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Thread: The pivot begins...

  1. #21
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Quote Originally Posted by dneal View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Naill View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by dneal View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Naill View Post

    I just posted Ham to show that your practice is your practice and not some sort of honor code or suggestion that your're objective. It is just what you want to do, pure and simple. No need to hide behind the flag @dneal.
    It's still a fallacious appeal to authority - i.e.: You're right and I'm wrong because General Ham said so.
    You still ignore the other side of the coin - that other prominent generals chose otherwise.
    You still think mocking through straw man is a rational argument.
    I still maintain my position, for the reasons I have conveyed. I made an ethical decision on what I will and won't do. No hiding behind anything.
    Give it a rest, @dneal. You says something that unsupported just like your abstracted Sowell quotes. When you are found out you go off.
    You took Ham out of context, and ignored his reference to generals who present the opposing argument. Hypocrisy is your forte though…
    I provided a complete article. I could have provided others that do not follow your tactic to appear superior by not voting. Plus, former generals are serving in both Democrat and Republican administrations.

    One thing I have noticed about your posts, you will try your best not to inform or discuss, you only intent appears to support your fringe position.

    Yes, I tend to use examples from one topic to the other because with your posts, I must verify regardless of the topic. I am not saying you intentionally mislead. but you do seem to read with a subjective eye.

  2. #22
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_of_Clouds View Post
    Last prediction: those who swing with the shift in narrative will argue they have always thought that ("that" being whatever the narrative changes to). I almost predicted the "this article tells us what we already know" comment correctly. I just thought it would be TSherbs instead of EoC.
    That's really funny because I totally predicted you would essay this line of argument.


    The reality is that for those who work in related fields and/or are experts in related fields, the fuzziness of disease expression and course in populations has been known and understood for a very long time. Only people with the mindset of Trump (just as a convenient example) would publicly state that a pandemic would just stop or go away. While we may hope to eradicate a particular pathogen - smallpox comes to mind - the more pragmatic approach has been to mitigate effects and attempt to reduce the status of a pandemic (or any infectious disease). Spanish flu still exists, bubonic plague still exists, polio still exists, the list could go on and on. None of them just 'went away one day'. This is a matter of historical record.

    So, no. From the general perspective of the relevant sciences what the article says does not represent a swing in the narrative. Where the narrative is swinging - and I am by no means being comprehensive here - is in the media, in politics, and among various activists.



    Edited: to rephrase
    I had the same thought.

    I doubt anyone keeping up with politics and/or medical science will change what they think about viruses and infectious disease in general. The greatest error was to try to deminish people who chose as their professions as servants in the area of the many facets of healthcare and instead supported know nothing politicans with one intent to be re-elected.

    Nor will anyone think we should have drank bleach or other insane suggestions. Thank God that there are professionals that refused to bend and stayed in the job and suffer disrespect. It is a wonder some Jan 6 person didn't kill them.

  3. #23
    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Anyone keeping up with [American] politics should know who MSNBC’s prime time anchor is - the first African American woman to be one, by the way.
    "A truth does not mind being questioned. A lie does not like being challenged."

  4. #24
    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Naill
    One thing I have noticed about your posts, you will try your best not to inform or discuss, you only intent appears to support your fringe position.
    Irony, it’s what’s for breakfast.
    "A truth does not mind being questioned. A lie does not like being challenged."

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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    At least you have the gumption not to deny.

  6. #26
    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Naill View Post
    At least you have the gumption not to deny.
    Deny what? That you do the very thing you accuse others of? I'd label it accurately as projection, but some folks apparently are tired of me pointing that out.

    Nope, I don't deny that.
    "A truth does not mind being questioned. A lie does not like being challenged."

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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Quote Originally Posted by dneal View Post
    Anyone keeping up with [American] politics should know who MSNBC’s prime time anchor is - the first African American woman to be one, by the way.
    If by "one" you mean "prime time anchor," who is also African American, then, no. Gwen Ifill came before Reid and helped to pave the way for her.

