[RESOLVED] Negative experience with Tommy Ly

[KrazyIvan]

A while ago I bought a vintage Conway Stewart from Tommy Ly, who is clearly active in restoring many pens. It wasn't drawing ink properly, so I sent it back and he offered to let me exchange for another pen of similar value, in this case a Pelikan. This quickly turned out to leak large amounts of ink at random times. He and I agreed that I would try for a little while to pinpoint where the leak was coming from, and that he would refund me if necessary. But I couldn't find the problem and made a number of messes. I've emailed him several times over the last several months to ask for the refund he promised, but he does not even respond, even though it's clear from his website that he's active, selling additional pens.

This is the first negative review I've ever left.

kwahoo

[Edit: Admin note] View Tommy's first of several responses beginning with post #5. -dannzeman

1. The Conway Stewart that you sent back is drawing ink up fine, so if that was your problem when there isn't one I should've never offered to let you trade for another pen.
2. You stated that it was leaky, but now you say it's not drawing ink up. Liars often don't remember their own lies, but that's fine.
3. I offered to trade a pen for the supposedly problematic Conway Stewart or a refund. You had your eye on a Pelikan 140, and I said we can do an even trade.
4. You tell me the Pelikan 140 you got is also leaking, but I have tested it before sending it to you because you claim the first pen was problematic, and I didn't want to leave it to chance that the next pen will also give you trouble.

Sorry but when I was testing the pen before selling it it didn't have any leaking issues. It actually didn't have any issues at all. While my girlfriend was reading this rant of yours because she's curious, I was playing around with the Conway Stewart that you returned. It draws and expels ink fine with no problems(what do ya know huh). I completely ignored your emails after a while because to be honest I don't have time to deal with false problems while you get your whirl trying all kinds of vintage pens. I have many happy customers and many happy repeat customers. If I can't fix a pen I throw it in the parts bin instead of selling it like there is nothing wrong with it. You can go make all the claims you want about me, but if I didn't honestly think you were pulling my leg telling me every pen has problems can you trade it in for another I would actually take you seriously. But I don't because of my stated reasons.

I've refunded a few people because of various reasons. Some because the package got lost during an international shipment, and one or two where they were not satisfied. Not because the pen was leaking or it didn't work, but because what I consider a Fine they consider an XF or something similar where it is subjective, and I say no problem, mail me the pen back, and as soon as I get it back I'll refund on paypal. Which I do. But I CHOSE to ignore your emails and your threats because I have reason to believe you're just wasting my time while getting a kick out of trying all these wonderful vintage pens.

I'm glad to finally be able to discuss this with you, even if it had to be in a public forum. As for the Conway, you are mis-stating the issue. The problem was that that the ink feed is erratic. It filled fine and had good capacity, judging from what was expelled. The problem was that it writes for a little while, then stops feeding. I give it a firm shake and it writes a little while longer, then stops again. My wife observed the problem too. The problem was clearly explained in our emails. How long have you tried writing with it to verify that? You told me, when I reported the problem, that "you wrote a few sentences with and it seemed good, so I didn't quite catch that problem." If you tested it more extensively and couldn't reproduce the problem, why didn't you contact me?

As for the Pelikan, the leaking is erratic. That's what makes it hard to pin down. Writes fine for a couple days, then suddenly I find a puddle of ink. Would you like me to show you the mess it made in my pen tray, which left a permanent stain? Wish I could also show you the mess in my briefcase, but fortunately it was black ink in a black bag, and I didn't lose too many papers. But why did you tell me, when I reported the problem, to keep using the pen and you would help me troubleshoot, and that you would refund me if we couldn't solve the problem? I admit I was late in following up, but that seems no reason to stop responding or fail to honor what you told me.

I've been collecting pens for 10 years, and always had good relationships with sellers. I'm sure you're diligent, and I understand that with your volume, you might not be able to write with pens extensively enough to find these kinds of intermittent problems. But you represent them as working, and as a user, I need them to actually be usable. I wish we could have worked this out in a more amicable way.

I'm happy to let the forum opine on the best way to resolve this.

kwahoo

The OP is contradicting him/her self.

[kwahoo]

The OP is contradicting him/her self.

