Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 29

Thread: Raw Brass Safety

  1. #1
    Member alexgalexg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Location
    Connecticut USA
    Posts
    39
    Thanks
    19
    Thanked 13 Times in 8 Posts
    Rep Power
    0

    Default Raw Brass Safety

    Hey all, have something on my mind. My edc pen is made entirely of raw brass, which I always thought to be a safe material. But I am learning that this may not be the case? Supposedly the typical raw brass pen contains 3% lead which can be absorbed through the skin while using the pen. I am someone who lacks the time to be able to properly research this topic so I was curious if anyone here has looked into this. Would rather not increase my chances of dementia in my elder years.

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Location
    Eastern Canada
    Posts
    173
    Thanks
    411
    Thanked 130 Times in 76 Posts
    Rep Power
    5

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    The Wikipedia article on brass discusses lead content. California limits lead content to 0.25%. "Raw" brass is brass that isn't coated with lacquer, so I can understand why you're worried. Even brass keys can evidently be a problem.

  3. The Following User Says Thank You to Stands on Feet For This Useful Post:

    alexgalexg (October 27th, 2021)

  4. #3
    Member alexgalexg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Location
    Connecticut USA
    Posts
    39
    Thanks
    19
    Thanked 13 Times in 8 Posts
    Rep Power
    0

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by Stands on Feet View Post
    The Wikipedia article on brass discusses lead content. California limits lead content to 0.25%. "Raw" brass is brass that isn't coated with lacquer, so I can understand why you're worried. Even brass keys can evidently be a problem.
    I may have to do a little investigation as to how I could test for lead without damaging the pen, as well as if there is a way to remove it. I have used this pen daily since I bought it for college over the summer and I have to take a lot of notes. Spends a lot of time in my hand. Best switch to something else for the meantime. Surprising in this day and age to have something so dangerous being unknown to most (even to manufacturers).

  5. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Location
    Clinging desperately to planet Earth
    Posts
    474
    Thanks
    36
    Thanked 474 Times in 281 Posts
    Rep Power
    8

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by alexgalexg View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Stands on Feet View Post
    The Wikipedia article on brass discusses lead content. California limits lead content to 0.25%. "Raw" brass is brass that isn't coated with lacquer, so I can understand why you're worried. Even brass keys can evidently be a problem.
    I may have to do a little investigation as to how I could test for lead without damaging the pen, as well as if there is a way to remove it. I have used this pen daily since I bought it for college over the summer and I have to take a lot of notes. Spends a lot of time in my hand. Best switch to something else for the meantime. Surprising in this day and age to have something so dangerous being unknown to most (even to manufacturers).
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but brass is a copper alloy that contains lead. As such, one cannot remove the lead. Pewter is another alloy that contains lead.

    My suggestion is the simple solution of spraying or painting the cap and barrel (and section if necessary) with a clear lacquer or spark varnish.

  6. #5
    Senior Member Ron Z's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Location
    Western Pennsylvania
    Posts
    611
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 1,085 Times in 396 Posts
    Rep Power
    5

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Read the Wikipedia article. It doesn't take long. Not all brass contains lead, though it is quite common. The lead content may be quite low.

    ...and I will admit, I ignore the warnings issued by California. Everything in California comes with a warning, even a cup of coffee. Cleaning the pen exposes you to chemicals, painting it with a clear lacquer or other clear finish exposes you to chemicals and vapors.

    If you don't want to come in direct contact, clean the pen with a good metal cleaner, and the coat it with Rennaissance wax. Maybe that comes with a warning too.

    Visit Main Street Pens
    A full service pen shop providing professional, thoughtful pen repair....
    Please contact us by email, and not PM for repair inquiries.

