FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

[tde44]

Silverlifter wrote:

FWIW, one of the universities here is now offering COBOL as part of its CSI degree, because the banks are still running those legacy systems and the engineers who maintain them are either retiring or punching out. Those few that are left are pulling salaries that make their bosses wince...

Wow. And "wow" again. I remember the great "Y2K" scramble, when companies hunted up retired COBOL guys (trained when nearly all programmers were men) and threw them at all the mainframe - COBOL systems. So it's happening again?

Back in "my day" I wrote and maintained applications in COBOL, PL/I, FORTRAN (IV), Assembler, etc. then went on to C, C+, C#, JAVA/Script, etc. They were all just languages and techniques to learn, the fundamentals were all the same. The greater challenges were to make sure the results were accurate, proper checks performed, and in the PC/Web world the user experience.

Of course, in my day a large disk drive was 30 Mb, the size of a washing machine, required 3-phase power, and had to be in a computer room.

Now I need to get some coffee and my fountain pen.

[pajaro]

I think FPN does a pretty decent job considering I pay little for using the site. They store a lot of graphics. They probably don't spend the millions we used to have to spend on a system, software and database management system conversion every few years. Not to mention all the time users spent testing. All the retraining of IT and departmental people. Costs went on and on.

[Farmboy]

Like I said before, I am amused at the judgements of those who have no idea what the back end of FPN is like, and how complicated it is. I've was watching discussions with moderators before the upgrade went to plan B. Wim works in IT. There are major changes in the hosting software that make a lot of what was used to make the board function rendered obsolete, some of which was no longer supported. All of those things have to be upgraded or replaced, and configured, while preserving the information it contains. Simply converting files takes time. For an idea of scale, IIRC Wim said that they get 5000 images a month in just the sales areas, not to mention all of the reviews and other images. Its not a commercial business or site - its one that was created for the benefit of the pen community. It costs money to run it, and money to pay people to do the tech stuff. The moderators are all volunteers. Maybe posting thanks for all the work when it is up and running instead of grousing would be worth considering.

It still seems to me that the majority of the customization, problems, and effort is centered around sales posts in the classifieds. I've certainly noticed an uptick in the number of 'sales' posts here from new or low post count users since FPN went on a break.

An occasional sales post is easy to ignore but seems that the volume has really become to much for a 'essentially free with expenses' platform to manage. Perhaps it is time to drop it or split it off as a separate site.

[linkoiram]

Is it tomorrow morning yet? /s

[XYZZY]

It still seems to me that the majority of the customization, problems, and effort is centered around sales posts in the classifieds. I've certainly noticed an uptick in the number of 'sales' posts here from new or low post count users since FPN went on a break.

An occasional sales post is easy to ignore but seems that the volume has really become to much for a 'essentially free with expenses' platform to manage. Perhaps it is time to drop it or split it off as a separate site.

I'm doubt that quantity of classifieds is the issue. My understanding is that they're upgrading from to the latest version of invision, which was a complete rewrite from the previous version of invision, which implies that the add-ons don't simply copy over. I think somebody said that FPN had over fifty add-ons, and I would assume that not all of them are still supported.

Besides the classifieds on FPN, there's lots of additional stuff for supporting contributors of different sorts, buying the occasional sponsored ink, etc. Since they haven't had a sponsored ink in a while that might be a good example of add-ons to not bother with.

I also recall that in the classifieds section on FPN that there's a historical archive. I assume that's from a past upgrade where they switched the classifieds engine, the older stuff was not compatible but deemed valuable enough to keep. There's no reason that can't be done again. And classifieds are a common enough thing I would assume there are options available.

[pajaro]

Maybe I should look for opportunities to do COBOL. I used to enjoy it.

[Ray-VIgo]

The lesson from this that I took away is that an effort should be made to archive and separate the Repair forum at FPN from the rest of the board.

[pajaro]

The lesson from this that I took away is that an effort should be made to archive and separate the Repair forum at FPN from the rest of the board. Frankly, I'd love to see a free-standing fountain pen repair forum that's apart from FPG and FPN. The idea would be to take the archives of FPN Repair, FPG Repair, and maybe the old Repair area of Lion & Pen and put them together in a single website/forum that is dedicated to repair. That way if something like FPN or FPG goes down, the material is not lost.

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This is a good idea. There is some repair oriented data in the brand forums also, and some of that might be valuable.

