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Thread: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

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    Default Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    I mentioned earlier that I was considering an Edison Beaumont fountain pen. There are three "Production" versions of that pen, for $169, but I don't care for them. I want the pen in Deep Purple, but that's a custom selection, and is $275. Problem is, I only want a cartridge/converter version with a standard medium nib, so I'm basically paying over $100 for no customization, other than the color. And, paying $275 for a pen with only a $25 JoWo steel nib really bothers me. Changing the nib to gold is another $100!

    I'm a working person, and $275/$375 is serious money for me, so I've continued the search for my next pen, and came across the Sailor 1911S Demonstrator pen from Goulet, which is $180, and it comes with a 14k gold nib. That seems like a much better "value".

    I almost never buy expensive pens, so I'd like some input from those of you who do, and who are also familiar with both Edison and Sailor pens.

    Edison.jpgSailor.jpg

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    It is a pity that simply changing to a different acrylic (at minimal difference in cost for the material) translates into a $100 difference in price to the consumer for a pen that is mostly made on a computer controlled lathe. Minimum customisation, maximum price hike. Made enquiries with Edison about something similar a few weeks ago and ran into the same issue, so dropped the idea. I was really keen to try their pens too. It's disappointing, but that is how Edison have positioned themselves.

    If you can source the material you want, you can get a pen made by one of the smaller independent makers without incurring that degree of mark-up. For the record I have 3 custom made pens that between about $160 and $200 in materials of my choice, none were made by a computer, and 2 of them were modified beyond just the material choice.

    To be fair there are other pen makers where you can buy an unmodified off-the-shelf model with a bog standard steel Jowo nib for around a jaw-dropping $400.
    Last edited by Empty_of_Clouds; August 28th, 2021 at 01:57 AM.

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_of_Clouds View Post
    It is a pity that simply changing to a different acrylic (at minimal difference in cost for the material) translates into a $100 difference in price to the consumer for a pen that is mostly made on a computer controlled lathe. Minimum customisation, maximum price hike. Made enquiries with Edison about something similar a few weeks ago and ran into the same issue, so dropped the idea. I was really keen to try their pens too. It's disappointing, but that is how Edison have positioned themselves.

    If you can source the material you want, you can get a pen made by one of the smaller independent makers without incurring that degree of mark-up. For the record I have 3 custom made pens that between about $160 and $200 in materials of my choice, none were made by a computer, and 2 of them were modified beyond just the material choice.

    To be fair there are other pen makers where you can buy an unmodified off-the-shelf model with a bog standard steel Jowo nib for around a jaw-dropping $400.
    Edison's refusal to work with me on the price, considering that I do not want a lot of customization, made me quite uncomfortable. Their customer service is excellent, but that only goes so far. Seems huge profit margins are a bit too high on their priority list for my tastes, and sooner or later, that will catch up with them. I will continue to look elsewhere. Thanks for you input. I appreciate it.

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    Senior Member silverlifter's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    Quote Originally Posted by SkyCyclePilot View Post
    And, paying $275 for a pen with only a $25 JoWo steel nib really bothers me.
    Well, it's not a stock Jowo steel nib. Like an FC nib, Brian tunes them all before they ship.

    I've only written with a couple of Sailor 21k nibs, but both of them have been thoroughly unremarkable. I much prefer FC's HPS steel nibs with either a CI or SIG grind. Gold is not, by default, a superior writing experience. It's just always a more expensive one.
    Vintage. Cursive italic. Iron gall.

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    Quote Originally Posted by silverlifter View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by SkyCyclePilot View Post
    And, paying $275 for a pen with only a $25 JoWo steel nib really bothers me.
    Well, it's not a stock Jowo steel nib. Like an FC nib, Brian tunes them all before they ship.

    I've only written with a couple of Sailor 21k nibs, but both of them have been thoroughly unremarkable. I much prefer FC's HPS steel nibs with either a CI or SIG grind. Gold is not, by default, a superior writing experience. It's just always a more expensive one.
    Good points... I was wondering about the quality of Sailor nibs. I have one stock Edison steel nib, installed in an inexpensive pen. I aligned it myself, and it writes well.

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    Sailor nibs, in general, are very highly regarded. They have good QC and the people that like their distinctive (pencil-like) feedback tend to really dig them. I should qualify my statement above by saying I am only referring to their standard H-M nibs, not any of their specialty nibs.
    Vintage. Cursive italic. Iron gall.

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    Quote Originally Posted by silverlifter View Post
    Sailor nibs, in general, are very highly regarded. They have good QC and the people that like their distinctive (pencil-like) feedback tend to really dig them. I should qualify my statement above by saying I am only referring to their standard H-M nibs, not any of their specialty nibs.
    Thanks. That 1911S comes with a 14k gold nib. I'd probably get just a standard medium or medium/fine. I'll be giving this a lot of thought. If money were no object, I'd probably get the Edison with a gold nib, but $375 is a lot of money...