  7. The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to Ron Z For This Useful Post:

    alexgalexg (October 27th, 2021), Cyril (November 24th, 2021), dneal (November 10th, 2021), eachan (October 28th, 2021), fountainpenkid (October 27th, 2021), manoeuver (October 28th, 2021), Robert (November 16th, 2021), titrisol (November 24th, 2021)

  8. #6
    Senior Member silverlifter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    616
    Thanks
    359
    Thanked 772 Times in 355 Posts
    Rep Power
    7

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by alexgalexg View Post
    My edc pen is made entirely of raw brass...
    Which pen? Kaweco, for example, uses Eco-Brass in their pens, which has negligble lead content (but is more expensive). Cheaper clones, on the other hand, would be a very different story.
    Vintage. Cursive italic. Iron gall.

  9. The Following User Says Thank You to silverlifter For This Useful Post:

    alexgalexg (October 27th, 2021)

  10. #7
    Member alexgalexg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Location
    Connecticut USA
    Posts
    39
    Thanks
    19
    Thanked 13 Times in 8 Posts
    Rep Power
    0

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by silverlifter View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by alexgalexg View Post
    My edc pen is made entirely of raw brass...
    Which pen? Kaweco, for example, uses Eco-Brass in their pens, which has negligble lead content (but is more expensive). Cheaper clones, on the other hand, would be a very different story.
    Brass Pen from Machine Era Company. They don't display and lead info that I could find.

  11. #8
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2020
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    51
    Thanks
    16
    Thanked 55 Times in 31 Posts
    Rep Power
    4

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    I doubt whether you have to worry about it being absorbed through your skin. But, keep it out of your mouth and wash your hands before handling food. Lead test kits are readily available.

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to Parsimonious For This Useful Post:

    alexgalexg (October 27th, 2021)

  13. #9
    Member alexgalexg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Location
    Connecticut USA
    Posts
    39
    Thanks
    19
    Thanked 13 Times in 8 Posts
    Rep Power
    0

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Z View Post
    Read the Wikipedia article. It doesn't take long. Not all brass contains lead, though it is quite common. The lead content may be quite low.

    ...and I will admit, I ignore the warnings issued by California. Everything in California comes with a warning, even a cup of coffee. Cleaning the pen exposes you to chemicals, painting it with a clear lacquer or other clear finish exposes you to chemicals and vapors.

    If you don't want to come in direct contact, clean the pen with a good metal cleaner, and the coat it with Rennaissance wax. Maybe that comes with a warning too.
    I hear you on that. Especially brutal with the auto parts. I typically ignore that as well, but I literally hold this pen for hours each day in college which is the main reason I have concern. If I hardly used it I would likely worry less. Shame though, this isn't the nicest pen I have but it has become my favorite. May need to research another inexpensive daily driver. I will read the wiki tonight for sure, and at some point see if there is anything I can do to test the pen.

  14. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    California Central Coast
    Posts
    652
    Thanks
    2,403
    Thanked 1,124 Times in 428 Posts
    Rep Power
    9

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    IMHO, I wouldn't worry about it. From what I have read, the transfer of inorganic lead salts through human skin is very inefficient. Inorganic Lead absorption that most people read about has more to do with ingestion through either drinking water, lead paint chips, or inhalation through fine lead dust. The human lungs and stomach ( bile salts ) have such a large surface area that makes tranfer of lead into the blood stream much easier. Organic lead, such as tetraethyl-lead (think leaded gas from years ago), is much much nastier and can easily absorb through skin and mucous membranes. Brass doesn't contain this.

    If your raw brass pen was manufactured by a major european manufacturer (Kaweco), then the metal content would be strictly regulated and enforced under EU regulations. [ BTW, just don't suck on the end of your pen like some people tend to do with plastic pens, LOL! ]

    Just my two pence.

    All the Best.
    -- A retired analytical chemist with 30+ years experience analyzing for metals/heavy metals in different substrates.
    Last edited by junglejim; October 27th, 2021 at 01:46 PM. Reason: spelling, as usual...

