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Thread: Countdown until the maniac is gone

  1. #81
    Senior Member welch's Avatar
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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    Rush to "smear" Trump and his attempt to overthrow democracy in the United States? That is laughable. You, dneal, must have read many of the decisions in which Trump presented all the evidence he, and his cult, could find that the election was "stolen". Over and over, and in every case, Trump's claims were considered and dismissed. Often, as in the case before Judge Brann in Pennsylvania, Trump's lawyers admitted that they could justify no claim of fraud.

    That Trump's campaign filed suit so many times and lost so many times, that he -- Trump -- whined that even "his" judges rejected his suits, indicates the depth of his digging to undermine the United States as a government of, by, and for the people. That Trump's followers continue to claim that the election was stolen is something close to the German "stab-in-the-back" myth from the Weimar days.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/17/u...gtype=Homepage

    How Republicans Are Warping Reality Around the Capitol Attack
    Loyalists to President Trump are increasingly relying on conspiracy theories and misinformation, drawing false equivalence with last summer’s racial protests and blaming outside agitators.

    By Astead W. Herndon
    Jan. 17, 2021
    Updated 9:34 a.m. ET
    Immediately after the attack on the U.S. Capitol, all corners of the political spectrum repudiated the mob of President Trump’s supporters. Yet within days, prominent Republicans, party officials, conservative media voices and rank-and-file voters began making a rhetorical shift to try to downplay the group’s violent actions.

    In one of the ultimate don’t-believe-your-eyes moments of the Trump era, these Republicans have retreated to the ranks of misinformation, claiming it was Black Lives Matter protesters and far-left groups like Antifa who stormed the Capitol — in spite of the pro-Trump flags and QAnon symbology in the crowd. Others have argued that the attack was no worse than the rioting and looting in cities during the Black Lives Matter movement, often exaggerating the unrest last summer while minimizing a mob’s attempt to overturn an election.

    The shift is revealing about how conspiracy theories, deflection and political incentives play off one another in Mr. Trump’s G.O.P. For a brief time, Republican officials seemed perhaps open to grappling with what their party’s leader had wrought — violence in the name of their Electoral College fight. But any window of reflection now seems to be closing as Republicans try to pass blame and to compare last summer’s lawlessness, which was condemned by Democrats, to an attack on Congress, which was inspired by Mr. Trump.

    “The violence at the Capitol was shameful,” Rudolph W. Giuliani, the president’s lawyer, tweeted at 6:55 a.m. the morning after the attack. “Our movement values respect for law and order and for the police.” But now, in a new video titled “What Really Happened on January 6th?” Mr. Giuliani is among those who are back to emphasizing conspiracy theories.

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    Continue reading the main story

    “The riot was preplanned,” said Mr. Giuliani, the former mayor of New York City. “This was an attempt to slander Trump.” He added, “The evidence is coming out.”

    For months, Republicans have used last summer’s protests as a political catchall, highlighting isolated instances of property destruction and calls to defund the police to motivate their base in November. The tactic proved somewhat effective on Election Day: Democrats lost ground in the House of Representatives, with Republican challengers hammering a message of liberal lawlessness. About nine of every 10 voters said the protests had been a factor in their voting, according to estimates from A.P. VoteCast, a large voter survey conducted for The Associated Press by NORC at the University of Chicago. Nearly half of those respondents backed Mr. Trump, with some saying they worried that the unrest could disrupt their communities.

    Republicans are now using the looting to try to explain away the Capitol attack. The result, for some Republican voters, ranges from doubt to conspiratorial thinking.

    Suzanne Doherty, 67, who traveled from Michigan to be in Washington on Jan. 6 to support Mr. Trump, came away feeling confused and depressed over the invasion of the Capitol and not trusting the images of the mob.

    “I heard that on Antifa websites, people were invited to go to the rally and dress up like Trump supporters, but I’m not sure what to believe anymore,” she said. “There were people there only to wreak havoc. All I know is that there was a whole gamut of people there, but the rioters were not us. Maybe they were Antifa. Maybe they were B.L.M. Maybe they were extreme right militants.”