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    I think Sailor nibs are very good. They are consistent and i like the feel. I would describe the feel as pretty smooth rather than “pencil-like”, but then, the Sailor i use most often is a Nagahara the Elder era broad togi nib, or maybe i use less pressure than most or my paper is too smooth. They won’t give much line variation unless you go for some of the expensive naginata togi nibs or one of its variations, and even those will require some unnatural manual gymnastics.

    Being the kind of person who is content with black pens, i wouldn’t pay that much extra for a purple Edison.

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    I can't get on with Sailor at all, and I have a lot of Edisons all of which make me happy.

    It's the hands-on experience which just isn't there with the Sailor - it looks nice, but it doesn't feel great and doesn't write well for me. Your mileage may vary, but for me, Pilot writes better... try to get a trial if you can, as I get the impression Sailor (like Lamy Safaris and Marmite) is a love/hate brand.

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    I'm a bit confused.. those two pens are so dissimilar...

    Which is more important to you the nib or the body?
    After all if the pen doesn't make your heart sing, what's the point of buying it... because it's a good "value"...

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    I refrained from commenting in your other thread because I thought you've pretty much made up your mind on the Edison.

    If I were to find a special pen but also a good value, I would consider vintage ones.
    Even at around $150-$200 you would already get a bigger Sheaffer Balance models or a nice Wahl celluloid pens, or a set of Parker 75 which is pretty special especially if you like metal pens. All with 14K gold nibs that are (in my view) just as good (some better) than anything they sell today at those rather hiked-up prices.

    Among modern pens, given your special occasion, I would consider Leonardo Momento Zero, or Momento Magico (true piston filler), or Santini or Maiora. These models are vintage inspired, with modern "amenities"

    As far as Sailor, if you don't know yet (it took me a while to find out), the 14K is usually on their smallest model. The larger ones has 21K nibs and the price started at around $300 retail. The ones I've used in the past are excellent, both nibs and the pens.
    - Will
    Unique and restored vintage pens: Redeem Pens

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    Quote Originally Posted by amk View Post
    I can't get on with Sailor at all, and I have a lot of Edisons all of which make me happy.

    It's the hands-on experience which just isn't there with the Sailor - it looks nice, but it doesn't feel great and doesn't write well for me. Your mileage may vary, but for me, Pilot writes better... try to get a trial if you can, as I get the impression Sailor (like Lamy Safaris and Marmite) is a love/hate brand.
    I understand. Thanks for your insight. That's the kind of thing I'm looking for.

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    Quote Originally Posted by Yazeh View Post
    I'm a bit confused.. those two pens are so dissimilar...

    Which is more important to you the nib or the body?
    After all if the pen doesn't make your heart sing, what's the point of buying it... because it's a good "value"...
    Yes, the pens are dissimilar, but I like the look of both them - simple as that - but $180 for the Sailor seems a much more reasonable price. I'm mainly looking for impressions, and input on the quality of both pens, since I have no way to try either of them before buying.

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    Quote Originally Posted by penwash View Post
    I refrained from commenting in your other thread because I thought you've pretty much made up your mind on the Edison.

    If I were to find a special pen but also a good value, I would consider vintage ones.
    Even at around $150-$200 you would already get a bigger Sheaffer Balance models or a nice Wahl celluloid pens, or a set of Parker 75 which is pretty special especially if you like metal pens. All with 14K gold nibs that are (in my view) just as good (some better) than anything they sell today at those rather hiked-up prices.

    Among modern pens, given your special occasion, I would consider Leonardo Momento Zero, or Momento Magico (true piston filler), or Santini or Maiora. These models are vintage inspired, with modern "amenities"

    As far as Sailor, if you don't know yet (it took me a while to find out), the 14K is usually on their smallest model. The larger ones has 21K nibs and the price started at around $300 retail. The ones I've used in the past are excellent, both nibs and the pens.
    Thanks! I'm still looking, so will check out Redeem Pens, as well as the others you recommended. That's helpful. Thanks again.

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    I have a few Sailors, with M-F, M, B, and Music nibs. They are ALL very nice pens, and pleasant writers. You probably already know this, but keep in mind that Sailor nibs are generally smaller than Edison. A Sailor M will probably be closer to an Edison F. That said I've had a couple Edisons in the past, but they have moved on.

    Franklin Christoph makes some wonderful pens, and I currently own a Model 20, and a Model 02, both with gold Masuyama stub nibs. My newest one is a Model 65 with a steel Nagahara medium stub. These three are right at the top of my collection. Also, their customer service is second to none.
    Now lo and behold, they have a purple Model 20 in stock...
    https://www.franklin-christoph.com/c...ta-fp-pearlple

    Let us know what you finally decide on!

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    I have one Sailor c/c. It writes well enough - the convertor doesn't hold a lot of ink though I'm told the cartridges are better.

    The Cross Peerless is good - a Sailor nib, on a Cross body. The convertor seems to hold more ink.

    Cult pens has a sale on - Lamy, Pelikan and Visconti.

