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Thread: Essri vs Salix......

  1. #21
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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Quote Originally Posted by Ole Juul View Post
    hey have a flat fee of €100.00 for international shipping!
    You want the Gideons Bible Ink: that is distributed for free!
    Vintage. Cursive italic. Iron gall.

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    Senior Member Ole Juul's Avatar
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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Quote Originally Posted by silverlifter View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Ole Juul View Post
    hey have a flat fee of €100.00 for international shipping!
    You want the Gideons Bible Ink: that is distributed for free!
    lol

    I've stayed in cheap hotels and looked in the night table drawer but I've never seen any ink there. You have another source?

  4. #23
    Senior Member Pterodactylus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Quote Originally Posted by Yazeh View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Pterodactylus View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lloyd View Post
    Be aware that Scabiosa is very prone to fading.
    I can not confirm this, I just took a look at my ink journal (I keep entries of all my inks in there including writing samples, Clairefontaine paper) and my pen journal (where I make entries of all my pens, and try to note down the inks I inked up with them, normal school exercise books) and none of the entries with Scabiosa are faded.
    The earliest ones are 2 entries in my pen journal from 2013, and of course 1 entry beginning in 2013 in my ink journal.

    Could it be that you reference the hardcore UV testing from one of the megalomaniac FPN mods?
    You know from whom I’m talking, the wife which try to life her omnipotence fantasies on FPN.

    If yes, then this is imho no valid test putting the inks for months under the desert sun.
    It just proofs that intensive radiation exposure for a long time will destroy almost everything.
    I didn't have the patience to find that thread. But I believe Kung Te-Cheng was not at all affected.... I saw a similar thread, Scabiosa over 6 months... It loses its colour, but it's legible....
    Yes OK, but still exposed to light, for a quite long period.

    I see it that way.
    When you expose colors to light for a longer period many of them will fade.
    If you buying art supplies on the good stuff the manufacturer tells you about the light fastness of each color.
    In general the light fastness is often proportional with the price, and even then, for specific colors itˋs hard (or sometimes impossible) to get stuff with the highest light fastness.

    Also art pieces will fade when you do not protect them properly from light, UV filtering glass is a must have and even then you should not put it in direct sun light.

    How could somebody expect perfect light fastness of quite cheap writing inks?
    They are per ml dirt cheap compared to art supply colors.

    So my humble opinion is, normal use of writing (done with ink) is to keep it away from light.
    You said it we keep our notebooks closed.

    Then my expectation is that the colors will remain in good condition for at least decades.
    And beside a few exceptions I have no indication from my personal experience that this is not the case.

    If somebody is interested I can take a photo from my about 8 year old ink journal entry of Scabiosa side by side with a new written one.

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    Senior Member SchaumburgSwan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Quote Originally Posted by Yazeh View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Ole Juul View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Yazeh View Post
    That reminds me of the Bible Ink
    when it went from purple to black. Though I had understood that Essri would copy/scan as a different colour than black for barristers/lawyers in the UK....
    I guess I have to get one and see
    I just took a look at that Bible Ink and decided I needed to buy it. It's only €5.80 so I thought I'd get a couple of bottles. They take Paypal and credit cards so no problem paying. I found one small problem with buying from them however. They have a flat fee of €100.00 for international shipping! Subsequently I am reconsidering my purchase.
    Yes I had the same shock.....My sole consolation is that Jens said it's very dry and it turns black....
    They have also some very nice dip pen inks, one of which is iron gall. I'm sure Jens has a bottle of that too
    Hi Yazeh,

    guilty!
    I have both ig inks from the Gutenberg shop.
    The "Bible Ink" starts as a bit purplish blue-black and ages to a warm black (not cold or blueish as DRI and ESSRI).
    It is the driest and less lubricated ink I know.

    The "Ferro-gallic ink" for dip pens is a wet ink. No additional blue dye in it.
    It starts as a very light blueish color and ages quickly to purple-brown-black.
    A spectacular effect!

    Best wishes
    Jens
    Last edited by SchaumburgSwan; November 1st, 2020 at 09:11 PM.
    .................................................. .................................................. .

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/136145166@N02/albums

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    Senior Member Yazeh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Quote Originally Posted by SchaumburgSwan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Yazeh View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Ole Juul View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Yazeh View Post
    That reminds me of the Bible Ink
    when it went from purple to black. Though I had understood that Essri would copy/scan as a different colour than black for barristers/lawyers in the UK....
    I guess I have to get one and see
    I just took a look at that Bible Ink and decided I needed to buy it. It's only €5.80 so I thought I'd get a couple of bottles. They take Paypal and credit cards so no problem paying. I found one small problem with buying from them however. They have a flat fee of €100.00 for international shipping! Subsequently I am reconsidering my purchase.
    Yes I had the same shock.....My sole consolation is that Jens said it's very dry and it turns black....
    They have also some very nice dip pen inks, one of which is iron gall. I'm sure Jens has a bottle of that too
    Hi Yazeh,

    guilty!
    I have both ig inks from the Gutenberg shop.
    The "Bible Ink" starts as a bit purplish blue-black and ages to a warm black (not cold or blueish as DRI and ESSRI).
    It is the driest and less lubricated ink I know.

