Trump indicted

[TSherbs]

Charges under seal so far.

[dneal]

"WE'VE GOT HIM NOW!!!"

[Chip]

[Chuck Naill]

"The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice" MLK

It was the grand jury which brought to indictment, not one person working alone.

And, what we now know is that he would not be able to shoot someone in Times Square and get away with it.

[dneal]

If Trump gets re-elected, thank Alvin Bragg for trumping up a misdemeanor (that is past the statute of limitations) into a felony, using a convicted perjurer as a key witness.

-edit-

You guys missed this op-ed.

WashPost: The Trump indictment is a poor test case for prosecuting a former president

[Chuck Naill]

The problem is that Mr. Trump more resembles Al Capone than Abraham Lincoln.

There is precedent however...LOL!!
"When he was stopped by West, the Star said, Grant “was driving a pair of fast steppers and he had some difficulty in halting them, but this he managed to do”.

The president asked: “Well, officer. What do you want with me?”

Like Bragg, William H West, was also an African American and additionally a CW Veteran.
West said: “I want to inform you, Mr President, that you are violating the law by speeding along this street. Your fast driving, sir, has set the example for a lot of other gentlemen.”

Grant said sorry and left. The next day, however, he did it again.

According to the Star, Grant smiled like “a schoolboy who had been caught in a guilty act by a teacher” and said he had not been aware he was traveling too fast.

West said: “I am very sorry, Mr President, to have to do it, for you are the chief of the nation, and I am nothing but a policeman, but duty is duty, sir, and I will have to place you under arrest.”


Grant was taken to a police station and ordered to pay $20. A trial was held the next day, with numerous cases against speeding drivers “contested bitterly”. A judge issued heavy fines and a “scathing rebuke”.

Grant, however, did not show up."


https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...drawn-carriage

[724Seney]

The insanely moronic Stooge brothers are so "woke," they are sound asleep at the switch.
In spite of their collective glee, most people, to include many thoughtful persons on the left, see what has transpired as one of America's darkest days.
The door trying to keep the weaponization of our legal system has now been blown wide open and what is going to follow is not good.
Forget about Russia and China folks.....WE have become our own worst enemies.

[TSherbs]

And, what we now know is that he would not be able to shoot someone in Times Square and get away with it.

That'd be nice, but I am not convinced yet that this will happen. I suppose that I will only believe it when I see it. I hope so, though. I can't wait until the media circus on Tuesday <eyeroll>. I have come to hedge all bets around Trump. I heard that a grand jury has to individually sign off on each and every count of a case. If there are 30+ counts, then I trust that they took their time and look at all the evidence presented to them so far and determined "probable cause" 30+ times. Yikes.

So, tried for impeachment twice, and now indicted. At some point you'd think that the effort to spin this as Trump being victimized would wear thin. But Trump is a master of spin and manipulation, so maybe we have not seen the limits of his power in this regard. Yet.

[dneal]

At some point you'd think that the effort to spin this as Trump being victimized would wear thin.

The WashPost is spinning this? Alan Dershowitz is spinning this?

They'll of course now be plastered as "alt-right", by the fringe left who consider themselves objective centrists.

[Chuck Naill]

At some point you'd think that the effort to spin this as Trump being victimized would wear thin.

The WashPost is spinning this? Alan Dershowitz is spinning this?

They'll of course now be plastered as "alt-right", by the fringe left who consider themselves objective centrists.

Just asking, is there anything Trump has done, that you've known about from your reading, that you feel he does not bear some sense of being held responsible? Pick your favorite infraction. Would you tolerate Trump's behavior if it was one of us doing it?

[Chuck Naill]

Some have suggested that Mr. Bragg should focus on more important matters. Do any of those more important matters have the capability of harming American democracy?

I guess for me, the question is, is anyone above the law. If you say yes, who?

[Chuck Naill]

From his niece, https://www.newsweek.com/mary-trump-...ctment-1791750

I read her first book.

[TSherbs]

Some have suggested that Mr. Bragg should focus on more important matters. Do any of those more important matters have the capability of harming American democracy?

I guess for me, the question is, is anyone above the law. If you say yes, who?

Trump deserves everything he gets. He drives a trailer loaded with the transgressions of his past, his denials and lies, labeled clearly on the side with a big "I dare you to do anything about it" unfurled on a banner above it all, pays lawyers and other toadies to manage the shit that falls off and take the blame for him. You gotta kinda think he deserves being told by DAs that they're tired of having to deal with all the suits and damages from the fallout from his behaviors and decisions. He's a crass, huckster Ozymandias, and the sands are encroaching on his palace grounds.

[724Seney]

Some have suggested that Mr. Bragg should focus on more important matters. Do any of those more important matters have the capability of harming American democracy?

I guess for me, the question is, is anyone above the law. If you say yes, who?

Trump deserves everything he gets. He drives a trailer loaded with the transgressions of his past, his denials and lies, labeled clearly on the side with a big "I dare you to do anything about it" unfurled on a banner above it all, pays lawyers and other toadies to manage the shit that falls off and take the blame for him. You gotta kinda think he deserves being told by DAs that they're tired of having to deal with all the suits and damages from the fallout from his behaviors and decisions. He's a crass, huckster Ozymandias, and the sands are encroaching on his palace grounds.