  8. #28
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Quote Originally Posted by TSherbs View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by dneal View Post
    Anyone keeping up with [American] politics should know who MSNBC’s prime time anchor is - the first African American woman to be one, by the way.
    If by "one" you mean "prime time anchor," who is also African American, then, no. Gwen Ifill came before Reid and helped to pave the way for her.
    He would not have ever heard of Ms. Ifill. She passed too soon.

  9. #29
    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Quote Originally Posted by TSherbs View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by dneal View Post
    Anyone keeping up with [American] politics should know who MSNBC’s prime time anchor is - the first African American woman to be one, by the way.
    If by "one" you mean "prime time anchor," who is also African American, then, no. Gwen Ifill came before Reid and helped to pave the way for her.
    I mean prime time anchor, without air-quotes. A major news network's 7pm slot. Gwen Ifill hosted a 30 minute weekly show on PBS. Not the same.
    "A truth does not mind being questioned. A lie does not like being challenged."

  10. #30
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Quote Originally Posted by dneal View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Naill View Post
    At least you have the gumption not to deny.
    Deny what? That you do the very thing you accuse others of? I'd label it accurately as projection, but some folks apparently are tired of me pointing that out.

    Nope, I don't deny that.
    That the statement you posted reminded two of us of what we would have expected you to do was what you said others would do. Please keep up. It is like the time we all found out you didn't vote for Trump after supporting him for years. Your fake military thing lets you hide behind the flag, but we always knew you were the man behind the curtain.

    You remind me of a member on another non moderated forum. This person was a flat earth theorist and Trump supporter. He didn't vote for him either. We discussed space and flat earth theory for what seemed like a decade. Funny thing, I dispelled his nonsense so much I learned a lot about space travel...LOL!! Don't ask me about the Van Allen Belt.....

  11. #31
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Quote Originally Posted by dneal View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by TSherbs View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by dneal View Post
    Anyone keeping up with [American] politics should know who MSNBC’s prime time anchor is - the first African American woman to be one, by the way.
    If by "one" you mean "prime time anchor," who is also African American, then, no. Gwen Ifill came before Reid and helped to pave the way for her.
    I mean prime time anchor, without air-quotes. A major news network's 7pm slot. Gwen Ifill hosted a 30 minute weekly show on PBS. Not the same.
    "On August 6, 2013, NewsHour named Ifill and Judy Woodruff as co-anchors and co-managing editors. They shared anchor duties Monday through Thursday; Woodruff was the sole anchor on Friday.[33] In November 2015, Ifill was the master of ceremonies at the 2015 LBJ Liberty & Justice For All Award ceremony.[34]"

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gwen_Ifill

  12. #32
    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    There's a lot of ad hominem and straw man in there Chuck.

    If you want to make random assertions, that's ok with me. Let's take a moment and dissect these.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Naill
    That the statement you posted reminded two of us of what we would have expected you to do was what you said others would do.
    Not sure what statement you are referring to. I posted my prediction, and I noted another that I had not posted (sometimes I send them in a PM to another member). Here's an example:

    Experiment.jpg

    In the second (in this thread) I also admitted what I got wrong. I have no idea why you latched on to "predictions", but here we are.

    Anyway, it's more diversion from the topic that you (and the other) habitually engage in.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Naill
    It is like the time we all found out you didn't vote for Trump after supporting him for years.
    Feel free to cite your evidence for that claim. I have stated that I think he's an obnoxious person, but I agree with many of his policies. I stated that I did not vote for him.

    Right now, that's just a straw man, attempting to point out some invented hypocrisy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Naill
    Your fake military thing lets you hide behind the flag, but we always knew you were the man behind the curtain.
    This doesn't even make any sense (man behind the curtain???) but is more straw man with a little ad hominem sprinkled in. Just more baseless accusations.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Naill
    You remind me of a member on another non moderated forum. This person was a flat earth theorist and Trump supporter. He didn't vote for him either. We discussed space and flat earth theory for what seemed like a decade. Funny thing, I dispelled his nonsense so much I learned a lot about space travel...LOL!! Don't ask me about the Van Allen Belt.....
    More straw man and ad hominem. It's getting a little pathetic. You have yet to dispel anything. You distract or run away when your nonsense is disproven. Still waiting for you to answer about that NIH article on ivermectin you posted. How's that foot doing?