    <continued in the linked story>

  2. #82
    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    Quote Originally Posted by welch
    That is laughable.
    That's why I posted it, and many other partisan comments. Surprisingly (or maybe not) you haven't picked up on that it's just a sarcastic demonstration of the laughable partisan nature of your own posts/links.

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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    I just performed a quick read through of the transcrtipt of the current occupants speech. There should be no mistaken intent if one considers direct quotes. Many times we have direct quotes and are critical of the free press simply providing them. It is because we don't like it.

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    welch (January 18th, 2021)

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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    So I hear Rudi's not going to get paid his alleged $20K a day.

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    Senior Member Lloyd's Avatar
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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    Quote Originally Posted by Mustang Mars View Post
    So I hear Rudi's not going to get paid his alleged $20K a day.
    He will if Trump gets paid off for all the pardons he's giving out.
    M: I came here for a good argument.
    A: No you didn't; no, you came here for an argument.
    M: An argument isn't just contradiction.
    A: It can be.
    M: No it can't. An argument is a connected series of statements intended to establish a proposition.
    A: No it isn't.
    M: Yes it is! It's not just contradiction.
    A: Look, if I argue with you, I must take up a contrary position.
    M: Yes, but that's not just saying 'No it isn't.'
    A: Yes it is!
    M: No it isn't!

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    welch (January 18th, 2021)

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    Senior Member Lloyd's Avatar
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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    I think that, once Biden is in, therevs still going to be the hand of Don in things. Kind of like when the head of the mob goes to jail but still rules his organization.
    M: I came here for a good argument.
    A: No you didn't; no, you came here for an argument.
    M: An argument isn't just contradiction.
    A: It can be.
    M: No it can't. An argument is a connected series of statements intended to establish a proposition.
    A: No it isn't.
    M: Yes it is! It's not just contradiction.
    A: Look, if I argue with you, I must take up a contrary position.
    M: Yes, but that's not just saying 'No it isn't.'
    A: Yes it is!
    M: No it isn't!

  9. #87
    Senior Member welch's Avatar
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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    Twenty-one hours until the US has a genuine President.

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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    Quote Originally Posted by welch View Post
    Twenty-one hours until the US has a genuine President.
    The past four years has answered the question of would it not be better to have non politicans running the show. In our state we have an bar owner running the university, an exwrestler for county mayor, and a third generation contractor running the state. Based on their response to the pandemic, I can say without reservation that no it is not better.

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    Lloyd (January 19th, 2021)

  12. #89
    FPG Donor ♕ Chrissy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    Congratulations to President Biden.
    Regards, Chrissy | My Blog: inkyfountainpens

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    welch (January 21st, 2021)

  14. #90
    Senior Member welch's Avatar
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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    Quote Originally Posted by Chrissy View Post
    Congratulations to President Biden.
    It was a good inaugural speech, and a good first day of, for instance, rejoining the Paris Climate Accord and applying to rejoin the World Health Organization.

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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    Quote Originally Posted by welch View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Chrissy View Post
    Congratulations to President Biden.
    It was a good inaugural speech, and a good first day of, for instance, rejoining the Paris Climate Accord and applying to rejoin the World Health Organization.
    Common sense prevails and the world needs the US at these tables

  16. #92
    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    Quote Originally Posted by welch View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Chrissy View Post
    Congratulations to President Biden.
    It was a good inaugural speech, and a good first day of, for instance, rejoining the Paris Climate Accord and applying to rejoin the World Health Organization.
    He should have been more concerned with the lives of 3000+ Americans. I thought he had a plan?
    Fighting is better than idleness
    -Kurdish proverb

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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    It is obvious there is both a team and a pan in place.

  18. #94
    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Naill View Post
    It is obvious there is both a team and a pan in place.
    141199747_2972098983007997_8113312856678398388_n (1).jpg
    Fighting is better than idleness
    -Kurdish proverb

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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    Yes, he wasn’t in charge and the experts were muzzled.

  20. #96
    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    But he's in charge now, and Trump left him a vaccine (several, actually).

    What are his priorities? Keystone pipeline, Paris accords, letting chicks with dicks compete in women's events, etc...

