Is FPGeeks still a pleasant place to stay?

[Empty_of_Clouds]

EoC - when you only post in other people's words, it feels inauthentic. Also, sometimes the quote seems more pertinent to your growth than to others. It's only a request - is not a demand. I do like the quotes, I just want more EoC.

Typos courtesy of Samsung Auto-Incorrect™

Sorry, Lloyd, I may not properly understand this. The words I am quoting are as authentic as you can get. Do you mean not authentically me? They may not be my words but they do actually represent the authentic me that you are now seeing since I dropped all other masks at yours (and others) request.

This reflects a little of my personal struggles over the last couple of years:

Wake up see the morning light
This is you
This is today
You try so hard to get it right
Can't help thinking somewhere you lost your way
When was the last time
You saw a smile ?
There's a scream on every silent face you see
They're singing set me free

Excerpt from Set Me Free by Chris Rea

[Jon Szanto]

Which "irony" did you mean here, Jon?

Both the narrow/specific and the larger/meta juxtaposition.

I find the statement ironic when specifically contrasted with the thread - and original post intent - title. I also find it ironic in a very meta sense: here we are, in a place where people of a like interest - fountain pens, of all things! - have come together to share that experience and converse with each other, an expression of our interest that should bring much joy, only to find the insufferable fights and behaviors that have become all too common. Can this "pleasant place" still be found?

I really don't know anymore. I've lost the will to walk through a minefield just to be among people who share this common interest.

I hope that makes it clear, TSherbs. And I've decided this is my last comment in the thread.

[TSherbs]

Which "irony" did you mean here, Jon?

Both the narrow/specific and the larger/meta juxtaposition.

I find the statement ironic when specifically contrasted with the thread - and original post intent - title. I also find it ironic in a very meta sense: here we are, in a place where people of a like interest - fountain pens, of all things! - have come together to share that experience and converse with each other, an expression of our interest that should bring much joy, only to find the insufferable fights and behaviors that have become all too common. Can this "pleasant place" still be found?

I really don't know anymore. I've lost the will to walk through a minefield just to be among people who share this common interest.

I hope that makes it clear, TSherbs. And I've decided this is my last comment in the thread.

Peace, brother.

[Empty_of_Clouds]

Which "irony" did you mean here, Jon?

Both the narrow/specific and the larger/meta juxtaposition.

I find the statement ironic when specifically contrasted with the thread - and original post intent - title. I also find it ironic in a very meta sense: here we are, in a place where people of a like interest - fountain pens, of all things! - have come together to share that experience and converse with each other, an expression of our interest that should bring much joy, only to find the insufferable fights and behaviors that have become all too common. Can this "pleasant place" still be found?

I really don't know anymore. I've lost the will to walk through a minefield just to be among people who share this common interest.

I hope that makes it clear, TSherbs. And I've decided this is my last comment in the thread.

Hello Jon. Thank you for adding this reminder of the purpose of the wider website (excluding the Lounge of course which is for conversations on other subjects). To answer your question 'Can this "pleasant place" still be found? I believe the answer is a resounding yes! I'm working toward this myself and would love to see others chipping in with whatever they can manage.

Be well.

[Farmboy]

And yet, @EoC: I would rather hear from you in your own voice than the most beautiful quotes or creative personas.

...


To put something else to rest, the personas I play with, the alternative modes of writing, are all just exercises in creative writing and expression. Designing and implementing an 'alternate self' is relatively easy with regard to setting rules on language and sentence composition. The really hard thing to do though it write entirely from a perspective that differs from one's own. Occasionally someone may pick up on my nuances in an alternate persona and the gig is up! Though these days I have greater success with creating a more complete character than in the past, and are almost impossible to detect by others.

That is the explanation of this exercise directly from the author, and is definitive.

I thought I heard it was an AI bot responding and not a person(a).