    SO BACK ON TOPIC:

    I see the left-leaning media shift away from the "we have to do this list of things to end the pandemic" narrative. Do you need evidence that they held this position? I'll provide it. Do you deny that they are shifting their narrative?
    "A truth does not mind being questioned. A lie does not like being challenged."

  13. #33
    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Naill View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by dneal View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by TSherbs View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by dneal View Post
    Anyone keeping up with [American] politics should know who MSNBC’s prime time anchor is - the first African American woman to be one, by the way.
    If by "one" you mean "prime time anchor," who is also African American, then, no. Gwen Ifill came before Reid and helped to pave the way for her.
    I mean prime time anchor, without air-quotes. A major news network's 7pm slot. Gwen Ifill hosted a 30 minute weekly show on PBS. Not the same.
    "On August 6, 2013, NewsHour named Ifill and Judy Woodruff as co-anchors and co-managing editors. They shared anchor duties Monday through Thursday; Woodruff was the sole anchor on Friday.[33] In November 2015, Ifill was the master of ceremonies at the 2015 LBJ Liberty & Justice For All Award ceremony.[34]"

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gwen_Ifill
    Judy Woodruff was the anchor. Gwen Ifill came on as the co-anchor. Gwen Ifill took over the Week in Review roundtable. All of that was on PBS.

    Do you claim that PBS is equivalent to the major news networks? Fox/CNN/Newsmax/MSNBC (not to mention the broadcast networks ABC/NBC/CBS)?

    Do you claim that being added as a co-host, or getting a one-day a week show is equivalent to getting your own prime-time show (The ReidOut, which replaced Chris Matthews' Hardball)?

    Are you (and TSherbs) that desperate to score a "win", no matter how pedantic or disingenuous?

    Is there some reason you guys are incapable of following an OP topic?
    "A truth does not mind being questioned. A lie does not like being challenged."

  14. #34
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    A co-anchor position is an anchor.

    Oh hell yes, for vetted information PBS is as good as it gets. I’m smart enough to listen .

    I stopped listening to Rush et al by the late ‘90’s.

    Don’t listen to NPR or PBS if you are looking for a source to tell you what you want to hear. And learn to read why people think as they do that don’t agree with your world view.

  15. #35
    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    False equivalency, parsing, introduction of the irrelevant (Rush), and admonition with a little ad hominem. Simply more deflection from the topic of the thread.

    It's amazing that you can expend this much effort on the diversions, but not the topics themselves. Perhaps I have discovered what is consuming your time, which you repeatedly claim to not want to waste.
    "A truth does not mind being questioned. A lie does not like being challenged."

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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Small apology to dneal about focussing on the science aspects of the OP. Being in various related fields over my entire working lifetime it was natural for me to respond to it that way. Of course, I agree from the other perspectives that the narrative is changing, but suggest that this - as a behaviour - is not at all uncommon in politics.

  17. #37
    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_of_Clouds View Post
    Small apology to dneal about focussing on the science aspects of the OP. Being in various related fields over my entire working lifetime it was natural for me to respond to it that way. Of course, I agree from the other perspectives that the narrative is changing, but suggest that this - as a behaviour - is not at all uncommon in politics.
    Thanks. I agree it’s typical politics (well, “typical” in the context of today’s politics). If one compares it to a game (not to diminish the seriousness of it), it’s interesting to watch the choice of plays.
    "A truth does not mind being questioned. A lie does not like being challenged."

  18. #38
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Quote Originally Posted by dneal View Post

    Are you (and TSherbs) that desperate to score a "win", no matter how pedantic or disingenuous?
    No Winners In These Back Pages

  19. The Following User Says Thank You to TSherbs For This Useful Post:

    dneal (November 27th, 2021)

  20. #39
    Senior Member Chip's Avatar
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Curious that someone who claims not to vote thinks in political terms of winners and losers.

    How do you keep score?

  21. #40
    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: The pivot begins...

    Easy. Every time you post an off topic, pathetic attempt at insult; I deduct a point.
    "A truth does not mind being questioned. A lie does not like being challenged."

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