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Thread: Is my first Estie a fake

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    Default Is my first Estie a fake

    I have just received my first Estie J model pen with a 2668 nib. It looks great and the nib is smooth as silk. The imprint is really clear and says 'Esterbrook' on one line, and 'Made in USA' on the line below. There is no 'R' trademark after the Esterbrook. Is this a fake? I don't really know much about the Esterbrook brand.

    Any advice would be appreciated, I'd be upset it it was, coz it looks great and writes like a dream. Cheers

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    Senior Member cwent2's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    http://esterbrook.net

    Here is a link to Brian Anderson's esterbrook page - there is a date where the R trademark starts - earlier pens did not have the "R" I do not know off hand what that date is/was.

    Hope this helps
    Cw



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    Senior Member tandaina's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    I've never heard of a fake Esterbrook! Who would fake such a cheap pen?

    (they are great, just seems like an odd thing to fake!)
    ---
    Current pen rotation: way too many!

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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    Nobody but an idiot would fake one of these, but then the world is full of idiots. These pens have some variations. This is one such. Old pens, production variations, stuff happens and happened more often in the olden days.

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    Senior Member Jon Szanto's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    You guys talk like you've never heard of faked Hero 616 pens!

    My take on this was a little different: it is a pen that - going now - costs in the $20 - $30 range, and Uncle Bud said it was a superb pen. At that point, who cares? A faked Montblanc could be a serious dent in either the outlay of cash, or an expected investment. In this case, you've got a good pen either way, and no one broke the piggy bank.

    Or something.

    Hell, I'm still trying to wrap my head around the fact that there were SJ Transitionals, something I hadn't heard about until 2 days ago!
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

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    Senior Member Lexaf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    Sure, Tandaina, who would clone an Estie? But they are probably the most beautiful and certainly one of the most reliable El Cheapo's ever made!

    I own several Esterbrook pens and I took 4 of them out of the closet to check for the R trademark:
    A early J model with one jewel (only at the cap) : imprint: Esterbrook - made in USA - no 'R'
    Two later J models with juwels on both ends: imprint: Esterbrook - made in USA - 'R'
    Another double jewel piece: Imprint: Esterbrook - Made in England - no 'R'

    So the appearance of the trademark R is probably only on the later double juwel J models (and later models), but not on the English made pieces.
    Besides that, I think the English J Esties are quite rare, but I have no reason to think they are fake. My (one and only) English Estie came from a very well reputed seller here in The Netherlands, is Virgin/N.O.S. ( the pen, not the seller ) and it (she?) still has its original silver colored 'cigar wrapper' around the cap. I can post a picture of it later, if you want.

    Of course the first Esterbrooks, the Relief series, were also made in England (by Conway Stuart) and before Esterbrook started to make fountain pens they already had a fine reputation as a manufacturer of high quality steel dip nibs.

    See for more info about Esterbrook here: http://www.esterbrook.net/index.shtml

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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    Quote Originally Posted by cwent2 View Post
    http://esterbrook.net

    Here is a link to Brian Anderson's esterbrook page - there is a date where the R trademark starts - earlier pens did not have the "R" I do not know off hand what that date is/was.

    Hope this helps
    Hi Cwent2, thanks for the link, reading the double jewel page, it would appear that the earliest models didn't have the registered trademark printed on them, so that answers my question. They are great little pens and they look really nice. Thanks again, Bud.

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    Senior Member pajaro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Szanto View Post
    You guys talk like you've never heard of faked Hero 616 pens!

    My take on this was a little different: it is a pen that - going now - costs in the $20 - $30 range, and Uncle Bud said it was a superb pen. At that point, who cares? A faked Montblanc could be a serious dent in either the outlay of cash, or an expected investment. In this case, you've got a good pen either way, and no one broke the piggy bank.

    Or something.

    Hell, I'm still trying to wrap my head around the fact that there were SJ Transitionals, something I hadn't heard about until 2 days ago!
    I was pretty stupefied to find an SJ with a lopped-off end. I would be more surprised by a fake Estie.

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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    I remember a discussion on the FPN Estie forum about a nib marked something like "Easterbook". I don;t remember if anyone had an "Easterbook" pen, but there might have been fakes. Of course, as mentioned above, if a pen looks like an Estie and writes beautifully, then be happy.

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    Junior Member johnmc2's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    I wouldn't call this a fake, as the Esterbrook name doesn't appear, but I would call it a copy. The clip has "DEER" and on the nib (friction fit) TAK-SANG and GLOBE & DEER. The sac has an interesting shape.




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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    Quote Originally Posted by tandaina View Post
    I've never heard of a fake Esterbrook! Who would fake such a cheap pen?

