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Thread: SCAM beware !

  1. #21
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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    Thank you @Chrissy.
    I got it !

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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    Quote Originally Posted by christof View Post
    It may be that the long-time members here don't value advice of that kind, but still, a judgment should be left to each member himself.
    I completely agree.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Szanto View Post
    "Hey, I saw an open flame and I ended up putting my hand in it and got burned pretty badly. Just wanted you all to know and be aware."

    "Thanks, but I don't put my hand into open flames, as I know that would be unwise on my part. I've never gotten burned. Sorry it happened to you."

    There could very well be any number of people who have opened an account here so they could read threads and send messages, and have never posted, ultimately for the purpose of ripping off people. The two examples cited by the OP appear to fall into this category. It is likely that this kind of behavior exists in forums all over the Internet. Nothing about that makes this place any more dangerous than anywhere else unless you stop using basic online awareness. So, ok, we've been given a head's up that people will offer you something and take your money if you don't do any investigation and use payment methods that don't have any protections. For those that needed to hear that, great.
    And for those who think that they are smarter, better, wiser, etc. than those who do read & appreciate such posts, they are welcome to just move on to another post and make their smart a**, arrogant comments there.

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    Jon Szanto (July 24th, 2021)

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    Senior Member Jon Szanto's Avatar
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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    Quote Originally Posted by 724Seney View Post
    And for those who think that they are smarter, better, wiser, etc. than those who do read & appreciate such posts, they are welcome to just move on to another post and make their smart a**, arrogant comments there.
    Always good to hear from you.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

  7. #25
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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Szanto View Post
    "Hey, I saw an open flame and I ended up putting my hand in it and got burned pretty badly. Just wanted you all to know and be aware."

    "Thanks, but I don't put my hand into open flames, as I know that would be unwise on my part. I've never gotten burned. Sorry it happened to you."

    There could very well be any number of people who have opened an account here so they could read threads and send messages, and have never posted, ultimately for the purpose of ripping off people. The two examples cited by the OP appear to fall into this category. It is likely that this kind of behavior exists in forums all over the Internet. Nothing about that makes this place any more dangerous than anywhere else unless you stop using basic online awareness. So, ok, we've been given a head's up that people will offer you something and take your money if you don't do any investigation and use payment methods that don't have any protections. For those that needed to hear that, great.
    I think there's some value in naming names. I would hope everyone who has contact with these ripoff artists will out them as hana did. The scammers can of course just make up a new identity when they move on to new ripoff schemes, but they at least have to put in the effort and they will again be starting with a zero-post account.

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    724Seney (July 24th, 2021)

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    Senior Member Jon Szanto's Avatar
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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    Quote Originally Posted by guyy View Post
    I think there's some value in naming names. I would hope everyone who has contact with these ripoff artists will out them as hana did. The scammers can of course just make up a new identity when they move on to new ripoff schemes, but they at least have to put in the effort and they will again be starting with a zero-post account.
    I get that, I really do. But at what point do we accept responsibility for our own behavior, as well? Naming some random accounts that have only been in existence for a short while doesn't address the problem of the next person who comes in and gives away their money without the slightest due diligence. What I would *really* love is an education that goes in both directions: be aware of the malicious agents in our midst and be proactive in our own methods as to avoid any of these kinds of situations.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

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    FPG Donor ♕ Chrissy's Avatar
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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    Quote Originally Posted by hana View Post
    Thank you @Chrissy.
    I got it !
    Sadly you left it a little too late.
    Regards, Chrissy | My Blog: inkyfountainpens

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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Szanto View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by 724Seney View Post
    And for those who think that they are smarter, better, wiser, etc. than those who do read & appreciate such posts, they are welcome to just move on to another post and make their smart a**, arrogant comments there.
    Always good to hear from you.
    You too.
    Have a nice day.

  13. #29
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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    Quote Originally Posted by guyy View Post
    I think there's some value in naming names. I would hope everyone who has contact with these ripoff artists will out them as hana did. The scammers can of course just make up a new identity when they move on to new ripoff schemes, but they at least have to put in the effort and they will again be starting with a zero-post account.
    Thank you!!
    Spot on.
    I agree 100%

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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Szanto View Post
    What I would *really* love is an education that goes in both directions: be aware of the malicious agents in our midst and be proactive in our own methods as to avoid any of these kinds of situations.
    Something like this would be terrific.

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    Jon Szanto (July 24th, 2021)

  16. #31
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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    Quote Originally Posted by 724Seney View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Szanto View Post
    What I would *really* love is an education that goes in both directions: be aware of the malicious agents in our midst and be proactive in our own methods as to avoid any of these kinds of situations.
    Something like this would be terrific.
    I agree. (I guess that's redundant, since I posted it!)