    The pot-shot game is easy. I put up with it for months, basically begging for a rational conversation.

    Shoe's on the other foot now, and nobody seems to like it. I'm happy to move on, and I'm happy to keep feeding spoonfuls of the same shit many were gleefully posting.
    Last edited by dneal; January 22nd, 2021 at 08:04 PM.
    Fighting is better than idleness
    -Kurdish proverb

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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    Quote Originally Posted by dneal View Post
    But he's in charge now, and Trump left him a vaccine (several, actually).

    What are his priorities? Keystone pipeline, Paris accords, letting chicks with dicks compete in women's events, etc...

    The pot-shot game is easy. I put up with it for months, basically begging for a rational conversation.

    Shoe's on the other foot now, and nobody seems to like it. I'm happy to move on, and I'm happy to keep feeding spoonfuls of the same shit many were gleefully posting.
    Pfizer and Moderna developed the vaccine. What the former administration did was take away the financial risk, a good thing.

    Not sure a rational conversation can be had with the constant "whataboutthisism".

    Yes, the shoe is on the other foot. As a business student and professional, I have been pleased with Biden's approach to team building aka "getting the right people on the bus". He had plans in place or "was able to hit the ground running". This is something Trump was not able to do since he had no previous experience and it soon showed...

    Yes, Trump wanted or said he wanted to drain the swamp. There is nothing wrong with a swamp. It is naturally occuring and accumulated the natural habitat for those that live there. What we have discovered is that when a natural catastrophy occurs, you need the infrastructure that only a swamp can address.

    As Peter Drucker wrote, "Management is doing things right; leaders do the right things". If you think Trump exemplified this quote, please explain how. If you don't have an opinion, that's also just fine.

  22. #98
    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    Agree the Trump admin removed financial risk. They also removed bureaucratic hurdles. Some of those hurdles are a safety check though.

    RE: whataboutism. Either pointing out hypocrisy is valid or it isn't. Hypocrisy isn't a logical fallacy, it's a credibility issue. It shows that arguments are disingenuous. I'll point hypocrisy out, you can keep calling it "whataboutism".

    Trump's presidency, the MAGA movement, the swamp, etc... is an interesting but complex topic that is too easily reduced to banality. People here are way too emotional one way or another to do an objective "case study".
    Fighting is better than idleness
    -Kurdish proverb

  23. #99
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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    Quote Originally Posted by dneal View Post
    Agree the Trump admin removed financial risk. They also removed bureaucratic hurdles. Some of those hurdles are a safety check though.

    RE: whataboutism. Either pointing out hypocrisy is valid or it isn't. Hypocrisy isn't a logical fallacy, it's a credibility issue. It shows that arguments are disingenuous. I'll point hypocrisy out, you can keep calling it "whataboutism".

    Trump's presidency, the MAGA movement, the swamp, etc... is an interesting but complex topic that is too easily reduced to banality. People here are way too emotional one way or another to do an objective "case study".
    Emotions aside, the Trump administration was such a waste of four years. Can you imagine having the full wealth of American wisdom and knowledge at your disposal and not having the skill set to fully utilize?

    I remember him tangling with the Pope, then the Gold Star family. then Fauci, then with anyone who brusied his ego. His opportunity will go down as the ultimate missed opportunity.

    Hells bells, I would have a constant parade of the brightest and best rotating through my office. Nothing worse than having talent and not knowing how to utilize.

  24. #100
    Senior Member Lloyd's Avatar
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    Default Re: Countdown until the maniac is gone

    Don't forget that Trump obstructed Biden's ability to hit the ground running by blocking his (and his staff) access to many meetings/briefings. I think Trump hats should read MAW... Make America Worse.
    M: I came here for a good argument.
    A: No you didn't; no, you came here for an argument.
    M: An argument isn't just contradiction.
    A: It can be.
    M: No it can't. An argument is a connected series of statements intended to establish a proposition.
    A: No it isn't.
    M: Yes it is! It's not just contradiction.
    A: Look, if I argue with you, I must take up a contrary position.
    M: Yes, but that's not just saying 'No it isn't.'
    A: Yes it is!
    M: No it isn't!

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