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Thread: It is done...

  1. #1
    Senior Member Detman101's Avatar
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    Smile It is done...

    I have finally taken the plunge into "Vintage" territory.
    I'm hoping and praying that it lives up to everything you all have said it is and that my skepticism was all in error. I've been trying to recreate what I've been told the vintage flex experience is with no firsthand knowledge or experience with vintage flex pens. If that isn't the definition of insanity...it's certainly the definition of stupidity.

    13NOV20-It is done.JPG

    I've spoken with the proprietor via email and have been recommended this pen over the Waterman 515 (Stock#3167).
    I think I'll do better starting out with an eyedropper, as recommended by the wise proprietor of "GoodWriters".
    This is my first foray into the deep end of the pool...praying it goes swimmingly.

    Thank you...and apologies...to all who tolerated my insolence, ignorance, horrid attitude and generally dismal demeanor.
    You tried to tell me...over and over...and I kept on beating my thick skull against the wall expecting it to fall down.
    You were right...the wall doesn't move and I've only a bloody head to show for my efforts.

    This pen will be the first bandage...
    "I can only improve my self, not the world."

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    Senior Member guyy's Avatar
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    Default Re: It is done...

    Here’s hoping it’s all you want it to be.

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    Default Re: It is done...

    Deb is a good person and a good seller. If things don't turn out consider the problem just might not be with the pen or the seller. There is an old saying in golf, "you can't buy a better golf game". And "perfect is for beginners".

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    Default Re: It is done...

    I provide additional advice for people unused to vintage pens and also for eyedropper fillers. I think it should work out well.

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    Default Re: It is done...

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Naill View Post
    Deb is a good person and a good seller. If things don't turn out consider the problem just might not be with the pen or the seller.
    There is an old saying in golf, "you can't buy a better golf game". And "perfect is for beginners".
    Of that, I am certain...Thank you sir.
    In this instance, blaming the tool or seller is not an option. If it is meant to be for me, it will work. If not, it will be kept for historical and beauty purposes (It's soooo pretty!!!).
    Deb has been a pleasure and enlightening encounter with every email I've spoken to her through. She has even helped me to understand how Ebay works, and how to use it!! (I had no idea how auctions work)

    I have a looooooong way to go before I can claim to know a-n-y-t-h-i-n-g about these pens properly.
    It's been a set of coursework comparable to high school level physics, chemistry and science just getting to understand how these fountain pens work.
    I'm certain this pen has had previous owners that have worked marvels with it, I'm a baby in comparison.
    Last edited by Detman101; November 16th, 2020 at 07:22 AM.
    "I can only improve my self, not the world."

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    Default Re: It is done...

    Quote Originally Posted by eachan View Post
    I provide additional advice for people unused to vintage pens and also for eyedropper fillers. I think it should work out well.
    Of eyedroppers, I am mildly familiar.
    Of vintage pens...I am completely uninitiated and unfamiliar.
    As excited as I am for this pen to arrive...I am also as nervous.

    If it does work out well, will I ever be the same?
    It's almost like when I fell in love with my wife...
    inside, I didn't believe anyone as beautiful as she is would/could like a curmudgeon like me.
    I very nearly didn't go forward out of lazy fear that I would have to be a better person for her.
    Thankfully I left my cave behind and almost 20 years later, happiness endures...and I'm a better man for it.

    I hope to tell close to the same tale about this pen someday...
    "I can only improve my self, not the world."

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    Default Re: It is done...

    If you think of it as a journey it can be a pleasant one, in both realms. Pens do offer some room to explore Polygamy that may-well prove awkward for most matrimonial situations. Always wondered how some guy (isn't always the guy) would bring the subject up. Its hard enough to say "look at this nice little new pen I picked up. Isn't she pretty? Flexible, too! Can't wait to get her into the rotation."

    Anyway, one thing that I have found, by sharing many of my old flexible vintage pens with users less familiar, is that mostly, people find them easier to approach than they expected. There is a lot of chat-room hype out there. A decent vintage flexer can sometimes handle a bit more omni-directional tine displacement when writing than one would expect. Back in the earlier days of 2020, when people used to breathe on each other, I would try to make sure that I always had a few different flex-nibbed oldies for folks at our pen club to try. I observed that most people can pretty quickly get the feel for normal use with a smooth one, then learn how to add some pressure and try longer tines and finer tipping. This said, most of us can easily start, explore and enjoy the journey. Just be flexible.
    .
    Bob

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    Default Re: It is done...

    Quote Originally Posted by Seattleite View Post
    If you think of it as a journey it can be a pleasant one, in both realms. Pens do offer some room to explore Polygamy that may-well prove awkward for most matrimonial situations. Always wondered how some guy (isn't always the guy) would bring the subject up. Its hard enough to say "look at this nice little new pen I picked up. Isn't she pretty? Flexible, too! Can't wait to get her into the rotation."