As I said earlier, I was not precise enough in describing the problem in my initial post. I do apologize! Here is how I described it to Tommy when I reported the problem a few days after I got it. "I got the pen, but I regret to report that there is a problem. The ink is not flowing; I suppose there must be something wrong with the feed." I'll also point out that I flushed and refilled the pen several times. If Tommy indeed tests it for a longer writing test, and encounters no problem, I can only imagine that it is an ink issue. I was using Diamine Rustic Brown.

I am dismayed that my honesty is being impugned. Except for my imprecision above, I think I've described the situation factually and acted reasonably. It's not ideal that I spent so much time holding on to the Pelikan, hoping to figure out the problem. Intermittent problems are hard to pin down! I guess I should have demanded a refund immediately instead of trying to be helpful. In any case, if Tommy had simply said I took too long, I surely would have been unhappy, but that would have been defensible. Cutting off contact abruptly after saying he would refund me if necessary on the Pelikan doesn't seem like a good way to handle things.

I wanted a Conway Stewart in that style so badly that I would never have returned it unless it had a major flaw. Unfortunately, I have no video, etc. to prove my problems, so I suppose that is another lesson for me. I do wish Tommy had reported that he couldn't reproduce the problem, and I could have described more what I observed. As for the Pelikan, I can show pictures of the stain it left in one of its leaking episodes, as well as a picture of the pen currently in a zip-lock with more ink that has leaked out.

It seems clear that I'm not going to get this resolved to my satisfaction, and I'm disappointed to have had such a negative experience. But I'm glad that I have at least had a chance to state my concerns and find out why the communication inexplicably stopped.

/K

[Laura N]

[QUOTE=kwahoo;44114]

...As for the Pelikan, the leaking is erratic. That's what makes it hard to pin down. Writes fine for a couple days, then suddenly I find a puddle of ink. Would you like me to show you the mess it made in my pen tray, which left a permanent stain? Wish I could also show you the mess in my briefcase, but fortunately it was black ink in a black bag, and I didn't lose too many papers. But why did you tell me, when I reported the problem, to keep using the pen and you would help me troubleshoot, and that you would refund me if we couldn't solve the problem? I admit I was late in following up, but that seems no reason to stop responding or fail to honor what you told me....

I bought the Conway on 12/31 and reported the problem on 1/5. Bought the Pelikan on 2/15 and reported that problem on Mar. 24 (I was traveling a lot in the meantime). You would have been justified in saying that one was too long in between, and I appreciate that you were initially helpful. I confess I then took a long time to try it off and on.

/K

It kind of sounds like your Pelikan might have an issue with the piston seal. That happened to me once, and it was intermittent. I'm sure any competent repair person could fix it for you for a reasonable price.

With my Pelikan, I told the seller of the leakage issue long after I had bought the pen -- perhaps as much as a year later. His response was to apologize and fix it for me. That kind of service is exemplary, and I was surprised, but it turns out that he offers a multi-year guaranty. As a result, he's a seller I recommend to everyone.

As a contra-example, I once bought a Parker vac filler at a pen show. When it started to leak a few months later, I didn't even consider trying to track down the seller. I sent it to a repair person and paid to have it fixed. But I don't have any bad feelings about the seller; the pen worked when he sold it.

In your case, it was almost a month after you got the Pelikan that you first reported an issue. And now it's four months after that. I don't doubt your story at all. But ... that's a long time to expect any seller to fix your pen. Did he offer such a long guaranty? Because in a sense, one deals with the seller one chooses. Some sellers have exemplary service and long guarantees, like my Pelikan dealer. But you will pay more on the front end for that. In contrast, with most sellers, the buyer has a short period to examine the pen and accept its condition. And that's reasonable. Every transaction has to end at some point.

[tandaina]

Piston seal leakage can be very hit and miss. Just because it worked when the seller tested does not mean it didn't have a failing seal and to just assume the buyer is lying and seller is telling the truth because in one test it didn't leak is problematic.

I just bought an old Matador pen. Seller swore up and down it was working. He'd inked it! But if you turned the pen nib up and let it sit. Slowly ink seeeeped out the back. Seal was going, slowly and quietly. Didn't show up in a quick ink test. Fortunately instead of being combative and accusing the seller scratched his head and said "we'll get it fixed." Seal was replaced at seller's expense and what do you know, the pen no longer leaks. I totally believe the seller that pen was "working" when he tested it. The problem is that doesn't actually rule out all trouble. Been there, seen that.

