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Thread: Why big nibs?

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    Default Why big nibs?

    I have several pens with large nibs: King of Pen, M1000, MB149. I'm not actually sure why I enjoy them so much, but I do. Functionally they don't seem to me to do too much aside from moving the hand slightly farther away from the paper. I mostly just like the way they look. I really want to get a Namiki Emperor as well, and the enormous nib is a fair part of my interest in it. Is there actually any functional reason to use larger nibs, or is it just an aesthetic thing? I don't know any of the history regarding nib size.

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    Senior Member Jon Szanto's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    Quote Originally Posted by scud80 View Post
    I have several pens with large nibs: King of Pen, M1000, MB149. I'm not actually sure why I enjoy them so much, but I do. Functionally they don't seem to me to do too much aside from moving the hand slightly farther away from the paper. I mostly just like the way they look. I really want to get a Namiki Emperor as well, and the enormous nib is a fair part of my interest in it. Is there actually any functional reason to use larger nibs, or is it just an aesthetic thing? I don't know any of the history regarding nib size.
    The longer the nib, the more character there can be to the writing experience based upon how the manufacturer uses that length. Different nib geometries/shapes, as well as differences in what metals are included in the gold alloy, can lead to dramatic differences in how the nibs write.

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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    Quote Originally Posted by mathew View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by scud80 View Post
    I have several pens with large nibs: King of Pen, M1000, MB149. I'm not actually sure why I enjoy them so much, but I do. Functionally they don't seem to me to do too much aside from moving the hand slightly farther away from the paper. I mostly just like the way they look. I really want to get a Namiki Emperor as well, and the enormous nib is a fair part of my interest in it. Is there actually any functional reason to use larger nibs, or is it just an aesthetic thing? I don't know any of the history regarding nib size.
    The longer the nib, the more character there can be to the writing experience based upon how the manufacturer uses that length. Different nib geometries/shapes, as well as differences in what metals are included in the gold alloy, can lead to dramatic differences in how the nibs write.
    I don’t agree to this statements.

    “Character” is not bound to nib size at all.

    Look e.g. at this tiny 100 year old Waterman, this tiny pen with it’s tiny nib has massive character.
    In fact it is one of my all time favorite nibs, one of my best (maybe the best) flex nib I own.

    Show_response_868

    (Waterman 12 1/2 ..... J. Herbin Emerald of Chivor)


    Also a specific nib material is not bound to any specific attribute of the nib.
    To say e.g. gold nibs feel soft or …. Is completely nonsense (you also always write with the tipping material, the nib material does not touch the paper).
    There are gold nails and steel nails as well as gold flex nibs and steel flex nibs.

    e.g. this vintage Degussa full flex steel nib (Hosted in a modern Guider Marsala body)…. Also not a huge nib….

    Frankenpen_Response_02

    (Guider Marala - Degussa Vintage Full Flex Steel Nib)


    IMO the size of a nib is more a design option than anything else.
    Also a matter of personal preference, but not related to specific nib attributes,

    Last but not least pen manufacturers can take much more money for bigger pens, as it seems to be deeply engraved into many brains that bigger is better (and more expensive).
    For sure the size of the nib/pen does not correlate with the material value, the additional material value is marginal between a big and a small pen.

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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    I Like Big Nibs and I Cannot Lie

    I'm not so sure why, but in my case I think it is simple aesthetics. It's hard to make King of Pen or MB 149 nibs look small, but I do have a couple that accomplish that. Left to Right in photo are King of Pen, Montblanc 149, Namiki Emperor (#50), and Tohma Hachikuma (#55)


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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    Big nibs looks cool on the right-sized pens. If you like big nibs for the looks, then go for them.

    But the size has nothing to do with what the nib can produce.

    If anything after years of restoring vintage pens, I learn to *never* underestimate small nibs. Some of the best flexible nibs are downright tiny.
    - Will
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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Szanto View Post
    Is that your daily driver, Jon?
    Last edited by Blue Note; November 6th, 2021 at 10:03 AM.

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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    Most of my big nib experience is with 149s.

    I've had MBs ranging from the tiny little #2 nibs on the 142 as well as the "butterfly nibs" of the 12/14/22/24 on up to #9s on 149s. I've written a lot with 146s and other pens with MB #6 nibs(like a lot of the LEs).

    To me, there's something very special about the overall feel of the big MB nibs. That's not to say that the smaller ones lack character-far from it. It's just that 149s write like no other MB I've used.

    There's a strange aesthetic that makes that nib really work on the 149 sized pen too.

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    Senior Member Jon Szanto's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Note View Post
    Is that your daily driver, Jon?
    Hahahaha... nope.

    As to nibs, I think big nibs have a place, and that is usually in a big pen. I get that some people like that it puts distance between hand and nib and paper, but that has a lot to do with the barrel design as well. The only thing I raise my eyebrows at are people who chase big nibs just to have big nibs in their pens, even if the nib is aesthetically too large. At least a portion of these cases is compensation for being small in other areas and bragging rights. That kind of behavior is just lame to me, but to each their own.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Szanto View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Note View Post
    Is that your daily driver, Jon?
    Hahahaha... nope.