  15. The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to junglejim For This Useful Post:

    alexgalexg (November 10th, 2021), Bibliophile (October 28th, 2021), damfino (November 16th, 2021), elaineb (October 28th, 2021), fountainpenkid (October 27th, 2021), titrisol (November 24th, 2021)

  16. #11
    Senior Member grainweevil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Cornwall, UK
    Posts
    1,572
    Thanks
    269
    Thanked 885 Times in 461 Posts
    Rep Power
    12

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by alexgalexg View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by silverlifter View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by alexgalexg View Post
    My edc pen is made entirely of raw brass...
    Which pen? Kaweco, for example, uses Eco-Brass in their pens, which has negligble lead content (but is more expensive). Cheaper clones, on the other hand, would be a very different story.
    Brass Pen from Machine Era Company. They don't display and lead info that I could find.
    You could try asking them.
    In the words of Paul Simon, you can call me Al.

  17. #12
    Senior Member joolstacho's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Posts
    117
    Thanks
    30
    Thanked 91 Times in 41 Posts
    Rep Power
    5

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Whilst I respect everyone's opinion... Surely, we can be TOO careful can't we?
    Paranoia?

  18. #13
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Location
    Clinging desperately to planet Earth
    Posts
    474
    Thanks
    36
    Thanked 474 Times in 281 Posts
    Rep Power
    8

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by joolstacho View Post
    Whilst I respect everyone's opinion... Surely, we can be TOO careful can't we?
    Paranoia?
    The family-wide comment about my daughter is that she thinks the paranoids are chasing her.

  19. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    401
    Thanks
    134
    Thanked 216 Times in 132 Posts
    Rep Power
    11

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by An old bloke View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by alexgalexg View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Stands on Feet View Post
    The Wikipedia article on brass discusses lead content. California limits lead content to 0.25%. "Raw" brass is brass that isn't coated with lacquer, so I can understand why you're worried. Even brass keys can evidently be a problem.
    I may have to do a little investigation as to how I could test for lead without damaging the pen, as well as if there is a way to remove it. I have used this pen daily since I bought it for college over the summer and I have to take a lot of notes. Spends a lot of time in my hand. Best switch to something else for the meantime. Surprising in this day and age to have something so dangerous being unknown to most (even to manufacturers).
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but brass is a copper alloy that contains lead. As such, one cannot remove the lead. Pewter is another alloy that contains lead.

    My suggestion is the simple solution of spraying or painting the cap and barrel (and section if necessary) with a clear lacquer or spark varnish.

    Not all pewter has lead in it. I believe modern pewter used for food ware does not. I forget what they put in instead, but I had to research this for re-enactors...

  20. #15
    Member alexgalexg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Location
    Connecticut USA
    Posts
    39
    Thanks
    19
    Thanked 13 Times in 8 Posts
    Rep Power
    0

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Hi all, just a little update. The day I made this post was the same day I contacted Machine Era Co about the lead content. They have had beyond adequate time to respond but have failed to do so. At some point in the near future I will look into purchasing a lead test kit and find out once and for all if this pen contains it. Based on how they have reacted to the question, I have a feeling I already know the answer. Very unfortunate, I enjoyed writing with it.

    To address those who feel that this concern is a bit excessive, consider the fact that children may use this product. Consider that for me, even though I am an adult I am in college and held this pen for hours at a time. Do I think you are completely doomed if you use this pen? Of course not, but I don't think I should be just asking for a problem.

    Anyways, I am a busy guy and likely wont update on the subject for a while. But I do intend to test this pen and will let you know the good, bad and ugly accordingly.

  21. The Following User Says Thank You to alexgalexg For This Useful Post:

    damfino (November 16th, 2021)

  22. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Location
    Clinging desperately to planet Earth
    Posts
    474
    Thanks
    36
    Thanked 474 Times in 281 Posts
    Rep Power
    8

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by alexgalexg View Post
    Hi all, just a little update. The day I made this post was the same day I contacted Machine Era Co about the lead content. They have had beyond adequate time to respond but have failed to do so. At some point in the near future I will look into purchasing a lead test kit and find out once and for all if this pen contains it. Based on how they have reacted to the question, I have a feeling I already know the answer. Very unfortunate, I enjoyed writing with it.

    To address those who feel that this concern is a bit excessive, consider the fact that children may use this product. Consider that for me, even though I am an adult I am in college and held this pen for hours at a time. Do I think you are completely doomed if you use this pen? Of course not, but I don't think I should be just asking for a problem.

