Help identifying tier 3 pens

[linkoiram]

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Got this in a lot of pens for around 45 USD, can anyone identify any of these pens? Looks like a parker 51 demi special or parker 21 possibly on the left. Not sure.

[Sandy]

Assuming it is an aerometric filler, unscrew the Parker - if it a 51, it might be written on the filler itself.

The one of hte far right might be an Esterbrook or maybe a Swan? Is htere anything on the cap?

Is thefre anythin on the nibs to give us a clue?

[linkoiram]

Assuming it is an aerometric filler, unscrew the Parker - if it a 51, it might be written on the filler itself.

The one of hte far right might be an Esterbrook or maybe a Swan? Is htere anything on the cap?

Is thefre anythin on the nibs to give us a clue?

This is a picture of the listing, if I had the pens in hand it would be easier to figure out what's what. Thanks though.
Time to just wait until it comes in the mail.

[Kaputnik]

If I had to guess, I'd say that the one on the far right is a Wearever, or something on about that level. Wouldn't bet a lot on being right.

[Seattleite]

Screenshot_20201107-143528.png
Got this in a lot of pens for around 45 USD, can anyone identify any of these pens? Looks like a parker 51 demi special or parker 21 possibly on the left. Not sure.

The second from the left is interesting. My guess is oversized Moore, based on shape, size and proportion of nib, feed, section and clip. May have lost a cap band, and appears to have some built up gunk on barrel threads. I'll be curious to find out if I'm right.

I agree that pen on left looks like a Demi. Middle pen...Wearever?

finding good pens from crappy listings makes for a fun challenge.

I think that you did just fine on this one.

Bob

[linkoiram]

Screenshot_20201107-143528.png
Got this in a lot of pens for around 45 USD, can anyone identify any of these pens? Looks like a parker 51 demi special or parker 21 possibly on the left. Not sure.

The second from the left is interesting. My guess is oversized Moore, based on shape, size and proportion of nib, feed, section and clip. May have lost a cap band, and appears to have some built up gunk on barrel threads. I'll be curious to find out if I'm right.

I agree that pen on left looks like a Demi. Middle pen...Wearever?

finding good pens from crappy listings makes for a fun challenge.

I think that you did just fine on this one.

Bob

Thanks, that wasn't even the whole of the listing. Just extra stuff that got me interested. It also came with a few cross ballpoints and a parker 51 pen and pencil set That looks like it was engraved, not sure.

Sumgai?

[Seattleite]

I think that my jealousy confirms that you are the current Sumgai. May we all get the crown for a day.

Wow, that's a beautiful 51 set.

Bob

[linkoiram]

By some post office miracle it is out for deliver several days before expected. I'll post more clues about those nebulous pens on the right when they come in. It always shocks me exactly how many tier 3 american pen companies there were out there.

[linkoiram]

Update:
The red one was a "efaber" pen Co pen.
One of the blacks is a beat up esterbrook, the other is a Moore L-96 (with no cap band unfortunately), a blue wearever, and the demi 51 vac dove grey and the pen and pencil dove grey set. Engraved FJO, along with a couple of the ballpoints engraved the same.

Cross has lifetime warranty on their ballpoints? A couple of these don't work well but one of them is great. The jotter was a mechanical pencil, not a ballpoint. A little disappointing. How do I fix the discoloration from the gunk on the L-96? Doesn't seem to want to come off, may be permanent.

[Seattleite]

Hey, where's my gold star for guessing the Moore? So, the gunk is probably some old scotch tape and ink, put there to jury rig some worn threads, so that the cap would stay put. Is the pen rubber, or celluloid? Looks like celluloid, but any advice on goop removal will depend on what the pen is made of.

Nice find, as if pen is a bust, the clip, nib/section/feed are worth some bucks.

Bob

[linkoiram]

Hey, where's my gold star for guessing the Moore? So, the gunk is probably some old scotch tape and ink, put there to jury rig some worn threads, so that the cap would stay put. Is the pen rubber, or celluloid? Looks like celluloid, but any advice on goop removal will depend on what the pen is made of.

Nice find, as if pen is a bust, the clip, nib/section/feed are worth some bucks.

Bob

Celluloid. The nib is in good shape it seems, the filler bar is questionable at best, without a size 20 sac it is hard to test. I took it apart and cleaned the bar but I'm not sure whether the lever bar was actually supposed to attach to the "j bar" inside the pen and whether it corroded over time. It seems to push the bar down only slightly. Not sure if that will be enough to get a fill.

[Sailor Kenshin]

Cross ballpoint doesn't work well...in what way? They're refillable. That may be your simplest solution.

Congratulations. That is a very cool lot of pens!

[linkoiram]

Cross ballpoint doesn't work well...in what way? They're refillable. That may be your simplest solution.

Congratulations. That is a very cool lot of pens!