    As to nibs, I think big nibs have a place, and that is usually in a big pen. I get that some people like that it puts distance between hand and nib and paper, but that has a lot to do with the barrel design as well.
    I agree that a big nib needs to fit in an appropriately sized pen.

    If you look at the stereotypical "big pen", the 149, the nib just fits the overall "package" of the pen. After looking at a bunch of them, I can generally "spot" a 149 nib from a photo without any scale reference based on the overall proportions of the nib. With that said, if I put up a photo of either a 146 or 149(or 147...) without anything else for scale/reference many people without experience handling these pens would struggle to tell which it was.

    Much the same can be said of comparing an M800 to an M1000, or a 1911L to a KOP.

    My point in all of this is that those three pens have "scaled" the nib size roughly in proportion to the rest of the pen. Not all the big nib pens do that overly well.

    Along those same lines, I have a Ranga 9B(premium ebonite), which is a pen I like on the whole. Mine has a Ranga Flex nib on it, which I think is #6 sized(and looks a whole lot like an Ahab nib) but most Ranga pens in general are made with #6 nibs from Ranga, Bock, or Schmidt. That nib looks okay in relation to the stepped-down section(which I actually find comfortable on that pen-I don't like them in general) but to my eye it looks awfully small on the pen as a whole.

    I feel much the same too about a lot of the newer MB Great Characters and the like pens, which are chunky pens with 146(#6) size nibs.

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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    Quote Originally Posted by bunnspecial View Post
    I agree that a big nib needs to fit in an appropriately sized pen.
    To be clear, I'm not really even addressing the situations where a brand new LARGE pen comes with a corresponding LARGE nibs. No, it is more a case of watching people modding other over-the-counter pens and trying to swap in the biggest nib they can. There's a whole fad of putting #8 nibs in pocket pens. It looks stupid (to me) and can't have anything really in the way of functionality beyond "because I can" and macho swagger.
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    In I favor medium-small like a 140, standard like a P-75 or 400 or medium large like a Osmia 76 or a Pelikan 600, I'm not into big pens and or big nibs. I do have a 1000 and a 149, some 146's.

    I have what we'd call today a medium large...actually looks smaller than it measures so a large pre'24 MB Safety Pen with a #6 Simplo nib that really looks big when it is twisted out of the pen.
    I would have thought the pen medium-large, if that, until I put it next to a 800....and the old nib is bigger.
    The nib does look a bit big for the pen, but it is a Weak Kneed Wet Noodle, and that then perhaps was the normal size of a nib for a Safety Pen of that era. What we grew up with influences what we think of as a big nib, the youth who grew up with large pens as their standard ones, don't see a 149's nib as big as I do.

    I did have one bigger than a 149's nib on a no name pen, but I gave it away.....the nib was just way too big for me, and I didn't keep it long enough to become accustomed to it.




    With permission of Penboard.de they make great pictures, I don't. My '30's Fend Safety Pen has a smaller nib. Yet is not much longer. And only slightly thinner, but the nib size seems better matched. My 18 K rolled Gold Fendomatic has a slightly different chased pattern than the one shown.
    Last edited by BoBo Olson; November 6th, 2021 at 04:13 PM.

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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    Mabie Todd & Co - Swan Safety Screw Cap (1915)-2.gif
    I have to admit that I LOVE big oversized pens...they just fit my hand better.
    However, the only nibs that have stood the test of time are my #2 Mabie Todd Swan flex and my #5 Delike Alpha stub. Both miniscule pens...
    All of my large flex nibs have presented some issue given enough time and use...while the Swan keeps doing it's thing without failing.
    It says a lot about quality and the fact that it's Gold speaks volumes to me. If it were only bigger it would be my #1 pen...sadly, I can't write with it more than a paragraph without hand cramps.

    So in the end...for me...Bigger just feels better.
    (hahaha...that's what she said!)

    [couldn't resist...lol]
    Last edited by Detman101; November 6th, 2021 at 04:57 PM.
    "I can only improve my self, not the world."

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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    Because, whatever anyone says, size matters.

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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    Large brain.

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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    You know what they say.... big nib, big feed.
    Wouldn't the bigger feed give the potential for better ink flow, slower dry out?

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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wile E Coyote View Post
    Because, whatever anyone says, size matters.
    Size impress(es).

    Whether that impression will matter in the long run or not, that's a different discussion.
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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    Quote Originally Posted by mathew View Post

    The longer the nib, the more character there can be to the writing experience based upon how the manufacturer uses that length. Different nib geometries/shapes, as well as differences in what metals are included in the gold alloy, can lead to dramatic differences in how the nibs write.
    Actually, I think there is something to it.
    Of course, there are other factors like geometry and grinding that give a nib character, but size is not to be underrated at all, especially when it comes to flexibility. The larger the nib, the greater the possible line variance.



    And yes, of course there are also aesthetic reasons.

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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    Bragging rights

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    Default Re: Why big nibs?

    If the aesthetics of nib size was based on proportion to other elements of the pen, then presumably there would be a formula for a pen that has perfectly balanced elements. Just a thought.

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