[Chip]

I'm a writer and I put your AI bot alternate self on Ignore. Fun for you, perhaps, but bloody tiresome for me.

Being tired of the pro-writing trudge, I created a persona on an original writing website and posted an S/F novel, a mystery series, some novellas, ten short stories, and a bunch of poems.

Got thousands of readers and many encouraging comments.

Some might call it meta-fiction. I call it fun.

[Empty_of_Clouds]

Horses for courses.

As a professional writer your work is presumably in the public domain. I am sure I am not the only one here who would be interested in reading your work. How about a link?

I've written and published a few shorts and some poetry, generally well received. Which was nice because as I noted earlier I don't consider myself a good writer - humility precludes it.


Regarding the AI, its algorithms are based on a program I wrote years ago - back when machine code was a thing, to give you some idea of how long ago (yes I am that old) - and over the years translations to other language and operating systems have resulted in some improvements, some losses, and strangely enough some mutated bits of code. Its most recent update was to mirror a very specific SF entity. What interested me during its stint here was that not a single reader picked up on this, even though the SF it's based on is familiar to literally millions of people. If I had placed that on a forum with a younger audience they would have spotted the homage immediately.

Even though it is running on software, and even though it has elements of self-learning, I still consider it one of my created personas.

As an amateur explorer of ideas I generally encourage others souls, regardless of whether I like or not their output. It is the act of creation that deserves respect.

[Lloyd]

Horses for courses.

As a professional writer your work is presumably in the public domain. I am sure I am not the only one here who would be interested in reading your work. How about a link?

I've written and published a few shorts and some poetry, generally well received. Which was nice because as I noted earlier I don't consider myself a good writer - humility precludes it.


Regarding the AI, its algorithms are based on a program I wrote years ago - back when machine code was a thing, to give you some idea of how long ago (yes I am that old) - and over the years translations to other language and operating systems have resulted in some improvements, some losses, and strangely enough some mutated bits of code. Its most recent update was to mirror a very specific SF entity. What interested me during its stint here was that not a single reader picked up on this, even though the SF it's based on is familiar to literally millions of people. If I had placed that on a forum with a younger audience they would have spotted the homage immediately.

Even though it is running on software, and even though it has elements of self-learning, I still consider it one of my created personas.

As an amateur explorer of ideas I generally encourage others souls, regardless of whether I like or not their output. It is the act of creation that deserves respect.

Did it translate your input text into the AI-like text? Can you post a few input-output pairings to show how it alters the inputs? Did you type (cut/paste) it's output into the forum entries?

Typos courtesy of Samsung Auto-Incorrect™

[Empty_of_Clouds]

Input text was cut/paste as is. Output was procedural. The program doesn't alter the inputs, it looks for keywords based on two criteria: database of keywords and database of associations, both of which are added to from inputs as well as updates I supply offline. Output was cut/paste back into the responses here most of the time, with occasional intervention for coherence (I'm not THAT good a programmer, though I once was a whole lot better). The input-output pairings are essentially what you saw on the screen.

[Lloyd]

You say it doesn't alter the inputs. Are the inputs your response to someone's prior post or someone's prior post? I think I would have appreciated the replies from it more if I knew it was algorithmic generated.

Typos courtesy of Samsung Auto-Incorrect™

[Empty_of_Clouds]

The inputs were the posts by others. These represent data-in. They are entered unaltered. The program is tasked with finding known keywords and matching these with archived associations from a large database of such. The output is procedural, as already stated. Sometimes the associations don't seem to make sense, but I leave them as is. The only editing of outputs that I do is when the sentence construction seems a little random.

[Lloyd]

That quite impressive, EoC! Does it use ML (machine learning) & NN (neutral network) schemes? If so, was the training data exclusively from FPG or even a specific subforum?

Typos courtesy of Samsung Auto-Incorrect™

[Chip]

As a professional writer your work is presumably in the public domain. I am sure I am not the only one here who would be interested in reading your work. How about a link?

