pressure bar could sort of "hold" the button at an awkward angle that contributes to the stiffness. These are the part where I adjust the position and button's "skirt" so the fit could be better. At times I did have to sand the inside of the collar a tiny bit to create just enough spacing that facilitate a non-snag experience. And for the majority of time, if I do this, the end result is a button filler that is not stiff.

I am not at all disqualifying yours or anybody's experience, it's just in my own, I usually can make a button filler that is usable (if not pleasant) to use. Now, I'll tell you the ones that do make me grit my teeth: Merlin Merlina. Those dainty barrels are super thin and trying to cram a pressure bar and still have wiggle room to compress the ink sac when it needs to (instead of always), is quite annoying

[Jon Szanto]

Ok, Will, that makes a bit more sense. I've also thought, at times, that the sac itself may have play in this.

If you think of all the pens you've taken apart, and also variations in new sacs that you purchase, I think there are definitely thinner and thicker wall sacs. I wonder what the actual thickness and pliability of the sac was like when the pens were news. A lever can exert a lot of force pretty easily, but if one were to use a sac that was less pliant in a button filler, it could certainly affect how much pressure would be required for the button press to squeeze the sac. Just physics at that point.

[Empty_of_Clouds]

re the OP: I've had a few button fillers, and in the main I found that I had no way of knowing how well (if at all) they were filling. Not my favorite mechanism quite frankly, though more elegant than a lever.

[eachan]

I'm a fan of button fillers; aesthetically more pleasing than a lever filler with the unbroken profile of the barrel and an efficient filler when properly repaired. I agree with Will's diagnosis of the stiffness problems. I'm happy to change pressure bars and buttons and if necessary I will apply a round file to the button aperture. Large replacement pressure bars can be cut to required lengths. No-one seems to make replacements for Parker's three-piece anchor bars but I've rarely had any trouble with those. They seem to be the best of the pressure bars.

[grainweevil]

No-one seems to make replacements for Parker's three-piece anchor bars but I've rarely had any trouble with those. They seem to be the best of the pressure bars.

D'you mean these?

My first pen repair was a button filler, so I'm hopelessly biased in their favour.

[eachan]

Is that the full three-piece or is it the two-piece compromise I have seen around? I suppose it works well enough but it isn't like for like.

[grainweevil]

Ah. Well you said "replacements", not "exact copies".

[eachan]

Ah. Well you said "replacements", not "exact copies".

That's true, Al. The three-piece bar works a little better. It's all about leverage and presenting a flat face to the sac to empty it of air more completely. When all's said and done the difference in ink in the sac may only be a very few ml, but I do appreciate the efficiency of Parker engineering a century ago.

[penwash]

I'm a fan of button fillers; aesthetically more pleasing than a lever filler with the unbroken profile of the barrel and an efficient filler when properly repaired. I agree with Will's diagnosis of the stiffness problems. I'm happy to change pressure bars and buttons and if necessary I will apply a round file to the button aperture. Large replacement pressure bars can be cut to required lengths. No-one seems to make replacements for Parker's three-piece anchor bars but I've rarely had any trouble with those. They seem to be the best of the pressure bars.

I was about to add the bolded part, but you said it well already.Parker button fillers are made well and I rarely have trouble with them.

I guess in summary: Can a typical button filler restoration become more involved than the simplest of lever fillers?

Yes. Absolutely. Button fillers requires a bit more precision or tinkering to get it "right". But once it is accomplished, it's one of the most "satisfying" filling systems.

I'd take a button filler any day vs a floppy, non-snug lever

[although]

I've got just a couple of button fillers. They work fine, but they have always struck me as being a rather Rube Goldberg attempt at dodging the Sheaffer lever filler patent ( I have no idea whether that is actually the case, but it seems like an unnecessarily complex way to compress a sac). I don't have strong feelings about them either way.

That being said, I absolutely love the nibs on all of my button filler pens! If a stiff button filler is the price for a glorious wet nib, I will pay that price all day long!

cheers

[KBeezie]

I feel like I don't mind button fillers, except it's one additional step to fill (removal of the blind cap), versus just using the lever. But far as filling capacity, I feel like depending on the pressure bar style they wouldn't be all that different from a lever filler, it's still a pressure bar being bowed or pushed in some fashion. The nicer setups usually presses against the sac in a very even length to get a larger degree of compression.

One thing I like about button fillers though, particularly Parker, is that once you got the button out, the pressure bar usually just comes right out, no difficult J-bars etc, allowing me to be able to soak the barrel and other work with it usually only being celluloid with no wires, c-bands, levers, etc to worry about and the whole barrel is usually just one seamless run other than the imprint, where as some of the lever fillers can bow a little bit from the point of the lever anchor, especially in cases like the Eversharp Skyline.

So in terms of pen longevity itself, I feel like a button filler would win out, since if the pressure bar breaks, it's usually pretty easy to replace without needing to do any repair to the barrel itself. And in some of the Parker pens, the 3-peice pressure bar is bent from pressure against itself, and not up against any part of the pen (at most the flange of the button is stopped by the narrow opening of the tail end of the barrel, but no pressure is exerted on the barrel for filling purposes, and usually very little pressure is caused by the relaxed bar against the opening).

The method also seemed handy for some people to convert vac-filling pens into button fillers without having to drill into the barrel for a lever.





The two-piece style pushes into the bottom of the section to force the bar to bend. Likely from a Parker Duofold much like where the blindcap and button probably came from.