    Anyways, I am a busy guy and likely wont update on the subject for a while. But I do intend to test this pen and will let you know the good, bad and ugly accordingly.
    Might I suggest that their lack of a reply means that they have no idea what the lead content of the brass they use is?

    Have you considered, as previously suggested, simply coating the surfaces which you touch with a clear finish such as a marine spar varnish? That, to my thinking, would resolve any possible lead transference issues.

  23. #17
    Member alexgalexg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Location
    Connecticut USA
    Posts
    39
    Thanks
    19
    Thanked 13 Times in 8 Posts
    Rep Power
    0

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by An old bloke View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by alexgalexg View Post
    Hi all, just a little update. The day I made this post was the same day I contacted Machine Era Co about the lead content. They have had beyond adequate time to respond but have failed to do so. At some point in the near future I will look into purchasing a lead test kit and find out once and for all if this pen contains it. Based on how they have reacted to the question, I have a feeling I already know the answer. Very unfortunate, I enjoyed writing with it.

    To address those who feel that this concern is a bit excessive, consider the fact that children may use this product. Consider that for me, even though I am an adult I am in college and held this pen for hours at a time. Do I think you are completely doomed if you use this pen? Of course not, but I don't think I should be just asking for a problem.

    Anyways, I am a busy guy and likely wont update on the subject for a while. But I do intend to test this pen and will let you know the good, bad and ugly accordingly.
    Might I suggest that their lack of a reply means that they have no idea what the lead content of the brass they use is?

    Have you considered, as previously suggested, simply coating the surfaces which you touch with a clear finish such as a marine spar varnish? That, to my thinking, would resolve any possible lead transference issues.
    Due to the design of the pen, coating it wouldn't hold up well. Brass is only 1 of 2 options they offer products in, although it's certainly possible that they don't know I think it's giving a little too much benefit of the doubt. Lead tester is like $9, we had a very wet summer and some of my classic cars suffered from the humidity. Need to go there for some supplies to manage interior humidity anyways so I will pick up the testers when that time comes. The pen wasn't that expensive, hence why it was my daily use at college pen. I will just get a different pen if it comes back positive.

  24. #18
    Senior Member Detman101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Location
    Lost...help.
    Posts
    718
    Thanks
    1,566
    Thanked 590 Times in 294 Posts
    Rep Power
    4

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Interesting.
    This may be more of a subtle killer than my idea for a pen made of raw Osmium...
    Will add this to the handbook.
    Last edited by Detman101; November 15th, 2021 at 08:35 AM.
    "I can only improve my self, not the world."

  25. #19
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2020
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    51
    Thanks
    16
    Thanked 55 Times in 31 Posts
    Rep Power
    4

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by Detman101 View Post
    Interesting.
    This may be more of a subtle killer than my idea for a pen made of raw Osmium...
    Will add this to the handbook.
    You may want to look into that some more. When I was a kid, we clinched lead sinkers on our fishing lines with our teeth. I handled a lot of lead wheel weights and breathed a lot of tetraethyl fumes when I worked at a service station in the 50's. I ain't dead yet. I think it would take a lot of lead to kill someone.

  26. The Following User Says Thank You to Parsimonious For This Useful Post:

    Detman101 (November 15th, 2021)

  27. #20
    Senior Member Detman101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Location
    Lost...help.
    Posts
    718
    Thanks
    1,566
    Thanked 590 Times in 294 Posts
    Rep Power
    4

    Default Re: Raw Brass Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by Parsimonious View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Detman101 View Post
    Interesting.
    This may be more of a subtle killer than my idea for a pen made of raw Osmium...
    Will add this to the handbook.
    You may want to look into that some more. When I was a kid, we clinched lead sinkers on our fishing lines with our teeth. I handled a lot of lead wheel weights and breathed a lot of tetraethyl fumes when I worked at a service station in the 50's. I ain't dead yet. I think it would take a lot of lead to kill someone.
    Interesting...duly noted.
    My original plans will suffice as they are proven.
    "I can only improve my self, not the world."

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •