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Thread: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Funny, I'd never heard of FPN until people started griping about it here. lol

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    Senior Member Jon Szanto's Avatar
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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Quote Originally Posted by Pterodactylus View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by bunyip View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Pterodactylus View Post
    <snip>
    Personally I say fuck you FPN, with all the censorship, the commercialization, the ads, the iron fisted moderation, the disgusting mods with their almighty fantasies (Baby Hitlers as Chrissy described).

    ... this should be about attracting and inform people ...
    Are you quite certain you have your messaging right?
    Yes Sir, Iím sure.
    I just want to be very clear: you don't speak for me, and your attitude regarding this forum does not reflect mine. I can't absolutely vouch for the entire forum, either, but I doubt your one-sided approach is shared by a majority, and you do harm to this community when you go this far.

    Your personal choice, your particular enmity towards FPN, is your right and I certainly uphold and validate it. Your assertion that this forum exists as one big "Fuck You" to FPN or any other arena is completely out of line, and an insult to my way of wanting people of similar interests to interact.

    I would ask you to not speak for the entire community, at the very least.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Quote Originally Posted by Pterodactylus View Post
    My message for FPN in one simple sketch instead of text form:
    It's, um... do you have it turned the wrong way?

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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Calm down, Ptero. You're overdoing it!

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    Senior Member Pterodactylus's Avatar
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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Szanto View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Pterodactylus View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by bunyip View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Pterodactylus View Post
    <snip>
    Personally I say fuck you FPN, with all the censorship, the commercialization, the ads, the iron fisted moderation, the disgusting mods with their almighty fantasies (Baby Hitlers as Chrissy described).

    ... this should be about attracting and inform people ...
    Are you quite certain you have your messaging right?
    Yes Sir, Iím sure.
    I just want to be very clear: you don't speak for me, and your attitude regarding this forum does not reflect mine. I can't absolutely vouch for the entire forum, either, but I doubt your one-sided approach is shared by a majority, and you do harm to this community when you go this far.

    Your personal choice, your particular enmity towards FPN, is your right and I certainly uphold and validate it. Your assertion that this forum exists as one big "Fuck You" to FPN or any other arena is completely out of line, and an insult to my way of wanting people of similar interests to interact.

    I would ask you to not speak for the entire community, at the very least.
    Jon, whatís up?

    I stated clearly that this is my personal opinion, I do not speak for somebody else, a community or you.

    Understood and clear enough?

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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    I love FPGeeks and FPN. I hope FPN is able to resolve their IT issues; I canít imagine how frustrating the last couple weeks have been, especially when the site is largely managed on a volunteer basis.

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  13. #247
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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Quote Originally Posted by Pterodactylus View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by bunyip View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Pterodactylus View Post
    <snip>
    Personally I say fuck you FPN, with all the censorship, the commercialization, the ads, the iron fisted moderation, the disgusting mods with their almighty fantasies (Baby Hitlers as Chrissy described).

    ... this should be about attracting and inform people ...
    Are you quite certain you have your messaging right?
    Yes Sir, Iím sure.
    ...
    Sorry if you donít like it.
    I'm sorry you are not reading what people write (and somewhat facetiously in that case) rather than what you want to read. I neither liked nor disliked anything, nor did I raise evidence but messaging. That is, not your opinion but how you are going about purporting to welcome people.

    Your approach which appears to be "I'm a hater, you are welcome here" does not sell particularly well outside some evangelistic circles.

    As others have expressed, I will go to a forum based on a blend of what it provides, will even go to two or more on the same subject and thus am never excited by tribalism.

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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Odin has requested refugee status. He claims he was set up by a raccoon and is innocent...

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  17. #249
    Senior Member Jon Szanto's Avatar
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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Quote Originally Posted by Pterodactylus View Post
    Yes I think both forums are competitors, itˋs like David against Goliath.

    We here has to try to attract as many former, current and future FPN users as we can.
    As for the most itˋs either participating mainly here or there.

    We give the pariah a new home disgraced there since years.
    Our ink reviews are better and well organized as Chrissy pointed out.
    We have also very helpful, skillful and knowledgeable people here supporting and trying to help new users.
    We have very courageous people reviewing inks, people hosting community games like the mystery ink, an active art group, some pen making guys, supportive guys for pen repairs questions, pen reviews and brand focus subsections.

    So we have a lot to offer even being much smaller.

    This thread shouldnít be about to countdown the return of FPN, this should be about attracting and inform people who are temporary here as long as they are down, to welcome them and convince them to stay.
    Quote Originally Posted by Pterodactylus View Post
    I stated clearly that this is my personal opinion, I do not speak for somebody else, a community or you.

    Understood and clear enough?
    In the quote I put first, it is clear that you are taking the stance that you are speaking for the group as a whole - if not, who else would we be? And I get that the personal vitriol you feel towards FPN is just that: personal. But you might take a step back and look at your overall presentation and impression, as I don't think I'm the only person that sees the "us vs. them" undercurrent, and as I've stated previously in the thread, I don't have any interest in a competition.

