Page 5 of 5 FirstFirst ... 345
Results 81 to 98 of 98

Thread: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

  1. #81
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    1,141
    Thanks
    1,820
    Thanked 1,639 Times in 627 Posts
    Rep Power
    9

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    Quote Originally Posted by fountainpenkid View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by An old bloke View Post
    'SBREBrown has said he does not prefer vintage pens and keeps to modern pens.' Given that he is a youtuber and youtube is more about acquiring sponsorships ($$$) than it is about providing information, one wonders if that is motivated by hopes of acquiring current manufacturer sponsors.

    I doubt any vintage (now defunct) manufacturers are likely to provide sponsorships.
    That's surely a bit cynical--I think while SBREBrown's reviews are often surprisingly incurious for an academic, he is honest.
    The point generally is taken though--as pointed out earlier, there is less media incentive for vintage pen-related content. It does make me wonder if there would be interest in historically informed vintage pen content--such media does get traction on youtube at least, in the general vein of what I'd call "entertaining explainers."
    Time was that every other SBRE Brown review seemed to mention the size of his hands. Having big mitts may be a factor in his preference for larger, modern pens.

    Pelahale had some good vintage pen commentary on YouTube ó his Parker 51, Aurora 88 and Sheaffer PFM videos spring to mind ó as well as some interesting musings on other subjects. Sadly, all his pen content has vanished.
    Last edited by catbert; October 6th, 2021 at 03:15 PM.

  2. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to catbert For This Useful Post:

    Detman101 (October 7th, 2021), fountainpenkid (October 6th, 2021)

  3. #82
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2019
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    1,584
    Thanks
    329
    Thanked 541 Times in 367 Posts
    Rep Power
    4

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    This is a odd thread. I suppose if you sell pens there is an interest, but otherwise much to do about nothing.

  4. #83
    Senior Member silverlifter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    616
    Thanks
    359
    Thanked 760 Times in 354 Posts
    Rep Power
    4

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    Quote Originally Posted by fountainpenkid View Post
    It does make me wonder if there would be interest in historically informed vintage pen content--such media does get traction on youtube at least, in the general vein of what I'd call "entertaining explainers."
    There was a series of youtube videos that were a mix of information and musings about classic pens: The PFM and Parker 51s among them. Unfortunately, the author took them down some years ago. They were, as far as I am aware, well received by vintage fans.
    Vintage. Cursive italic. Iron gall.

  5. The Following User Says Thank You to silverlifter For This Useful Post:

    fountainpenkid (October 6th, 2021)

  6. #84
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Location
    Clinging desperately to planet Earth
    Posts
    363
    Thanks
    31
    Thanked 352 Times in 208 Posts
    Rep Power
    6

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    Quote Originally Posted by fountainpenkid View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by An old bloke View Post
    'SBREBrown has said he does not prefer vintage pens and keeps to modern pens.' Given that he is a youtuber and youtube is more about acquiring sponsorships ($$$) than it is about providing information, one wonders if that is motivated by hopes of acquiring current manufacturer sponsors.

    I doubt any vintage (now defunct) manufacturers are likely to provide sponsorships.
    That's surely a bit cynical--I think while SBREBrown's reviews are often surprisingly incurious for an academic, he is honest.
    The point generally is taken though--as pointed out earlier, there is less media incentive for vintage pen-related content. It does make me wonder if there would be interest in historically informed vintage pen content--such media does get traction on youtube at least, in the general vein of what I'd call "entertaining explainers."
    Is it being cynical or is it simply an honest and realistic question about motivation? I offer that it is the latter.

  7. #85
    FPG Donor ♕ KrazyIvan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Texas-USA
    Posts
    5,046
    Thanks
    1,463
    Thanked 1,779 Times in 934 Posts
    Rep Power
    17

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    Quote Originally Posted by silverlifter View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by fountainpenkid View Post
    It does make me wonder if there would be interest in historically informed vintage pen content--such media does get traction on youtube at least, in the general vein of what I'd call "entertaining explainers."
    There was a series of youtube videos that were a mix of information and musings about classic pens: The PFM and Parker 51s among them. Unfortunately, the author took them down some years ago. They were, as far as I am aware, well received by vintage fans.
    I remember those videos and I was a subscriber to his channel up until recently when I finally figured he is not going to post them again or create new videos. I wish he would have left them up.
    Fountain Pen Sith Lord | Daakusaido | Everything in one spot

  8. The Following User Says Thank You to KrazyIvan For This Useful Post:

    fountainpenkid (October 6th, 2021)

  9. #86
    Senior Member Jon Szanto's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    5,777
    Thanks
    6,543
    Thanked 9,284 Times in 3,429 Posts
    Rep Power
    17

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    While it may seem an obvious aspect, it appears to be overlooked in this discussion: YouTube pen reviewers that are successful are helping people find the pen that they like AND CAN PURCHASE. The focus on currently available pens isn't just a taste thing, but a matter of allowing people to consider elements of a pen before purchasing, very likely online and remotely.