    Let's take a breath for a moment. I may express my views differently than you would like, but I can assure you that I think we are both after the same thing: a safe, enjoyable environment for pen people to come to for pen (etc) discussion and sales and... whatever else. Nothing I've ever done has been for any purpose other than to make a place like this the best it can be, and I think you come at it the same way. We might offer different tactics but it doesn't mean the goal is different. I'll be as open to alternatives as I can be.

    Along those lines, here's a question, general in nature: if people agree that the basic activity/concept of "naming and shaming" is productive, why didn't it stop the OP from getting into trouble? And if it didn't for them, how would doing the same thing to the latest bad actors help someone else in the future?

    I have close-to-zero hope for the following, but I would love to see some very brief "Page of Consent" that a person would agree to before they could have any activity in the For Sale forum, whereby they acknowledge some of the many tips and cautions that so many people have raised over the years. The bad actors may change over time, but if every person who wanted to buy or trade had to look at a list of "bewares" and sign off on it, maybe it is the kind of thing that would have given the OP a heads-up before making a poor decision. Just a thought.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    [QUOTE=Jon Szanto Along those lines, here's a question, general in nature: if people agree that the basic activity/concept of "naming and shaming" is productive, why didn't it stop the OP from getting into trouble? And if it didn't for them, how would doing the same thing to the latest bad actors help someone else in the future? QUOTE]

    The challenge is the huge difference of opinion about "naming and shaming." There are those who are vehemently opposed to it and others who feel equally strongly about its value & need.
    I happen to be one who is strongly in favor of it PROVIDED (and this is an important caveat) both parties have the opportunity to present their side of the story. Whether they choose to do so...or not.... is their choice.
    As we have seen on this Forum we have very specific examples of where our doing so has avoided some very experienced members from getting screwed and, in at least one instance, has led to the prosecution of a particularly coy & effective scammer.

    I appreciate that there will likely be a chorus of posts about why we cannot, must not, etc., etc. All opinions are welcomed and valued. But, please don't say we cannot do it because the lawyers will take all your assets and first born child. Plus shut down this Forum. If your facts are accurate, truthful and objective / descriptive you are not going to get into trouble. Stay away from derogatory comments. As Sgt. Friday used to say "Just the facts, ma'am."

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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    Quick questions/thoughts

    -- Does the FPGeeks system allow users to be banned? (i.e. deactivate messaging)

    -- What if we enforce/encourage "verification pics? (i.e. picture of the goods with a PostIt that has your user-id and date)

    I am sure these things may have been debated in the past :-)

    P.S. DavidGreg is another "stand up gentleman" who responds often, just FYI.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  20. #34
    Senior Member Jon Szanto's Avatar
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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    Quote Originally Posted by tadamonoron View Post
    -- Does the FPGeeks system allow users to be banned? (i.e. deactivate messaging)
    If the function/ability exists, it would only be available to the admin. Being that we have had virtually no luck at interaction with him in many years, and only hope that spam gets dealt with, etc, I am not hopeful for ongoing, robust implementation of this. Possibly something to go on a list of items to present to the owner/admin, but that would be for someone else to determine.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

  21. #35
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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    Quote Originally Posted by tadamonoron View Post
    Quick questions/thoughts

    -- Does the FPGeeks system allow users to be banned? (i.e. deactivate messaging)
    It's fair to say that there have been users banned but it's infrequent. Last November springs to mind.

    On the other hand I guess it's difficult to even find these scammers who join with some random ID then never post anything but instead just try messaging members who post WTB ads. It's always worth checking if a so called "member" who does that has any posts and if they don't then go ahead and press the Report button.
    Regards, Chrissy | My Blog: inkyfountainpens

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    Default Re: SCAM beware !

    A lot of people don't understand the risk of sending money via Paypal as F&F. I have gotten money from buyers many times in this way and I always tell them "thanks for saving me the fee, but you really shouldn't do that". I've never scammed anyone in my life in anything, but this is just opening yourself up for theft.

    I'm sorry OP. You should try contacting Paypal anyway. I've heard they make exceptions occasionally even for F&F transactions.

    Furthermore, Google has image search. Drag and drop a picture into Google's searchbar and it will search for the image instead. This way you will easily see if this image has been used before anywhere. Imagesearch works somehow by pixels - so the title of the picture can be changed and Google will still pick it up!
    Last edited by adhoc; August 9th, 2021 at 07:11 AM.

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