[Jon Szanto]

The lesson from this that I took away is that an effort should be made to archive and separate the Repair forum at FPN from the rest of the board. Frankly, I'd love to see a free-standing fountain pen repair forum that's apart from FPG and FPN. The idea would be to take the archives of FPN Repair, FPG Repair, and maybe the old Repair area of Lion & Pen and put them together in a single website/forum that is dedicated to repair. That way if something like FPN or FPG goes down, the material is not lost.

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This is a good idea. There is some repair oriented data in the brand forums also, and some of that might be valuable.

This would require the permission of the people involved in all those posts. Not saying it isn't a grand idea, but collating information from multiple sites is not the same as people signing up for an account at a particular site and agreeing to have their posts become public. Just saying that there may be issues.

[Ron Z]

I will be honest. The thought scares me. There is an awful lot of really bad information there too. It seems that I spend an awful lot of time saying, "....ah, you may not want to do that," or something to that effect. Sometimes its just plain wrong, and when you try to correct, no matter how gently, you get torched.

Depth of experience does count, but an awful lot of newbies repair a couple of pens, and the next thing you know they're making videos. The experienced guys are much more hesitant to do that because they know how easy it is to screw things up, or how many things are hiding, just waiting to take a chunk out of your tuckus. I talked about this with Jim Marshall at a pen show. A good, accurate video takes a lot of planning and work, which is why it rarely gets done. Same thing with advice on a pen board... On the other hand, I want to help people to avoid making the same mistakes that I have, so I share a lot of what I have learned.

I'm also selective about what I post, and where I post it. I may not (likely not) be willing to have the information posted elsewhere, and/or without proper attribution or permission.

[Sailor Kenshin]

Videos did help us when we started re-saccing pens; I went from 'It's scary! What do all those numbers mean?' to! 'This is certainly possible.'

But I'd never make a pen repair video. I'm no expert. We've done about 25 pens, strictly for our own use, ranging from Esterbrooks and Osmiroids to one PFM. When we get one writing it makes us happy.

[Chuck Naill]

While I used to sweat making a pen work, I no longer sweat it. 🤎

[Ron Z]

Videos did help us when we started re-saccing pens; I went from 'It's scary! What do all those numbers mean?' to! 'This is certainly possible.'

But I'd never make a pen repair video. I'm no expert. We've done about 25 pens, strictly for our own use, ranging from Esterbrooks and Osmiroids to one PFM. When we get one writing it makes us happy.

Ah, but you are a rational, reasonable individual. Some would say that I don't fit into that category, but I've never made a repair video.

[Ole Juul]

I don't think repair information is the most important. Historical information sometimes is unique and can't easily be found elsewhere, or recreated.

[Farmboy]

Ron said “tuckas”.

In addition to what Ron said is the absence from the forums of a number of well established repair people and highly knowledgeable members of the community. Some have come snd gone, others just looked and left.

Personally I enjoy being told how to fix a 51 ...

[Sailor Kenshin]

Videos did help us when we started re-saccing pens; I went from 'It's scary! What do all those numbers mean?' to! 'This is certainly possible.'

But I'd never make a pen repair video. I'm no expert. We've done about 25 pens, strictly for our own use, ranging from Esterbrooks and Osmiroids to one PFM. When we get one writing it makes us happy.

Ah, but you are a rational, reasonable individual. Some would say that I don't fit into that category, but I've never made a repair video.

Rational, me?

[Ron Z]

Ron said “tuckas”.

In addition to what Ron said is the absence from the forums of a number of well established repair people and highly knowledgeable members of the community. Some have come snd gone, others just looked and left.

Personally I enjoy being told how to fix a 51 ...

Have you ever read Bloom County?

Actually, the "a" should have been a "U".

[Farmboy]

Ron said “tuckas”.

In addition to what Ron said is the absence from the forums of a number of well established repair people and highly knowledgeable members of the community. Some have come snd gone, others just looked and left.

Personally I enjoy being told how to fix a 51 ...

Have you ever read Bloom County?

Actually, the "a" should have been a "U".

Yeah read the entire series. I was sad to see it end. I just thought it was funny you said it. My grandmother said it now and then, something like "Don't let the cold get you in the tuckus and wear a coat"

[Ron Z]

That is my favorite cartoon strip. I have several of the books, and still laugh at them. He's still doing the strip, which you can find on line. His series with Opus and Shroedinger's cat is classic. Come to think of it, so is the series where Donald Trump and Bill the Cat's brains are swapped.

[Jon Szanto]

Come to think of it, so is the series where Donald Trump and Bill the Cat's brains are swapped.

Could they notice any difference?