    As such, there is never going to be a level of engagement or excitement for a vintage channel, no matter how compelling and entertaining the player, for the simple reason is that if one were to become interested... then all you would be left with is the long hunt and possible disappointment in a poor pen. A really well done channel would have a lot of value, no doubt, but in a very academic sense, not in any way like the excitement for new pen peeps to consider all their options before getting their next pen.

    Lastly, I've mentioned before, but there is a distinct and noted trend away from old objects in young generations. Many donations are not being accepted at thrift stores any longer because the market for 2nd-hand furniture and other items is not what it once was. This may be cyclical, but for now, the market for older vintage pens, especially pre-60s, is with a decidedly older crowd. At least that is my observation.
    Last edited by Jon Szanto; October 6th, 2021 at 07:48 PM.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

  10. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Jon Szanto For This Useful Post:

    Detman101 (October 8th, 2021), fountainpenkid (October 6th, 2021), penwash (October 7th, 2021), Schaumburg_Swan (October 7th, 2021), TSherbs (October 7th, 2021)

  11. #87
    Senior Member guyy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Brooklyn NY
    Posts
    775
    Thanks
    381
    Thanked 598 Times in 340 Posts
    Rep Power
    5

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    Quote Originally Posted by An old bloke View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by fountainpenkid View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by An old bloke View Post
    'SBREBrown has said he does not prefer vintage pens and keeps to modern pens.' Given that he is a youtuber and youtube is more about acquiring sponsorships ($$$) than it is about providing information, one wonders if that is motivated by hopes of acquiring current manufacturer sponsors.

    I doubt any vintage (now defunct) manufacturers are likely to provide sponsorships.
    That's surely a bit cynical--I think while SBREBrown's reviews are often surprisingly incurious for an academic, he is honest.
    The point generally is taken though--as pointed out earlier, there is less media incentive for vintage pen-related content. It does make me wonder if there would be interest in historically informed vintage pen content--such media does get traction on youtube at least, in the general vein of what I'd call "entertaining explainers."
    Is it being cynical or is it simply an honest and realistic question about motivation? I offer that it is the latter.

    Iím with the old bloke.

    SBRE Brown's hands arenít any bigger than mine. And yet i can handle vintage models just fine. Yes, the senior size Parkers & Sheaffers & OS Wahls suit me best, but i can comfortably use standard sized pens like the Waterman 52, Parker 51, #4 size vintage MBs and Pelikan 400/N/NNs.
    Last edited by guyy; October 6th, 2021 at 09:10 PM.

  12. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to guyy For This Useful Post:

    eachan (October 8th, 2021), fountainpenkid (October 6th, 2021), Jon Szanto (October 6th, 2021)

  13. #88
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    San Francisco, California
    Posts
    215
    Thanks
    172
    Thanked 113 Times in 58 Posts
    Rep Power
    9

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    I don't think this has anything whatever to do with hand size. Nor do I think it has anything whatever to do with venality. I'm with Jon Szanto, above. Many people, whatever sizes of pens they like and use and review, just are not very interested in old pens.

    Let us entertain the idea that Dr. Brown lives in a mental world in which people are interested in Kaweco pens of today, and very much not in Kaweco pens of the original company. I read many reviews on UK Web sites of small pens currently on the market. It isn't that the reviewers are against writing with a small pen. They seem to be delighted with various small pens.

    But they are not interested in small Japanese pens of the 1950s. I'm 85 years old and I'm not, either. My own favorite pen is the Parker 51 Aero, and to a disproportionate extent I write with pens of the 1950s and 1960s, but I have not the slightest expectation that video reviewers are going to discuss e.g. the MonteRosa 042. Nor do I have the slightest disappointment that they don't.

  14. The Following User Says Thank You to Jerome Tarshis For This Useful Post:

    penwash (October 7th, 2021)

  15. #89
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2019
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    1,584
    Thanks
    329
    Thanked 541 Times in 367 Posts
    Rep Power
    4

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    The only reason a user of any age is not interested in an Esterbrook or Parker vintage is because they have not used one for a daily use. Of course if you're concerned about ink on your finger than using, YMMV.