    Anyway, one thing that I have found, by sharing many of my old flexible vintage pens with users less familiar, is that mostly, people find them easier to approach than they expected. There is a lot of chat-room hype out there. A decent vintage flexer can sometimes handle a bit more omni-directional tine displacement when writing than one would expect. Back in the earlier days of 2020, when people used to breathe on each other, I would try to make sure that I always had a few different flex-nibbed oldies for folks at our pen club to try. I observed that most people can pretty quickly get the feel for normal use with a smooth one, then learn how to add some pressure and try longer tines and finer tipping. This said, most of us can easily start, explore and enjoy the journey. Just be flexible.
    .
    Bob
    Hehehehe...I see what you did there.
    I will definitely remain flexible. Since almost the start of my fountain pen journey earlier this year, I've been making my pens into modern flex-pens with parts from vendors such as kanwrite, FPR and FNF. It's been a learning experience and I am loving my results, but the lure of the vintage experience has baited me from day one. I've become one of the "Pen-Polygamists" when I originally intended to have one pen do everything I needed (Impossible at worst and highly unlikely at best).

    Today, in a local antique shop, I found my first examples of older fountain pens that were not mine EVER! This is the first time that I have physically seen other fountain pens in my entire life.
    THEY WERE SO SMALL!!!
    Literally, Esterbrooks, Wahls, Wearevers and Sheaffers...all less than 5 inches in length with the majority of them being closer to 3.5 inches!! The nibs were half the size of a modern #5 and the feeds were like toothpicks!
    Did people of past times have smaller hands?

    I considered buying all of them for the $60 asked and reselling them on Ebay.
    I may still. it would be a simple task to clean them up and get them sale-ready.
    "I can only improve my self, not the world."

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    Default Re: It is done...

    I am looking forward to the weekend and seeing my collection again. This past weekend was too busy moving the stuff from the PODS into the new abode. This thread reminds me of the Conway Stewart 84 Deb restored and sent my way.

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    Senior Member VertOlive's Avatar
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    Default Re: It is done...

    I hope your “new” vintage pen makes a little bit of 2020 right again ! 😉
    "Nolo esse salus sine vobis ...” —St. Augustine

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    Default Re: It is done...

    Quote Originally Posted by Detman101 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Seattleite View Post
    If you think of it as a journey it can be a pleasant one, in both realms. Pens do offer some room to explore Polygamy that may-well prove awkward for most matrimonial situations. Always wondered how some guy (isn't always the guy) would bring the subject up. Its hard enough to say "look at this nice little new pen I picked up. Isn't she pretty? Flexible, too! Can't wait to get her into the rotation."

    Anyway, one thing that I have found, by sharing many of my old flexible vintage pens with users less familiar, is that mostly, people find them easier to approach than they expected. There is a lot of chat-room hype out there. A decent vintage flexer can sometimes handle a bit more omni-directional tine displacement when writing than one would expect. Back in the earlier days of 2020, when people used to breathe on each other, I would try to make sure that I always had a few different flex-nibbed oldies for folks at our pen club to try. I observed that most people can pretty quickly get the feel for normal use with a smooth one, then learn how to add some pressure and try longer tines and finer tipping. This said, most of us can easily start, explore and enjoy the journey. Just be flexible.
    .
    Bob
    Hehehehe...I see what you did there.
    I will definitely remain flexible. Since almost the start of my fountain pen journey earlier this year, I've been making my pens into modern flex-pens with parts from vendors such as kanwrite, FPR and FNF. It's been a learning experience and I am loving my results, but the lure of the vintage experience has baited me from day one. I've become one of the "Pen-Polygamists" when I originally intended to have one pen do everything I needed (Impossible at worst and highly unlikely at best).

    Today, in a local antique shop, I found my first examples of older fountain pens that were not mine EVER! This is the first time that I have physically seen other fountain pens in my entire life.
    THEY WERE SO SMALL!!!
    Literally, Esterbrooks, Wahls, Wearevers and Sheaffers...all less than 5 inches in length with the majority of them being closer to 3.5 inches!! The nibs were half the size of a modern #5 and the feeds were like toothpicks!
    Did people of past times have smaller hands?