Substitute the word Biden or any of a number of others. The validity of the rant remains the same.
And now they, too, will all be indicted.
What a waste of people's time and taxpayer resources.

[dneal]

At some point you'd think that the effort to spin this as Trump being victimized would wear thin.

The WashPost is spinning this? Alan Dershowitz is spinning this?

They'll of course now be plastered as "alt-right", by the fringe left who consider themselves objective centrists.

Just asking, is there anything Trump has done, that you've known about from your reading, that you feel he does not bear some sense of being held responsible? Pick your favorite infraction. Would you tolerate Trump's behavior if it was one of us doing it?

I see lots of accusations. I see little evidence. My surprise remains that no one has successfully prosecuted him yet.

It's no small feat that he survived Mueller. That was Andrew Weissman - one of the most vicious and unethical prosecutors we've ever had. He basically had carte blanche to look at anything - and Trump survived that with "although we can't exonerate him..." as the most damning statement.

If he was gonna get got, that was the guy who should have been able to do it, but he didn't. Amazing.

I spent some time wondering what the explanation for that was, and recently I think I stumbled across it.

There's a really bright and interesting young woman who recently published a two-volume work on corruption. 1000 pages of research. I haven't finished it yet, but it mentions Roy Cohn. Wikipedia has a decent article with his general history. He was a prosecutor that was McCarthy's chief counsel (rooting out communists, etc...). He went on to be a New York "fixer" (introductions, whose hand to grease, etc...).

He reportedly mentored Trump, and definitely represented him legally. Cohn is the type of guy who would know every possible way the government could get you (see: 3 felonies a day, or "show me the guy and I'll show you the crime"). It's not a far stretch that Trump learned what to do and what not to do (or how to not get caught), and learned that lesson well, apparently.

I generally view Trump with disdain. I agree with his many of his policies, and think he has the capital to get them done. I hope he wins in 24 just because the shit-show would be fun to watch, and it wouldn't be the end of the world, or country, or anything else the chicken-little media would scream. Other than that, he's not my first choice.

So when I see the hard evidence (like Hunter's laptop), I'll start listening to all the crimes Trump supposedly committed.

I mention the laptop not because of "whataboutism", but because it's the obvious example of what people see as a double-standard.

This mess will make media companies some money in advertising, and watching Trump perp-walk in a jumpsuit is a train-wreck no one could turn away from; but it's going to blow up in the left's face.

Just as amazed as I am that Mueller/Weissman didn't get Trump; I'm even more amazed at this NYC DA stunt. It's colossally stupid. Still, some folks lap up the drama.

[Chip]

I think it's a good start to holding the man responsible for his crimes.

First, it took place before he became president, so any presumed executive immunity does not apply.

Second, it was committed to suppress facts, pervert the election, and get him into office.

Third, his accomplice (Cohen) has been duly tried and convicted of the crime in question, and has testified against Trump, whose company has already been found guilty of financial crimes.

[Chuck Naill]

I think Mueller was in a novel legal quandary. Then, the AG came out with a narrative that benefitted the president.

If a “fixer” is able to exist, it says something about the system and who has the means to employ them. It’s not a mystery.

[724Seney]

I think it's a good start to holding the man responsible for his crimes. It was committed to suppress facts, pervert the election, and get him into office.

This thread is about Trump, not Biden.

[dneal]

I think Mueller was in a novel legal quandary. Then, the AG came out with a narrative that benefitted the president.

If a “fixer” is able to exist, it says something about the system and who has the means to employ them. It’s not a mystery.

Mueller demonstrated signs of cognitive decline. I'm disappointed that they used his name for political purposes.

Andrew Weissman was the lead. He's sharp and ruthless. The actual report did not accuse Trump of a crime, and no indictment resulted. The "we can't exonerate" was the report's language, not Barr's.

I agree that there is something wrong with the system. It's what I've been complaining about on near every topic. Fixers are just one part of it, like lobbyists.

Pretending that Trump is the first corrupt person in the public sphere is silly, as is pretending he's the most corrupt. Maybe he is, but he's better at hiding it.

Let's start with the low-hanging fruit, like the laptop and the unequivocally incriminating evidence on it. Did you read in the news that the Rep Gomar subpoenaed the bank records (the same SARs the Treasury Dept created), and there's the transactions from China directly to members of the Biden family? CNN said he did it quietly, but everybody else was interviewing him about it.

Bank transactions are evidence. Show me the same for Trump, and I'll entertain the accusations. Up until now, all I've seen are the Adam Schiff's giving press conferences of crimes and proof of Trump's guilt; which never materialize.

[Chuck Naill]

I haven’t heard anyone suggesting Trump is the first corrupt public servant. I can’t remember, but several Chicago governors were convicted. Spiro Agnew accepted a plea deal.

I don’t see him even trying to hide it. His taped phone call to Georgia wasn’t behind closed doors.

If I remember, no charges were levied because the subject was in fact a sitting president.

If Biden is guilty of something illegal, he should be held to the same standards as me and you.