    My heart and home are here on FPG, and the existence of other sites doesn't diminish that at all. If anyone wants this place to grow, I'd suggest it will happen best with positive and engaged content, not regular trashing of other forums and activities.

    That's just my take on it.
    Last edited by Jon Szanto; November 21st, 2020 at 05:05 PM.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Szanto View Post

    Quote Originally Posted by Pterodactylus View Post
    I stated clearly that this is my personal opinion, I do not speak for somebody else, a community or you.

    Understood and clear enough?
    4

    In the quote I put first, it is clear that you are taking the stance that you are speaking for the group as a whole - if not, who else would we be? And I get that the personal vitriol you feel towards FPN is just that: personal. But you might take a step back and look at your overall presentation and impression, as I don't think I'm the only person that sees the "us vs. them" undercurrent, and as I've stated previously in the thread, I don't have any interest in a competition.

    My heart and home are here on FPG, and the existence of other sites doesn't diminish that at all. If anyone wants this place to grow, I'd suggest it will happen best with positive and engaged content, not regular trashing of other forums and activities.

    That's just my take on it.
    This is too stupid for me.

    Iím also an active member and part of the community here, when I talk about what FPG has to offer of course I say WE.
    What else?

    Do you think you are the only one who feel as part of this community?
    Do you state that Iím not part of this community?
    I spent also countless hours here and tried to make this a nice attractive place for everyone.
    You are no mod here, normally I respect your posts and inputs, but you are not a bigger part of the community here than others.
    If I can not use WE as part of this community you canít either!

    When I stated my personal opinion about FPN I stated this clearly.

    Many of US faced ugly experiences on FPN and itís not up to you to decide if I or others are allowed to share our experiences with FPN.
    And itís also not up to you to decide if Iím allowed to articulate my personal opinion about FPN.

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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Well, at least on FPN this thread would be closed by now. Some moderation has its advantages.

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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Quote Originally Posted by TSherbs View Post
    Well, at least on FPN this thread would be closed by now. Some moderation has its advantages.
    Yes for sure, I also miss a good moderator.

    And you are wrong this thread would already have been censored and deleted a long time ago,

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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Ok then. Have a good weekend, everyone.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Quote Originally Posted by Pterodactylus View Post
    I spent also countless hours here and tried to make this a nice attractive place for everyone.
    ÖčsnipõÖ
    And itís also not up to you to decide if Iím allowed to articulate my personal opinion about FPN.
    For all the time and effort you allegedly Ďspentí on FPGeeks to make this a nice attractive place for everyone, you managed to undo all the supposed benefit and then some, with just a few outbursts of naked disdain and hatred that is all of your own choice and your own doing, that nobody else in the community here demands of you, in my opinion.

    I can see you like to showcase your handwriting and drawings, and that's great, but it just isn't the type of thing fountain pen enthusiasts search for in Google. I think you're compelled to seek an audience for your expression and your venting, more than budding and seasoned hobbyists alike are driven to find contributed content that propels their acquisition and enjoyment of fountain pens and paraphernalia.

    I'm not judging you, I don't care what's between you and FPN (or Wim personally), but I'll say that your sentiments and feelings on the matter are frankly of no concern to everyone else, and your expression of such offer no benefit to the site. Please don't try to make your pain and hatred more relevant to anyone else by insistently making the environment on FPGeeks look toxic, especially to anyone who don't feel they have been wronged, snubbed or let down by FPN ó they don't share your experience and sentiments, and I hope they never do. If you want to dwell on them, then please dwell on them alone; and if you must express them again and again in comments here, then others may be equally compelled to pushback and build a wall around you so you can savour the echoes of your ranting as an outlier on your own.

    Don't mistaken this for praise for FPN, by the way.
    Caring is a source of great motivation. Not caring is a source of great freedom.

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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    ...and in the midst of it all:

    I would like to sincerely thank Jon Szanto for creating this thread.

    Of course, in our current world, refugees are often fleeing terror, war and atrocity far worse than any of us will ever experience (we hope).
    When we lose our home, we are truly lost - and when someone offers us a place of refuge, how can we ever express our gratitude?
    It's what we should all do for each other, as a matter of course, regardless of our circumstances.

    This is a trifle, in comparison. We are fountain pen lovers, that's all.
    But, the principle is the same. And to offer open arms to the needy, is a gift beyond measure.
    So, thank you.

    Stay safe, all.
    Best wishes, CS

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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    I have heard it said that anytime we lower ourselves to the level of using expletives or shouting, we have lost the argument, right or wrong. At that point, our point doesn't matter.

    Believe me, I have had to eat my own vitriol and foul verbal vomit many times, and it has never made me ill to do so. Factually, it has a healing nature to it.

    Have a great weekend all, and may your pens all be superb and your ink uncloudy!