    The "Ferro-gallic ink" for dip pens is a wet ink. No additional blue dye in it.
    It starts as a very light brownish color and ages quickly to brown-black.
    A spectacular effect!

    Best wishes
    Jens
    Oh, Jens. I would love to see a written sample of that one, ie. if you have one and it's no trouble. From what you describe it looks like old manuscript effect......

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    Senior Member SchaumburgSwan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Quote Originally Posted by Yazeh View Post

    Oh, Jens. I would love to see a written sample of that one, ie. if you have one and it's no trouble. From what you describe it looks like old manuscript effect......
    Dear Yazeh,

    I will...
    Just looked at the ink - it has the most spectacular oxidising effect of all inks I know!
    It even starts at a barely visible light blue, then it goes light purple within seconds, the next minutes it is getting darker and darker until a deep purple-black is reached.
    I mixed it up with Gutenberg G10 in the last post, going from light brown to brown-black...

    Best
    Jens
    .................................................. .................................................. .

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/136145166@N02/albums

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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Quote Originally Posted by Pterodactylus View Post

    Then my expectation is that the colors will remain in good condition for at least decades.
    And beside a few exceptions I have no indication from my personal experience that this is not the case.

    If somebody is interested I can take a photo from my about 8 year old ink journal entry of Scabiosa side by side with a new written one.
    I'd be interested Ptero

    I believe the original lightfast experience was because of a plant nursery in Nevada, where the sun obliterated everything....especially Sharpies... having had the same problem with labels, I use pencils, whenever I label seedlings. I read from a plantain that they could easily read plant labels written with pencil in the 1930s.
    Personally, I'm happy with only water resistance. As, I just don't want my "brilliant" thoughts, ideas, obliterated, by a drop of rain, or tea....
    I guess it al this stems from our mortality and we want to leave a trace before we leave this realm....
    Though I pity the "scholar(s)" who discover my bulletproof journal in year 2200

    I believe Sketchinks and some bulletproof inks are advertised as light and waterproof.....I'm sure Essri would be quite good too then....

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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Quote Originally Posted by Yazeh View Post

    Oh, Jens. I would love to see a written sample of that one, ie. if you have one and it's no trouble. From what you describe it looks like old manuscript effect......
    Hi,

    here we go:

    How the dip pen ink changes color and density in 1min 25sec...

    01_IG_oxidation_a.jpg

    02_IG_oxidation_b.jpg

    Best
    Jens
    .................................................. .................................................. .

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/136145166@N02/albums

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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    ... some photos of aged writing samples may be interesting:

    First swap's, two years old:

    03_IG_swaps.jpg


    Writing samples,two years old, wet broad nib:

    04_IG_wet_nib.jpg


    And finally the "Bible Ink", two months old, EEF nib:

    07_B_ink.jpg

    All written on Clairefontaine paper.

    Best
    Jens


    Quote Originally Posted by SchaumburgSwan View Post
    Hi,

    also keep in mind that ESSRI is designed to loose most of it's blue when aging (I mean over months not days).
    Same for Diamine Registrar's / Akkerman #10.
    If it shades? Potentially yes, if the pen is not too wet.
    Btw. ironically I had the nicest shading with nearly rotten DRI... :-)
    Salix stays at a dark blue color, Pelikan 4001 Blue-Black is less saturated, but remains a nice blue-black.

    Best wishes
    Jens
    Last edited by SchaumburgSwan; November 2nd, 2020 at 07:51 AM.
    .................................................. .................................................. .

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/136145166@N02/albums

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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Here we go:

    On the left side you see the text from the right side written right now (age: about 10 minutes).
    On the right side you see the entry from my ink journal from spring 2013 (age: about 8 years).

    The pen used to write both samples is the same, the paper is both Clairefontaine.
    So both are absolutely comparable.

    I can see a difference in my writing with the pen.
    Gosh! Incredible how I tortured the poor pen years ago, my writing was way too heavy.
    At least I think that my writing in general improved since then.

    But color wise...... for me the there is no noticable fading, both is the same color tone.
    I´ve looked at it in detail in reality as well as in Gimp in magnification.

    So I stick to what I said previously.
    If there is no light exposure there is also no fading......
    So keep your notebooks closed

    Comparison Scabiosa 2013 - 2020 (no fading)

    (Pelikan 100N - EF ..... Rohrer & Klingner Scabiosa)

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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    ... and to complete the brown-black Gutenberg G10:

    05_G10.jpg

    Best
    Jens
    .................................................. .................................................. .