    MAybe youcould find something there?

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    Quote Originally Posted by SkyCyclePilot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Yazeh View Post
    I'm a bit confused.. those two pens are so dissimilar...

    Which is more important to you the nib or the body?
    After all if the pen doesn't make your heart sing, what's the point of buying it... because it's a good "value"...
    Yes, the pens are dissimilar, but I like the look of both them - simple as that - but $180 for the Sailor seems a much more reasonable price. I'm mainly looking for impressions, and input on the quality of both pens, since I have no way to try either of them before buying.
    I get that. I've had two Edisons. The acrylics are nice. The nib is the same standard Jowo most use. Perfectly usable, but not really special in any way (the same goes for standard Bock, IMHO). The other furniture on the pen (clip and whatnot) is unimpressive. I agree with your determination of their pricing.

    I have one Sailor, a 1911 L with a 21k nib, medium-fine. I like the weight and where the center of gravity is. Unposted, it's in the section (due to the use of metal). The nib does exhibit a pencil type resistance, but it is the most precise regulation of ink I've experienced. Mine was always inked up and on the desk, for when I needed to grab a pen that was sure to work.
    Fighting is better than idleness
    -Kurdish proverb

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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    One thing that has been totally omitted in the discussion, which to center around photos of two pens: the Sailor is a 1911S, which means it is the smaller model, yes? Aside from choice of material (a confounding big difference between the 2 choices so far), aside from nib quality and function (both should be good, Brian's tuned and Sailor of usually good quality, I enjoy both)...

    ... OP and no one else has gotten into which pen fits the hand best. The S (standard) model is a smaller pen, and I would definitely get dimensions for both pens to assure you will have the comfort-in-hand you require for a long-term purchase.

    Lastly: I get that money does not grow on trees or flow from faucets, but people get way, way hung up on "profit margins" and crap like that. Buy or buy not, there is no try. Both pens are good, one is from a large, international company, the other from a single bespoke maker. And there are a zillion other pens out there at all kinds of varying price points. Pick the pen you like, that you think will suit your writing style, your personality, your hand, and your aesthetics. I can fairly guarantee that any 'extra' amount of money you might put into this will totally fade from memory in no time at all and you will have a pen to mark important times.

    It is very possible to overthink things. Too much head, too little heart.

    More info, just because:

    Last edited by Jon Szanto; August 29th, 2021 at 11:41 AM.
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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Szanto View Post
    One thing that has been totally omitted in the discussion, which to center around photos of two pens: the Sailor is a 1911S, which means it is the smaller model, yes? Aside from choice of material (a confounding big difference between the 2 choices so far), aside from nib quality and function (both should be good, Brian's tuned and Sailor of usually good quality, I enjoy both)...

    ... OP and no one else has gotten into which pen fits the hand best. The S (standard) model is a smaller pen, and I would definitely get dimensions for both pens to assure you will have the comfort-in-hand you require for a long-term purchase.

    Lastly: I get that money does not grow on trees or flow from faucets, but people get way, way hung up on "profit margins" and crap like that. Buy or buy not, there is no try. Both pens are good, one is from a large, international company, the other from a single bespoke maker. And there are a zillion other pens out there at all kinds of varying price points. Pick the pen you like, that you think will suit your writing style, your personality, your hand, and your aesthetics. I can fairly guarantee that any 'extra' amount of money you might put into this will totally fade from memory in no time at all and you will have a pen to mark important times.

    It is very possible to overthink things. Too much head, too little heart.

    More info, just because:

    Well, I have slender, larger hands, but prefer smaller pens. I own a TWSBI Mini Rose Gold Diamond, and a Parker Duofold International, and really like their smaller size, but I have larger pens, too. As to overthinking things, that is at the very core of my nature. I go 'down the rabbit hole' on everything I purchase, and every passion I pursue. I'm buying as a gift to myself, in November, so I have plenty of time to decide, and won't do so until I'm worn myself, and pretty much everyone else, out on the matter! I am researching other pens - Leonardo, Esterbrook, Pilot, Narwhal, Rosetta, Laban...

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    Senior Member Jon Szanto's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trying to Decide Between Edison and Sailor

    Quote Originally Posted by SkyCyclePilot View Post
    As to overthinking things, that is at the very core of my nature. I go 'down the rabbit hole' on everything I purchase, and every passion I pursue. I'm buying as a gift to myself, in November, so I have plenty of time to decide, and won't do so until I'm worn myself, and pretty much everyone else, out on the matter! I am researching other pens - Leonardo, Esterbrook, Pilot, Narwhal, Rosetta, Laban...
    Well, my friend, I wish you the very best. My comments were certainly not meant sharply, and you have taken them in the manner I sent. I'll only offer input when it seems valid and I hope you eventually find the pen that suits you best. I can't, won't, and shouldn't alter your underlying personal characteristics, so my biggest hope is simply that, after you've done all this ruminating, you arrive at a resolution that brings you happiness and contentment.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

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