    (they are great, just seems like an odd thing to fake!)
    Nor have I, I imagine it could either be a misprint, or if the spacing is still there could have just worn down with age. But never heard of anyone faking a cheaper brand/pen, they're not exactly high margin grabbers like faking a Montblanc (where it may cost 50$ to 100$ to make the fake, but sells for 600-900$)

    Quote Originally Posted by johnmc2 View Post
    I wouldn't call this a fake, as the Esterbrook name doesn't appear, but I would call it a copy. The clip has "DEER" and on the nib (friction fit) TAK-SANG and GLOBE & DEER. The sac has an interesting shape.
    Interesting, looks like an aftermarket hack-job.

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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    I have an EESTERBROOK that is clearly intended to be a fake Esterbrook.

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    Senior Member Jon Szanto's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    Quote Originally Posted by Farmboy View Post
    I have an EESTERBROOK that is clearly intended to be a fake Esterbrook.
    You bought that from the Swedish chef, didn't you?
    "When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick;
    and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

    ~ Benjamin Franklin

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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    Quote Originally Posted by pajaro View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Szanto View Post
    You guys talk like you've never heard of faked Hero 616 pens!

    My take on this was a little different: it is a pen that - going now - costs in the $20 - $30 range, and Uncle Bud said it was a superb pen. At that point, who cares? A faked Montblanc could be a serious dent in either the outlay of cash, or an expected investment. In this case, you've got a good pen either way, and no one broke the piggy bank.

    Or something.

    Hell, I'm still trying to wrap my head around the fact that there were SJ Transitionals, something I hadn't heard about until 2 days ago!
    I was pretty stupefied to find an SJ with a lopped-off end. I would be more surprised by a fake Estie.

    I did not realize that I had an SJ transitional until I reorganized my collection with all the transitionals together. Lined them up and, huh the red one is shorter than the others. Drat, another category of pens to try to collect.

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    Senior Member Scrawler's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Bud View Post
    I have just received my first Estie J model pen with a 2668 nib. It looks great and the nib is smooth as silk. The imprint is really clear and says 'Esterbrook' on one line, and 'Made in USA' on the line below. There is no 'R' trademark after the Esterbrook. Is this a fake? I don't really know much about the Esterbrook brand.

    Any advice would be appreciated, I'd be upset it it was, coz it looks great and writes like a dream. Cheers
    In 1947 Esterbrook produced samples of what the 1948 J series run would look like. These prototypes are characterized by no (R) mark and screw in jewels.

  20. #16
    gregamckinney
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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    My "Back" pen is a pretty neat knock-off:




    Best Regards, greg

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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    Quote Originally Posted by Scrawler View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Bud View Post
    I have just received my first Estie J model pen with a 2668 nib. It looks great and the nib is smooth as silk. The imprint is really clear and says 'Esterbrook' on one line, and 'Made in USA' on the line below. There is no 'R' trademark after the Esterbrook. Is this a fake? I don't really know much about the Esterbrook brand.

    Any advice would be appreciated, I'd be upset it it was, coz it looks great and writes like a dream. Cheers
    In 1947 Esterbrook produced samples of what the 1948 J series run would look like. These prototypes are characterized by no (R) mark and screw in jewels.
    I have never heard the above mentioned version of the J series called a prototype. What evidence do we have for this suggestion?

    Farmboy

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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    Quote Originally Posted by Farmboy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrawler View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Bud View Post
    I have just received my first Estie J model pen with a 2668 nib. It looks great and the nib is smooth as silk. The imprint is really clear and says 'Esterbrook' on one line, and 'Made in USA' on the line below. There is no 'R' trademark after the Esterbrook. Is this a fake? I don't really know much about the Esterbrook brand.

    Any advice would be appreciated, I'd be upset it it was, coz it looks great and writes like a dream. Cheers
    In 1947 Esterbrook produced samples of what the 1948 J series run would look like. These prototypes are characterized by no (R) mark and screw in jewels.
    I have never heard the above mentioned version of the J series called a prototype. What evidence do we have for this suggestion?

    Farmboy
    "prototype" is definitely the wrong word, and just laziness on my part not to think of a better word for market exploration. This suggestion came out of a discussion and so is only really heresay. The argument presented to me was based on the short period and manufacturing cost saving design improvements, that all occurred in this short time.

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    Senior Member pajaro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is my first Estie a fake

    After perusing this thread, it occurs to me that this issue has been brought up before, with the conclusion that there is variation in Esterbrooks. Despite the knock-offs with other company labels, I haven't read of any bona fide occurences of fake Esterbrooks, so I think your first thought might be of production variation rather than of fakes.

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