Time is a factor. I would never expect a seller to repair a pen I'd had for more than a week or two. After that its an old pen and ah well, that's life.

[kwahoo]

These are very fair comments (and helpful too regarding a potential reason for the Pelikan leak). I was very happy that Tommy was so helpful with the first pen, and very pleasantly surprised that he was initially very helpful with the second pen (the Pelikan) despite the delay. What pushed me over the edge was that after promising a refund if necessary, he simply ignored my email when I said I was giving up trying to find the problem and requested a refund, and ignored my follow-up emails, without saying why or relating his inability to reproduce my problem with the CS. And it was clear to me that he was ignoring me, since there was plenty of activity on his blog.

I appreciate the opportunity this forum has provided, and everyone's useful comments. It has allowed me to see things from the seller's perspective, and I do understand why he would be skeptical if he wasn't able to reproduce the problem on the CS, but I hope he also sees - from my perspective - why I resorted to this forum. In any case, I suppose at this point I'll see about getting the pen repaired. I have a couple others that need repairs too that I can't do myself.

/K

[pokermon919]

You know what Kevin. I'll give you a full refund if you still want to return the pen. I still stand by what I said that the CS 84 didn't have any problems, and that is what made me skeptical about the Pelikan. Also the fact that you waited months to tell me there was a problem with it. Many vintage pen sellers would not take a refund even after a few weeks. PM me for my address, and once I refund you we can both go on our merry ways.

[kwahoo]

You know what Kevin. I'll give you a full refund if you still want to return the pen. I still stand by what I said that the CS 84 didn't have any problems, and that is what made me skeptical about the Pelikan. Also the fact that you waited months to tell me there was a problem with it. Many vintage pen sellers would not take a refund even after a few weeks. PM me for my address, and once I refund you we can both go on our merry ways.

Thanks so much. I do recognize that many sellers would not have offered a refund. I really do appreciate it.

/K

[heraclitus682]

Shouldn't the title of this thread be edited at this point?

[pokermon919]

Got the pen back, sent you a pm, and waiting for your paypal account info. You really should've wipe the ink off the pen before sending it to me instead of letting it sit in a bag with ink. The ink has stripped some of the plating off the cap band. And what the hell happened to the piston? It's totally seized. Luckily I was able to take it apart and gave it a thorough cleaning. The piston seal seems fine, and after giving it a bit of silicone grease I can't find a leak. I'll let it sit longer with ink for a few more days to see if the seal is busted or not. Anyway, I'm waiting on your info Kevin to refund you.

[Penne Stilografiche]

What a shame to see the good name of a seller get tarnished like this. I agree with heraclitus682, the title of this thread should get changed.

Although I do not agree with the FPN's "no naming or shaming" policy, this type of scenario is probably one of the reasons why that rule was made.

-Vincenzo

[drgoretex]

Big thanks to the mgt. for altering the title.

Ken

[kwahoo]

I see the title was changed before I could get to it, thanks. I have received the refund. Thanks again.
/K

[kwahoo]

Got the pen back, sent you a pm, and waiting for your paypal account info. You really should've wipe the ink off the pen before sending it to me instead of letting it sit in a bag with ink. The ink has stripped some of the plating off the cap band. And what the hell happened to the piston? It's totally seized. Luckily I was able to take it apart and gave it a thorough cleaning. The piston seal seems fine, and after giving it a bit of silicone grease I can't find a leak. I'll let it sit longer with ink for a few more days to see if the seal is busted or not. Anyway, I'm waiting on your info Kevin to refund you.

Thanks for the refund.

For the record, I did clean it after its last leaking episode, but clearly forgot to flush it, which I agree was stupid. I do apologize. The piston worked fine when I last filled it. When I sent it in, I did not notice any more ink had leaked out. I admit I did not inspect it closely. It sat in a plastic bag for quite a long time while I was trying to get you to reply to me! I can't say whether the staining happened then or on a previous leaking episode, when I discovered a big inky mess in my pen tray.

I don't know if the stain/stripping was my fault, but I am happy to return whatever amount compensates you for the reduced resale value.

/K