    I considered buying all of them for the $60 asked and reselling them on Ebay.
    I may still. it would be a simple task to clean them up and get them sale-ready.
    No, people did not have smaller hands years ago. The prevalence of the very large pen is a modern development. Of course there always were larger pens but most pens were 13 cm or so. The imagined correlation between hand size and pen size is modern too. You only have to watch a builder with hands like shovels scribbling an estimate with a tiny stub of a pencil to realise that it doesn't always hold true. There are extremes which are uncomfortable for extended periods of writing, of course. Equally, the hugely over-large pens one sees occasionally might do for a signature but that's it. It would be churlish to suggest that they exist to compensate for other shortcomings so I won't do that.

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    Default Re: It is done...

    Ever heard of the violin vertuoso, Itzhak Perlman? Large hand and meaty fingers, and contracted polio
    at age four.

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    Default Re: It is done...

    Good luck Detman!

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    Default Re: It is done...

    Quote Originally Posted by manoeuver View Post
    Good luck Detman!
    Thank you!!
    "I can only improve my self, not the world."

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    Default Re: It is done...

    Quote Originally Posted by Detman101 View Post
    Today, in a local antique shop, I found my first examples of older fountain pens that were not mine EVER! This is the first time that I have physically seen other fountain pens in my entire life.
    THEY WERE SO SMALL!!!
    Literally, Esterbrooks, Wahls, Wearevers and Sheaffers...all less than 5 inches in length with the majority of them being closer to 3.5 inches!! The nibs were half the size of a modern #5 and the feeds were like toothpicks!
    Did people of past times have smaller hands?
    I hear this from time to time, but over the time that I've spent and across many people that I have interacted with in this hobby, this is not an issue at all.

    I have met people with large hands who like small pens. And really, what is considered small today were normal back then.

    I think (and I heard it from a presentation either at a pen show or at the pen club) that the size of the pen in the past may have been a factor in manufacturing's material cost.
    Imagine if you are Parker, having to produce 1 million pens a year, shaving off 1/4 of an inch can make a big difference in the amount of material that you have to buy.

    Today, even Pilot doesn't have to make nearly that many fountain pens. So the size of the pen, which can easily be marketed as "the bigger the better", have no opposition from manufacturing because it won't make that much difference between 6 inches capped vs 5. Look how much Sailor is pricing their KoP at.

    And it seems like, at the custom, handmade level, making a very good smaller pen is more difficult than larger ones. I see this from the custom pens that people showed me, they are large for the most part.
    - Will
    Unique and restored vintage pens: Redeem Pens

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    Default Re: It is done...

    Quote Originally Posted by penwash View Post
    And it seems like, at the custom, handmade level, making a very good smaller pen is more difficult than larger ones. I see this from the custom pens that people showed me, they are large for the most part.
    I recall reading that Gama (iirc) decided to stop making their smaller pens because the amount of work was the same and therefore most of the cost, but customers tend to expect a smaller pen to be cheaper. Not so good for profit margins. Perhaps custom makers feel the same pricing constraints, in addition to smaller pens simply being trickier to execute.
    In the words of Paul Simon, you can call me Al.

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    Default Re: It is done...

    I think this is a general trend in modern times. Smaller was considered more sophisticated at one time. Looking at wrist watches, we see 35mm, even 30mm, for men's wrist watches in the 40's and 50's. Now we get more 40mm watches (even 45mm sometimes!) - which would have been outrageous in the past. I think people like to show off what they've spent their money on. In any case, that's the vagaries of fashion.

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    Default Re: It is done...

    Welp...pen is stuck in Baltimore for over a week now with three other packages I had incoming from all over the country.
    Baltimore Maryland is apparently a black hole that eats deliveries with it's ineptitude and incompetence.
    Every single package stopped progress when it arrived at that godforsaken pit of evil.
    "I can only improve my self, not the world."

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    Default Re: It is done...

    Quote Originally Posted by Detman101 View Post
    Welp...pen is stuck in Baltimore for over a week now with three other packages I had incoming from all over the country.
    Baltimore Maryland is apparently a black hole that eats deliveries with it's ineptitude and incompetence.
    Every single package stopped progress when it arrived at that godforsaken pit of evil.
    I lived there for 10 years, which were mostly pretty good.
    I find your description of one of our oldest, noblest cities....
    accurate.

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    Default Re: It is done...

    Quote Originally Posted by manoeuver View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Detman101 View Post
    Welp...pen is stuck in Baltimore for over a week now with three other packages I had incoming from all over the country.
    Baltimore Maryland is apparently a black hole that eats deliveries with it's ineptitude and incompetence.
    Every single package stopped progress when it arrived at that godforsaken pit of evil.
    I lived there for 10 years, which were mostly pretty good.
    I find your description of one of our oldest, noblest cities....
    accurate.
    Thank you!
    Trust me, I'm being nice.
    There are MANY worse things I desire to say about that city but in trying to remain as civil as possible...Im holding my tongue.
    "I can only improve my self, not the world."

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