Thanks for asking. My work's not in the public domain (not sure you get what that means), but under copyright. Most of it is available, in print or in e-book form.

I keep my published writing (five books, over a hundred articles and essays, a few short stories, about 40 poems) separate from my online activity.

I don't like being pestered about things in my books. Nor do I welcome approaches from people who want me to read their stuff, to get published, find an agent, etc. I still get frequent FaceBook friend requests from people with whom I've had neither a meeting nor correspondence, but who know me from my work. I've not set up an author website. I really don't want the attention, these days.

One reason I quit writing for a living is I got worn out by the need to cultivate public notice and the resulting exposure.

Whether that's non-attachment or simply shyness, I don't know.

[Farmboy]

I pointed my AI engine at this thread and it set a flag.

[Empty_of_Clouds]

As a professional writer your work is presumably in the public domain. I am sure I am not the only one here who would be interested in reading your work. How about a link?

Thanks for asking. My work's not in the public domain (not sure you get what that means), but under copyright. Most of it is available, in print or in e-book form.

I keep my published writing (five books, over a hundred articles and essays, a few short stories, about 40 poems) separate from my online activity.

I don't like being pestered about things in my books. Nor do I welcome approaches from people who want me to read their stuff, to get published, find an agent, etc. I still get frequent FaceBook friend requests from people with whom I've had neither a meeting nor correspondence, but who know me from my work. I've not set up an author website. I really don't want the attention, these days.

One reason I quit writing for a living is I got worn out by the need to cultivate public notice and the resulting exposure.

Whether that's non-attachment or simply shyness, I don't know.

I know what public domain means thanks, but I am using it in the broad sense of meaning your work is available to the public and not restricted to special interest groups. Just curious to read some of your work if you can point me in the direction of it. PM if you like, your privacy is assured.

I don't have any inclination to ask for your or any other author's opinions on anything I've written. Being published is not really an endorsement in that respect.

Anyway my query was entirely driven by curiosity. If a fellow forum member (any forum) claims to have written stuff for the public arena I am naturally interested (in the best possible sense) to read their stuff. There's no other agenda, and I am certainly not interested in offering critique.

[Empty_of_Clouds]

@Lloyd, when I wrote the original program I considered using an ML approach, but it was too restricted to predictive outputs to be of interest. So I wrote a modular system that crudely mimics a neural network and can be expanded with additional modules or altered by swapping modules. It is virtual (software based) only and runs on regular hardware. As a result it isn't terribly efficient and glitches more often than I would like. The program has 'evolved' much like a Heath Robinson device, with so much redundancy and seemingly random add-ons that I doubt it can be improved much further. A complete rebuild would probably be easier (for relative values of 'easy').

Anyway, as it wasn't intended to be predictive but reactive it has a rule set that defines its assumed perspective. Obviously this was a bit simplistic because it's a field I am not particularly versed in. Basically I gave it values to compare data against, and it 'decides' if it agrees or disagrees on a sliding scale.

I can't explain any better than that I'm afraid. It's the barest shadow of what is available (even to members of the public). With tweaking it can sometimes fool people that it's more alive than it really is.

[Lloyd]

Thanks, EoC. That's a fine enough explanation.👍

Typos courtesy of Samsung Auto-Incorrect™

[Empty_of_Clouds]

No problem. Happy to answer any questions if I am able to. My programming heyday was a long time ago though, and I haven't really kept current with developments in this subject area.

[Empty_of_Clouds]

Cause and effect.

A number of members have me on ignore (their choice of course), but the effect is that some threads will be devoid of their valuable insight and contributions, which impinges on all members. This action harms the website. A better solution would be to engage in the thread discussions (talking about pen related ones) and just don't respond to me. The optimal solution, it almost goes without the need to state it, is to seek accord.

[dneal]

You're not doing yourself any favors by bumping this thread with posts like that.