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  33. #257
    Senior Member Jon Szanto's Avatar
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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    CS,

    Quote Originally Posted by CS388 View Post
    But, the principle is the same. And to offer open arms to the needy, is a gift beyond measure.
    I'm not certain I can adequately express my humble thanks for this post. I've had a very difficult time with many of the things occurring in the world at the moment, in the last weeks and months, and am unsure if my motivations and actions are still sound. You give me hope that I haven't totally lost my way, and that my desires for all of us in a troubled era still resonate.

    You have my gratitude.

    Best,
    Jon
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Quote Originally Posted by Bisquitlips View Post
    I have heard it said that anytime we lower ourselves to the level of using expletives or shouting, we have lost the argument, right or wrong. At that point, our point doesn't matter. ...
    True.

    I am reminded of something I learned a very long time ago. That is; having anger at someone or something is essentially allowing that person or thing to worm his/her/its way into your psyche and take control of you. The anger becomes a focal point of one's thinking, consuming one's energy and time. It festers like an abscess, and infects one's emotional well-being. And yet, it solves nothing.

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  37. #259
    Senior Member Pterodactylus's Avatar
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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Quote Originally Posted by A Smug Dill View Post
    I can see you like to showcase your handwriting and drawings, and that's great, but it just isn't the type of thing fountain pen enthusiasts search for in Google. I think you're compelled to seek an audience for your expression and your venting, more than budding and seasoned hobbyists alike are driven to find contributed content that propels their acquisition and enjoyment of fountain pens and paraphernalia.
    Interesting point of view.
    Are you a psychiatrist?

    True my focus is using pens, they are tools which has to be used and mastered.

    I own a nice collection of mostly vintage pens.
    Compared to the average I think my collection is quite big.
    Compared to some it might be small.

    I enjoy in particular flexible nibs.

    I see myself not as collector, Iím a user.
    I enjoy well made, high quality tools.
    But in opposite to collectors I think a tool without usage is not worth owning it.

    I donít get my satisfaction from just starring at tools, not making use it.
    For me itˋs not about owning things (and might hardly can make more use out of it than with a BIC ballpoint).
    But I respect also collectors, itís just not my entry to the hobby.

    E.g. I introduced the EMF modification and brought it to the community that folks can enjoy better affordable flex on modern pens.
    I tried to answer countless questions over the years, enjoyed the company of many pen enthusiasts and had great discussions.

    So I see myself as pen enthusiast, interested in the hardware, their modification, servicing and repairing vintage pens, the use of these tools (drawing and writing), papers, inks, meeting - presenting and discussing all these things with people all over the world sharing these interests.
    I think Iím amongst the most active members here on FPG over the last years (not only showcasing myself)

    So donˋt play the hobby psychiatrist and claim to know me and my motivations.

    And your claims what a typical pen hobbyist is interested or not might also only reflect your personal view.
    Last edited by Pterodactylus; November 22nd, 2020 at 03:12 AM.

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  39. #260
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    Default Re: FPG Refuges Status Area: The 2020 FPN Diaspora

    Quote Originally Posted by A Smug Dill View Post
    For all the time and effort you allegedly Ďspentí on FPGeeks to make this a nice attractive place for everyone, you managed to undo all the supposed benefit and then some, with just a few outbursts of naked disdain and hatred that is all of your own choice and your own doing, that nobody else in the community here demands of you, in my opinion.

    I can see you like to showcase your handwriting and drawings, and that's great, but it just isn't the type of thing fountain pen enthusiasts search for in Google. I think you're compelled to seek an audience for your expression and your venting, more than budding and seasoned hobbyists alike are driven to find contributed content that propels their acquisition and enjoyment of fountain pens and paraphernalia.

    I'm not judging you, I don't care what's between you and FPN (or Wim personally), but I'll say that your sentiments and feelings on the matter are frankly of no concern to everyone else, and your expression of such offer no benefit to the site. Please don't try to make your pain and hatred more relevant to anyone else by insistently making the environment on FPGeeks look toxic, especially to anyone who don't feel they have been wronged, snubbed or let down by FPN ó they don't share your experience and sentiments, and I hope they never do. If you want to dwell on them, then please dwell on them alone; and if you must express them again and again in comments here, then others may be equally compelled to pushback and build a wall around you so you can savour the echoes of your ranting as an outlier on your own.

    Don't mistaken this for praise for FPN, by the way.
    I know it's possible, even easy, to take the advice you gave, and sometimes members go too far in their expressions of their own feelings. Threads like this one that attract the most vociferous members also often deteriorate like this one has. Once that happens they do no favours to FPGeeks and are even more likely to send new and old members away than to encourage anyone to come here.

    We have an "Ignore function" on FPG just like FPN does and in times like this more and more members go to their Settings and Edit their ignore lists. This feature works particularly well.
    Regards, Chrissy | My Blog: inkyfountainpens

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