  16. #90
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    2,075
    Thanks
    1,139
    Thanked 1,182 Times in 692 Posts
    Rep Power
    11

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Naill View Post
    The only reason a user of any age is not interested in an Esterbrook or Parker vintage is because they have not used one for a daily use. Of course if you're concerned about ink on your finger than using, YMMV.
    come on, Chuck. That's not true.

    I don't much like my Esterbrook (I've owned for 6 years now), and this is why I don't use it much and am not interested in more of them. I also have grown less enamored with my Vacumatic, and I likely will sell it soon. Disinterest in vintage can come from several factors, including that not all of the pens actually write well or suit us individually.

    Kind of like with modern pens, too.

  17. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to TSherbs For This Useful Post:

    Detman101 (October 8th, 2021), Jon Szanto (October 7th, 2021)

  18. #91
    Senior Member guyy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Brooklyn NY
    Posts
    775
    Thanks
    381
    Thanked 598 Times in 340 Posts
    Rep Power
    5

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerome Tarshis View Post
    I don't think this has anything whatever to do with hand size. Nor do I think it has anything whatever to do with venality. I'm with Jon Szanto, above. Many people, whatever sizes of pens they like and use and review, just are not very interested in old pens.
    I read both Jon's and old bloke's comments as saying that it comes down to the marginal status of vintage pens as commodities. Youtube being centered around the sale of commodities -- Google is an advertising company first and foremost -- vintage pens are not going to be big on youtube.

  19. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to guyy For This Useful Post:

    fountainpenkid (October 7th, 2021), Jon Szanto (October 7th, 2021), TSherbs (October 7th, 2021)

  20. #92
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Location
    Clinging desperately to planet Earth
    Posts
    363
    Thanks
    31
    Thanked 352 Times in 208 Posts
    Rep Power
    6

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    Quote Originally Posted by guyy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jerome Tarshis View Post
    I don't think this has anything whatever to do with hand size. Nor do I think it has anything whatever to do with venality. I'm with Jon Szanto, above. Many people, whatever sizes of pens they like and use and review, just are not very interested in old pens.
    I read both Jon's and old bloke's comments as saying that it comes down to the marginal status of vintage pens as commodities. Youtube being centered around the sale of commodities -- Google is an advertising company first and foremost -- vintage pens are not going to be big on youtube.
    Thank you. My point exactly.

  21. The Following User Says Thank You to An old bloke For This Useful Post:

    Detman101 (October 8th, 2021)

  22. #93
    Senior Member pajaro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Tecumseh, MI
    Posts
    1,301
    Thanks
    527
    Thanked 558 Times in 373 Posts
    Rep Power
    11

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    Are pens from the 1960s to the 1980s considered to be vintage today? Time creeps on, and I feel as if I were in some time warp. Pens drom the sixties to the eighties are most of what I use.

  23. #94
    Senior Member silverlifter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    616
    Thanks
    359
    Thanked 760 Times in 354 Posts
    Rep Power
    4

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    I'd definitely count the 60's as vintage, mostly because that was the last decade before fountain pens were completely eclipsed by ball points.
    Vintage. Cursive italic. Iron gall.

  24. #95
    Senior Member penwash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Dallas, as in the 80's TV Series
    Posts
    3,334
    Thanks
    2,639
    Thanked 5,086 Times in 1,694 Posts
    Rep Power
    11

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    Quote Originally Posted by silverlifter View Post
    I'd definitely count the 60's as vintage, mostly because that was the last decade before fountain pens were completely eclipsed by ball points.
    Agreed!

    To me, "vintage" pens represents a fixed time period when fountain pens were one of (if not "the") mainstream writing instrument. They have a lot of characteristics that we don't see in the pens made in latter decades until today.

    Today, fountain pens are made to meet a totally different demands, and for better or worse, these also deserve a different classification than the vintage ones.
    - Will
    Unique and restored vintage pens: Redeem Pens

  25. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to penwash For This Useful Post:

    Cyril (October 9th, 2021), eachan (October 9th, 2021), fountainpenkid (October 9th, 2021), Jon Szanto (October 9th, 2021)

  26. #96
    Senior Member fountainpenkid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Nouvelle Angleterre
    Posts
    3,513
    Thanks
    3,173
    Thanked 1,067 Times in 530 Posts
    Rep Power
    14

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    Quote Originally Posted by penwash View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by silverlifter View Post
    I'd definitely count the 60's as vintage, mostly because that was the last decade before fountain pens were completely eclipsed by ball points.
    Agreed!