The twist mechanism doesn't work correctly for a couple of the pens. The silver one does not twist at all, and one of the gold ones twists but it doesn't extend the refill as far out of the "section" as it should. The ballpoint that works well twists about a half turn and stops, the other gold one that twists does not have any stop. Unfortunately cross isn't processing repairs atm.

[Seattleite]

Moore had an unconventional lever/bar/spring set up that has a pivot axis just behind the section. Kind of hard to explain, kind of a trapeze/hammock?!?, Early pens have a straight pivot, and later ones have an internal recess where a ring sits, with legs bent in to act as pivots. Both set ups function the same, IIRC. The way to check if you have the earlier version is to look about 1/2 inch behind the threads on your barrel for two little pivot holes. they should be about 90 degrees apart, their median aligned with the lever. If you don't have this, then you have the later version. In both cases, you should be able to see the front of the pressure bar supported and able to pivot along that axis, with the sprung bar holding the fill lever firmly in place. We'll go from there.

So, if pen is celluloid, and section pulled, you can try a variety of things to clean threads. Soak up to stained area in a solution of dishwasher, or a 10 % ammonia solution. If its old petroleum based adhesive, a bit of Naptha or Mineral Spirits may cut it. Finally, some sort of mineral abrasive paste and a toothbrush, may grind through it. I use a paste of water and tin oxide... pumice or rottenstone, if I want something more aggressive. I suspect, though, the the threads may be worn, so be careful. If the threads are worn, there are some solutions which involve some pretty non-trivial procedures.

Over-sized Moore flat tops are pretty grand pens... Certainly worth putting some work into.

Bob

[linkoiram]

Moore had an unconventional lever/bar/spring set up that has a pivot axis just behind the section. Kind of hard to explain, kind of a trapeze/hammock?!?, Early pens have a straight pivot, and later ones have an internal recess where a ring sits, with legs bent in to act as pivots. Both set ups function the same, IIRC. The way to check if you have the earlier version is to look about 1/2 inch behind the threads on your barrel for two little pivot holes. they should be about 90 degrees apart, their median aligned with the lever. If you don't have this, then you have the later version. In both cases, you should be able to see the front of the pressure bar supported and able to pivot along that axis, with the sprung bar holding the fill lever firmly in place. We'll go from there.

So, if pen is celluloid, and section pulled, you can try a variety of things to clean threads. Soak up to stained area in a solution of dishwasher, or a 10 % ammonia solution. If its old petroleum based adhesive, a bit of Naptha or Mineral Spirits may cut it. Finally, some sort of mineral abrasive paste and a toothbrush, may grind through it. I use a paste of water and tin oxide... pumice or rottenstone, if I want something more aggressive. I suspect, though, the the threads may be worn, so be careful. If the threads are worn, there are some solutions which involve some pretty non-trivial procedures.

Over-sized Moore flat tops are pretty grand pens... Certainly worth putting some work into.

Bob

Looks to me that the fill bar and level are disconnected and the bottom of the lever when lifted up pushes the fill bar down maybe an eighth of an inch down. The bar sits in with a ring that has the ends bent in to hold it in place, the later style I presume.

The adhesive came off easily, but the barrel has a cloudiness from it. Not sure that solvents would fix that.

[linkoiram]

Here are the results of some light polishing. There are deep marks on the top of the cap and around it so I don't think those will come out very easily. The nib flexes quite a bit, I've never had any vintage pens with flex beyond slight flex with a feathertouch 5. Not sure whether the efaber pen is worth resacing. How can I tighten loose cap bands? Alas, the glut of knowledge that is FPN is not available

[linkoiram]

Pic of the inside and with fully extended bar.

[Seattleite]

Alas, the glut of knowledge that is FPN is not available[/QUOTE]

Oh dear oh my! Sorry that I haven't been able to help. Someday, some wise sage at FPN will suggest that you can swage a cap band down. There is a restoration expert who visits both sites who even offers the service. The Faber is not worth the effort, but the Moore sounds like it might be. A big flexible nib in a vintage pen is a rare treat.... Might as well protect the cap lip from splits and make the pen look good.

Bob

[linkoiram]

Alas, the glut of knowledge that is FPN is not available

Oh dear oh my! Sorry that I haven't been able to help. Someday, some wise sage at FPN will suggest that you can swage a cap band down. There is a restoration expert who visits both sites who even offers the service. The Faber is not worth the effort, but the Moore sounds like it might be. A big flexible nib in a vintage pen is a rare treat.... Might as well protect the cap lip from splits and make the pen look good.

Bob[/QUOTE]
If only the Moore came with the cap band...

[Seattleite]

Yes, I noted that the Moore lacked a band, and described the process for squeezing one down into the recess.

Sounds like you might consider sourcing a donor cap with a band of suitable width and diameter, or not.

Carry on,

Bob