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/136145166@N02/albums

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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Wow Jens. Thank you so much.
    That is amazing...
    That ferrogallic dip pen ink looks so juicy and nice....I assume it turns black over time....
    It gives us a glimpse of monks scribbling away.....


    I see what you say about Essri and Ackerman... They look quite nice and dark.....
    And that Bibie ink has kept most of its purple. I remember when you first wrote in the Guess this ink, it turned black.... after a few days... it seems with time it has reverted to purple...

    And that Gutenberg 10, wow that looks amazing. It's funny it's sold as black, but it turns brown....

    I can understand now, why you guys are so fascinated with Iron gall inks.... Transformation while writing, and over time......

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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Ptero thanks for taking the time and posting a comparison. It took me sometime to realize that used the same pen for the same ink. It seems that over time, your handwriting has relaxed.... must be the drawing

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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Jens, your post is tempting me to get Gutenberg Urkunden, instead of Essri. Is it safe for fountain pens? And how does it behave?

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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Quote Originally Posted by Yazeh View Post
    Jens, your post is tempting me to get Gutenberg Urkunden, instead of Essri. Is it safe for fountain pens? And how does it behave?
    Hi,

    I would get both... ;-)
    Hmm, safe? Depends on your habits, pens... I use it in vintage ones with ink sacs, 14K nibs, ebonite feeds - made for such inks. No steel nibs, no ink windows.
    In my experience it is comparable safe to DRI/Akk#10 or ESSRI.
    Gutenberg themself declare it for fp's:
    https://www.laeufer-gutenberg.de/pro...%2212%22%3B%7D

    G10 is a dry ink, good water resistance, nice sepia color, not as dark as ESSRI et al.

    I hope that helps...
    Best
    Jens
    .................................................. .................................................. .

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/136145166@N02/albums

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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Quote Originally Posted by SchaumburgSwan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Yazeh View Post
    Jens, your post is tempting me to get Gutenberg Urkunden, instead of Essri. Is it safe for fountain pens? And how does it behave?
    Hi,

    I would get both... ;-)
    Hmm, safe? Depends on your habits, pens... I use it in vintage ones with ink sacs, 14K nibs, ebonite feeds - made for such inks. No steel nibs, no ink windows.
    In my experience it is comparable safe to DRI/Akk#10 or ESSRI.
    Gutenberg themself declare it for fp's:
    https://www.laeufer-gutenberg.de/pro...%2212%22%3B%7D

    G10 is a dry ink, good water resistance, nice sepia color, not as dark as ESSRI et al.

    I hope that helps...
    Best
    Jens
    Thanks Jens

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    Senior Member Yazeh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Translation as follows, curtsey of google translate:
    The exclusive Gutenberg certificate ink for fountain pens, which is still handcrafted today, is an ink for those special moments in life. The Gutenberg certificate ink penetrates the paper and becomes immortal. It is practically impossible to erase and, due to its special composition, remains insensitive to chemical erasers.

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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Dear Yazeh,

    automated translate has improved, it seems...

    Quote Originally Posted by Yazeh View Post
    Translation as follows, curtsey of google translate:
    The exclusive Gutenberg certificate ink for fountain pens, which is still handcrafted today
    I wonder who makes the G10... is there an ink lab at Läufer-Gutenberg? Or is it supplied by others like Stark's Tinte or even DeAtramentis?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yazeh View Post
    ...is an ink for those special moments in life.
    Ha! Traditional german advertising "bla"! :-)

    Greetings
    Jens
    .................................................. .................................................. .

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/136145166@N02/albums

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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Hi Jens, I ordered a Gutenberg. The price seemed slightly cheap, 9 € and no shipping fee. I got a confirmation email... So we'll see
    As for the "German"advertising..
    I guess there's a bit of lie in any advertising anyway....
    Imagine if a company said, that the following drink, would help you intake the equivalent of 14 sugar cubes and would have serious long term health effects.... but it tastes good
    The same goes for inks..
    The following ink would clog your pen, you need to invest ideally in sonic cleaner, ink flush, ink solution.....but you would be one of the few who would own it

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    Default Re: Essri vs Salix......

    Quote Originally Posted by Yazeh View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by SchaumburgSwan View Post
    Hi,

    also keep in mind that ESSRI is designed to loose most of it's blue when aging (I mean over months not days).
    Same for Diamine Registrar's / Akkerman #10.
    If it shades? Potentially yes, if the pen is not too wet.
    Btw. ironically I had the nicest shading with nearly rotten DRI... :-)
    Salix stays at a dark blue color, Pelikan 4001 Blue-Black is less saturated, but remains a nice blue-black.

    Best wishes
    Jens
    That reminds me of the Bible Ink
    when it went from purple to black. Though I had understood that Essri would copy/scan as a different colour than black for barristers/lawyers in the UK....
    I guess I have to get one and see
    Aaaaaahhhh... The serendipity of discovering new inks.

    And the sadness of the postage cost

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