    To me, "vintage" pens represents a fixed time period when fountain pens were one of (if not "the") mainstream writing instrument. They have a lot of characteristics that we don't see in the pens made in latter decades until today.

    Today, fountain pens are made to meet a totally different demands, and for better or worse, these also deserve a different classification than the vintage ones.
    "totally different demands?" Certainly for desk jewelry like oversize, 50+ gram metal LEs, but I think most of the market shares a good amount in common with that 50+ years ago--people want pens to use frequently, for long or short writing. Pocket carry is no longer fashionable or a common aim (hence the current success of unpocketable oversize pens), but the goal of writing utility hasn't changed that much. Aesthetically, of course, you're right, it's totally different. Vintage pens were like cars still are: styled to represent the latest trends. Modern pens are all over the map, representing many different aesthetic eras, sometimes in a single pen.
    Will
    If my p.m box is full, feel free to email me at dabantur@gmail.com.

  27. #97
    Senior Member Cyril's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    514
    Thanks
    877
    Thanked 266 Times in 161 Posts
    Rep Power
    5

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    Quote Originally Posted by penwash View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by silverlifter View Post
    I'd definitely count the 60's as vintage, mostly because that was the last decade before fountain pens were completely eclipsed by ball points.
    Agreed!

    To me, "vintage" pens represents a fixed time period when fountain pens were one of (if not "the") mainstream writing instrument. They have a lot of characteristics that we don't see in the pens made in latter decades until today.

    Today, fountain pens are made to meet a totally different demands, and for better or worse, these also deserve a different classification than the vintage ones.
    I agree and my same point is as what PENWASH INDICATE HERE.

    Whatever the debate on pen size or the period of the pen era has upgraded or degraded the the present pens manufacturing,
    it is surely missing the distinctive characteristic quality of writing of vintage pens.
    This can be a slight experience of difference to somebody who has not laid a hand on vintage pen.
    But a big take to someone who is very serious in writing and who has only had contemporary pens writing experience.
    This is my own path how I got into vintage pens and I hardly buy any pens that is not vintage.

  28. #98
    Senior Member penwash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Dallas, as in the 80's TV Series
    Posts
    3,334
    Thanks
    2,639
    Thanked 5,086 Times in 1,694 Posts
    Rep Power
    11

    Default Re: Vintage Pens today - An Observation

    Quote Originally Posted by fountainpenkid View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by penwash View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by silverlifter View Post
    I'd definitely count the 60's as vintage, mostly because that was the last decade before fountain pens were completely eclipsed by ball points.
    Agreed!

    To me, "vintage" pens represents a fixed time period when fountain pens were one of (if not "the") mainstream writing instrument. They have a lot of characteristics that we don't see in the pens made in latter decades until today.

    Today, fountain pens are made to meet a totally different demands, and for better or worse, these also deserve a different classification than the vintage ones.
    "totally different demands?" Certainly for desk jewelry like oversize, 50+ gram metal LEs, but I think most of the market shares a good amount in common with that 50+ years ago--people want pens to use frequently, for long or short writing. Pocket carry is no longer fashionable or a common aim (hence the current success of unpocketable oversize pens), but the goal of writing utility hasn't changed that much. Aesthetically, of course, you're right, it's totally different. Vintage pens were like cars still are: styled to represent the latest trends. Modern pens are all over the map, representing many different aesthetic eras, sometimes in a single pen.
    When I say demands, I was mainly referring to the numbers.

    Pen companies today don't have to produce millions of fountain pens because the demands are not there anymore.

    This has both good and bad outcome. The good outcome is that this opens up market for smaller boutique-style manufacturers to thrive and innovate.

    What can be seen as one downside, is that FP producers no longer have the urgency and the need to stay competitive like their predecessors in the past.

    Example: Can you imagine if Sheaffer sell their pens at a very high price, and don't deliver to their customers up to months?
    How soon do you think they will just vanish in the cloud of competitions back then?

    Today, this is tolerated and accepted, for certain manufacturers (and I'm not referring only to the Nakaya or Hakase of the world).

    Again, this is just musings. Take it as far as it can go in your chosen perspective.
    - Will
    Unique and restored vintage pens: Redeem Pens

  29. The Following User Says Thank You to penwash For This Useful Post:

    eachan (October 9th, 2021)

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •