Can I use super glue to seal a Lamy Vista's Rollerball barrel?

[Avastgard]

I am currently planning to convert a Lamy Vista to eyedropper fill. I have a Rollerball barrel that I will use for it, but I have tested plugging the vent holes in the bottom of the FP barrel first, since it's basically going to be put aside. I sealed the vent holes with a certain kind of super glue. It sealed well, but during the process some glue leaked into the inside of the barrel (it just made its way in a little bit). After the glue was dry, there was some kind of white residue inside (fumes?), and I'm guessing it happened because of the glue that leaked in. Would you guys agree? Do you think that superglue is a good sealant? Could it be weakened by the contact with the ink after some time?

[D Armstrong]

"Superglue" is usually a cyanoacrylate, which is basically an acrylic plastic dissolved in a quick-curing cyanide solvent. CA glues are not very water-resistant, so not a great choice for this application. A better choice would be an epoxy which is specifically formulated for high resistance to water. Most manufacturers produce them, but they aren't often carried in stores. Your best bet is to try an industrial plastics shop or someplace which specializes in gaskets and seals like o-rings. They usually have a mind-blowing selection of stuff that's good for playing with pens.

[LagNut]

I used a gel super glue to seal a twsbi 700 cap that broke at the threads. There is definitely a white fog that developed in the cap from the repair. Had to be fumes from the superglue.

Having had problems removing super glue from surfaces, I suspect it should work. The failure mode I'd suspect would be thermal - differential growth with heat or cold between the glue and the barrel material. I'd toss the barrel in the freezer overnight, then see if it still seals.

Let us know how this works out...

[LagNut]

D Armstrong,

Great info. We had to be posting at the same time.

OK, I got a tube of material made to form gaskets from a car parts store - looks like rtv on steroids. I'm wondering if this wouldn't be just the ticket. It's meant to be high strength, but it is not an epoxy, more an rtv.

At any rate, good info.

Mike

BTW, Astgard, if you're by San Jose CA, you're welcome to borrow the tube, as it will probably cure before I use it again...

Mike

[mhosea]

Most of the special features of the gasket-making RTV over ordinary RTV won't be needed here (e.g. high heat and oil resistance), but I think it will work. However, you won't want just enough to fill a little hole, rather a "plug" that sits in front of the hole. Getting this done neatly will take skill. If the hole is large enough (or you are willing to enlarge it), one strategy is to make a polypropylene disk (like a piece of Gladware) or whatever shape matches the inside of the barrel where you want it to rest Then you can press that into place with a dowel and back-fill behind through the hole. Pushing back on the disk until some of the silicone is extruded through the hole will remove the bubbles and fill any gaps around the edges of your polypropylene part. I've done this on a few vintage plunger and button fillers that otherwise would never have seen any use again, and it worked superbly--very neat results. My one attempt to achieve something like this by filling directly from the inside was...ahem...a mess. But maybe that's just because I suck.

I will say, however, that I'm not wild about eyedropper conversions. Unless the cartridge nipple is damaged, there are pros and cons to sort out. Large ink capacity beyond about 1.5-2ml tends to bring burping issues as the ink supply is depleted, barring a huge collector like that on a Preppy. So one copes by keeping the pen at least half full, or so. But if you must do that, what is the usable ink capacity?

Here's a trick for keeping silicone RTV around for awhile longer than usual (still can't keep it forever after opening). First of all, don't crack the cap by over-tightening. Second of all, seal the cap on with aluminum tape (for duct work).

[Avastgard]

Thanks for the help, guys! I'm just getting a little behind on the technical details. By what some of you said, I understand that RTV is that kind of silicone we use as a hydraulic sealant, right? I had considered using it before, but I think its viscosity might make the work really tough.

If the hole is large enough (or you are willing to enlarge it), one strategy is to make a polypropylene disk (like a piece of Gladware) or whatever shape matches the inside of the barrel where you want it to rest Then you can press that into place with a dowel and back-fill behind through the hole. Pushing back on the disk until some of the silicone is extruded through the hole will remove the bubbles and fill any gaps around the edges of your polypropylene part.

Your idea seems good, but I doubt it will work on a Lamy Vista. The inside of the barrel is just too complex (there are those ridges used to install the cartridge, making the crafting of a proper disc virtually impossible). Also, the vent holes themselves are not just any ordinary holes - they are opened to the sides rather than to the bottom of the barrel.

What if I tried pushing the silicone in from the outside to the inside? Do you think this could work?

[Tony Rex]

Short answer: I've tried this before, but I gave up in the end. I had thought it would've been a straight swap between the RB and FP barrels. That wasn't the case. Too many cons for my taste. YMMV

Long answer: The idea was to make an ED FP and RB Vista set by swapping the "ink-windowless" RB barrel with the FP's. Now on the FP front, section threads can be greased so no problem there, but iirc the breather hole needs to plugged. That shouldn't be a problem with epoxy (Again, you can't use CA they tend to be porous when dry plus the cloud!). Now we have a nice Vista ED. However, on the RB front you can't use the FP barrel because there are ridges that block the RB refill (hint: can be removed with a thin long chisel) otherwise it won't fit thus renders the RB unusable. A Vista RB cost $30 here, it's a bit too rich for me to proceed.

But do let us know how you go. Photos would be good too! Cheers.

[mhosea]

Thanks for the help, guys! I'm just getting a little behind on the technical details. By what some of you said, I understand that RTV is that kind of silicone we use as a hydraulic sealant, right? I had considered using it before, but I think its viscosity might make the work really tough.

Yes, but technically RTV is a generic term for any kind of "rubber" that Vulcanizes at Room Temperature. Silicone RTV comes in many formulations, with the sealant formulations being the most common.

I'm not really sure what the holes we're trying to plug look like. You confused me a little when talking about ridges to install a cartridge, since I thought we were talking about sealing the rollerball barrel. There is complexity back there to hold the rollerball refill, too, though, and there are ways to deal with it, but if you don't care about optimizing the performance of the pen, only about making it hold a lot of ink, then using epoxy to seal any little holes is far easier. In my case, I wanted a (technically) reversible solution with no more than about 1.5-2ml of ink capacity.

Sealing the window in the Lamy fountain pen barrel to make it an ED seems both faintly possible and unwise.

[Tony Rex]

I just made this as an alternative: http://fpgeeks.com/forum/showthread....ulb-Filler-Mod

Cheers.

[Avastgard]

You confused me a little when talking about ridges to install a cartridge, since I thought we were talking about sealing the rollerball barrel.

Yes, we are, but even the rollerball barrel has ridges, although they are shorter than the ones on the FP.

Sealing the window in the Lamy fountain pen barrel to make it an ED seems both faintly possible and unwise.

It's been done before, but it's far more work than I am willing to do. Plus, it would probably look horrible on a Vista.

I just got the epoxy glue today. I will attempt to convert this weekend and let you know of the results, but I am probably going to test it on a Jinhao 599 and a Hero 359 first (both are Safari Imitations with the same kind of vent holes in the barrel).