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Thread: Pen Filling Systems

  1. #21
    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    which part du you mean with "shaft"? the piston spindle? it is solid, not hollow.
    Yes. Is it slotted? I’m trying to figure out what prevents it from turning in sync with the knob, which would prevent it from operating properly. If they rely on friction from the piston, that seems problematic…

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    Senior Member christof's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    Quote Originally Posted by dneal View Post
    I’m trying to figure out what prevents it from turning in sync with the knob, which would prevent it from operating properly. If they rely on friction from the piston, that seems problematic…
    Yes, this is exactly what I wrote:

    Quote Originally Posted by christof View Post
    ...It needs the correct amount of friction between the seal and the barrel. If this is out of balance, it doesn't work anymore...

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    Senior Member RobJohnson's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    This thread may be drawing to a natural close, thank you all for sharing your knowledge and thoughts, if you had said at the start that Waterman would have been the most innovative in terms of filling systems I would have had my doubts.
    Last edited by RobJohnson; June 23rd, 2022 at 07:28 AM.

  4. #24
    Senior Member manoeuver's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    We're not going to even run down Sheaffer's fillers? I guess there may not be 7 or more, but let's get a count.

    Lever
    Touchdown
    Snorkel
    Vacuum
    Cart/converter

    there were more than that for sure, yeah? I'm not near as knowledgeable on this as many here.

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    Senior Member dneal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    Quote Originally Posted by christof View Post

    Yes, this is exactly what I wrote:

    Quote Originally Posted by christof View Post
    ...It needs the correct amount of friction between the seal and the barrel. If this is out of balance, it doesn't work anymore...
    Thanks. I wasn’t clear on what fails if it is ‘out of balance’.

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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    Quote Originally Posted by manoeuver View Post
    We're not going to even run down Sheaffer's fillers? I guess there may not be 7 or more, but let's get a count.

    Lever
    Touchdown
    Snorkel
    Vacuum
    Cart/converter

    there were more than that for sure, yeah? I'm not near as knowledgeable on this as many here.
    Hey, the Sheaffer sub-brand "Craig" made a coin filler in the teens, and some of the Wasp branded Sheaffer's of the 30s were twist fillers where a transparent blind cap and the section are attached to what is basically a cut off sac. The transparent end cap serves as the "ink window", as well as the rotating sac wringer.

    Bob

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    Senior Member Ron Z's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    Don't forget Sheaffer's weird, and thankfully short lived, accordion pump converter.

    Visit Main Street Pens
    A full service pen shop providing professional, thoughtful pen repair....

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    Senior Member christof's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    Quote Originally Posted by RobJohnson View Post
    This thread may be drawing to a natural close....
    May be we should invest some more time in this topic which seems quite interesting to me. I just added button filler to Waterman's. Did you know this? (Waterman - past and present - the first six decades by Max DAvis and Gary Lehrer, page 105)

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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    I am pleased that you are enjoying the thread, we may have found out that Waterman could be the champion, at least for the time being, so perhaps we can continue the thread to explore more unusual filling systems, even prototypes.

  14. #30
    Senior Member Robalone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    Hi. Just in case the thread closes…..there was a system called 'blow filler'. Did anyone mention this ?

    Sounds pretty gross !! Apparently one placed one’s mouth over a tiny hole at the end of the barrel, blew into it to compress the sac, then stuck the pen in the ink and released the pressure to allow the sac to take up ink …..

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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    Quote Originally Posted by Robalone View Post
    Hi. Just in case the thread closes…..there was a system called 'blow filler'. Did anyone mention this ?

    Sounds pretty gross !! Apparently one placed one’s mouth over a tiny hole at the end of the barrel, blew into it to compress the sac, then stuck the pen in the ink and released the pressure to allow the sac to take up ink …..
    Thanks for posting Rob, the only way that the thread will close is if the participants no longer want to be involved!

    In my opinion, there was a rich seam of innovation 1920-1940 and the best of times, with so many different ideas and patents.

    I would still like to own a pen with a filler that relied on a matchstick to compress a bar, this must have been so appropriate back in the days when smoking was compulsory.

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  18. #32
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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    Conid?

    Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk

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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    Quote Originally Posted by RobJohnson View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Robalone View Post
    Hi. Just in case the thread closes…..there was a system called 'blow filler'. Did anyone mention this ?

    Sounds pretty gross !! Apparently one placed one’s mouth over a tiny hole at the end of the barrel, blew into it to compress the sac, then stuck the pen in the ink and released the pressure to allow the sac to take up ink …..
    Thanks for posting Rob, the only way that the thread will close is if the participants no longer want to be involved!

    In my opinion, there was a rich seam of innovation 1920-1940 and the best of times, with so many different ideas and patents.

    I would still like to own a pen with a filler that relied on a matchstick to compress a bar, this must have been so appropriate back in the days when smoking was compulsory.
    Some of them had a built in "match stick" stuck on the top of the cap. Take a look at some of the early Weidlich pens. Even with the explanation they are still pretty odd looking. Some Matchstick fillers have a rotating sleeve to cover the hole. At some point the hole is big enough that the pen is a thumb filler/sleeve filler, or the hole is skinny enough that it is a coin filler. Can't think of any of these where a fake coin is growing out of the cap, but Waterman's did offer a special "coin" that fit on a watch or key chain for those who spent all their money on the pen. One guy put a pivoting match stick next to the slot so it wouldn't get lost. They call these lever fillers

    Sac and a pressure bar, started by Conklin, seems to achieve a blend of convenient use, easy fabrication and clean asthetics with the lever. if you didn't like the lever on the side, the button filler had its mechanism concealed by a blind cap. No further development of the sac and bar was really needed. Beyond this, most mechanical means of compressing the sac are pretty fanciful and trivial. Hatchet fillers, paddle fillers, pull fillers, eccentric and cam fillers, articulated buttons, tab fillers, crescents, humps, bumps, lumps and etc. There is even a variant of the Parker-style button filler where a rotating crown wheel (as in a verge watch), depresses and releases the spring bar every quarter turn. Ka Twang!

    Perhaps I can do a dive into some of these, here and there, a pen at a time with pics. But really, the material already is out there if one wants to find it.

    Bob

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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    Quote Originally Posted by Robalone View Post
    Hi. Just in case the thread closes…..there was a system called 'blow filler'. Did anyone mention this ?

    Sounds pretty gross !! Apparently one placed one’s mouth over a tiny hole at the end of the barrel, blew into it to compress the sac, then stuck the pen in the ink and released the pressure to allow the sac to take up ink …..
    I just replied to a post about matchstick fillers where a fake match stick pokes out from the end of the cap. There are some early short
    Crocker Blow Fillers which are the polar... or... anatomical opposite, where a little hollow appendage sticks out of the bottom. As Lauren Bacall said to Bogey... "You just put your lips together and blow". Yikes! Not so sexy when you consider that you are doing all of this mouthwork alone to the rear end of a fountain pen with the nib submerged in an ink bottle. Boy, up close and personal!

    Crocker moves on to add a mechanical mouth, as it were, and the Chilton Pneumatic filler is born. With improved materials technology, Sheaffer's is able to revive this concept years later as the reliable and user-friendly Touchdown, where synthetic rubber seals and o-rings replace waxed string and inky lips.

    Bob
    Last edited by Seattleite; June 24th, 2022 at 01:32 PM.

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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    Coincidentally, Brian Anderson discussed filling systems, mostly with examples from his collection, with our very own Eric in these videos:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWeRM_ZhLb0 (starts around 11 minutes): cartridge converter, piston, vacumatic, aerometric, snorkel, touchdown, vac, bulb, switch, push-knob, twist.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0r0j822vgBA (starts around 9 minutes, except syringe/Ford @4:15): eyedropper (including trench, safety, ink shutoff variations), lever, reverse lever, snap-fil, button, coin, matchstick, crescent, hump, saddle, twist, plunger, sleeve, thumb, blow, simplicity, 'staple', Dr Faber's self-filler, capillary.

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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    My head is spinning, but in a good way. Great idea for a thread.
    My other pen is a Montblanc.

    And my other blog is a tumblr!

    My eBooks. Because why not.

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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    Sheaffer used five that I know of:

    Lever/sac, piston/vac, Touchdown, Snorkel, and cartridge.

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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    In my opinion many filling systems can be lumped into one category. For example, lever fillers, coin fillers, crescent fillers, hatchet fillers and matchstick fillers are all essentially the same from a mechanistic perspective - a means to depress an internal sac. Piston fillers and converters are also the same in operation. Minor differences exist but not significant enough to warrant a separate category.
    There is no subject so old that something new cannot be said about it.

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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    Quote Originally Posted by catbert View Post
    Coincidentally, Brian Anderson discussed filling systems, mostly with examples from his collection, with our very own Eric in these videos:
    Thanks. I watched them both with great interest. Initially to see what "our very own Eric" looks like and that he's alive and well.
    Regards, Chrissy | My Blog: inkyfountainpens

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    Default Re: Pen Filling Systems

    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_of_Clouds View Post
    In my opinion many filling systems can be lumped into one category. For example, lever fillers, coin fillers, crescent fillers, hatchet fillers and matchstick fillers are all essentially the same from a mechanistic perspective - a means to depress an internal sac. Piston fillers and converters are also the same in operation. Minor differences exist but not significant enough to warrant a separate category.
    One could think of the different filling systems in taxonomic terms, branching out from broader categories — e.g. from an ink-carrying perspective whether the ink fills the barrel or some inner reservoir, flexible or not, whether the reservoir is filled via an internal mechanism or not, and then how the mechanism operates upon the reservoir. A variant of direct sac compression would be snorkels, touchdowns, etc. that depress the sac using air pressure. Converters might be seen as a removable form of some other filling system, whether sac-squeeze, piston or pump. (I would like to see a bulk-filler converter.) And so on.

    In general, I suspect the hair-splitting was in part to avoid other makers' patents and in part to create marketing advantages, as witness the many variations on a theme listed here:

    Over 100 variations of fountain pen filling systems

    I wouldn't be surprised to learn of the existence of a hair-splitter filler.

    This is not to dismiss the role of improvement and innovation, of course.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chrissy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by catbert View Post
    Coincidentally, Brian Anderson discussed filling systems, mostly with examples from his collection, with our very own Eric in these videos:
    Thanks. I watched them both with great interest. Initially to see what "our very own Eric" looks like and that he's alive and well.
    He's been appearing in Anderson videos for quite a while.
    Last edited by catbert; June 25th, 2022 at 08:51 AM.

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